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Thread: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

  1. #1471
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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    CC -
    Completely false. It is behavior that causes HIV. Not a state of being
    Now, you're showing, CC. Ok, so if behavior, I assume you mean anal sex that causes HIV, and also too, the practice of unsafe sex; then my analysis is still 100% accurate. The "state of being" is only to identify the category. Why analyze data that places a conclusion on a group of people, if you're not going to identify who the group of people are?

    Not a state of being. One can be heterosexual or homosexual and be completely abstinent... and have 0% chance of contracting HIV from their sexual orientation. Orientation is irrelevant. Behavior IS relevant.
    Thanks for pointing out the blatantly obvious?

    True to some extent... if you are meaning that an individual experience can define the outcome
    No.. I mean you're sampling a large sample to make a more narrow conclusion. You cannot take a single narrow experience, and apply it to a broad sample. That's ridiculous!

    Correct. ALL the data... not just the data that helps your position
    Umm.. Yeah, this is what I have been saying?

    I said -
    Clearly homosexuals as a group are responsible for more than half the cases of HIV in the USA.
    You say -
    No. Homosexuals, as a group contract more than half the cases of HIV. Your wording is incorrect
    Huh?

    No. This statement contradicts the statement preceding it
    No.. Um, no it doesn't, not in the slightest!

    In the statement preceding it, you are discussing unsafe sexual activity... an accurate statement. You then make the leap from behavior to sexual orientation, which, as you have shown, is only a correlation, not a causation. In order to prove your premise, you would have to show that being gay CAUSES unsafe sex.
    I never made this conclusion, you just did! However, it also happens to be true according to my analysis; at least statistically.

    I don't think we need a thread. Your position has been debunked, logically. Unless you can show causation, you have nothing
    I don't need to show causation. I never made that claim. However, I also proved it in my analysis, you just missed it again for the first time.

    And I would add that you can't be asking me if I made the claim that homosexuality causes HIV? No one knows what causes HIV, if I did , I'd be rich beyond belief.


    Tim-
    Last edited by Hicup; 08-08-10 at 04:27 AM.
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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    CC -

    Now, you're showing, CC. Ok, so if behavior, I assume you mean anal sex that causes HIV, and also too, the practice of unsafe sex; then my analysis is still 100% accurate. The "state of being" is only to identify the category. Why analyze data that places a conclusion on a group of people, if you're not going to identify who the group of people are?


    Tim-
    Heterosexual people have just as much anal sex as homosexual people.
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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    Heterosexual people have just as much anal sex as homosexual people.
    They do? Wouldn't that kind of be a silly assumption? Since part of what constitutes a heterosexual is how they make love? LOL You can't be that serious? Were you joking with me?


    Tim-
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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    They do? Wouldn't that kind of be a silly assumption? Since part of what constitutes a heterosexual is how they make love? LOL You can't be that serious? Were you joking with me?


    Tim-
    What constitutes a heterosexual is who they are attracted too, not how they make love. If you are attracted to the opposite gender from which you identify yourself as your heterosexual, if you are attracted to the same, then you are homosexual, if you are attracted to both, then you are bisexual. Maybe you need to touch up on some basic sexual education before you continue with this discussion.
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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    What constitutes a heterosexual is who they are attracted too, not how they make love
    Baloney!

    If you are attracted to the opposite gender from which you identify yourself as your heterosexual, if you are attracted to the same, then you are homosexual, if you are attracted to both, then you are bisexual. Maybe you need to touch up on some basic sexual education before you continue with this discussion.
    Yeah but you said -
    Heterosexual people have just as much anal sex as homosexual people.
    So you bring in the act of sex, as a defining parameter for sexual orientation, and then now deny it has any bearing on your argument?

    Weak.. Actually it's not weak, it's pathetic as a rebutal.

    Tim-
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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    Baloney!



    Yeah but you said -

    So you bring in the act of sex, as a defining parameter for sexual orientation, and then now deny it has any bearing on your argument?

    Weak.. Actually it's not weak, it's pathetic as a rebutal.

    Tim-
    I never used it as a parameter for orientation. You stated that male homosexuals were more prone to HIV, the logic being that they have more anal sex. I stated that heterosexuals have just as much anal sex as homosexuals, so that logic if flawed. I never stated that sexual activity defines one's sexuality, so don't twist my words.

    The fact is, even if you don't want to see it, that one's orientation is determined by attraction, not activity. Or are you saying that heterosexual people that have anal sex are less hetero? Because that makes no sense.
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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    CC -

    Now, you're showing, CC. Ok, so if behavior, I assume you mean anal sex that causes HIV, and also too, the practice of unsafe sex; then my analysis is still 100% accurate.
    No, your analysis draws a conclusion from information that is unfounded. That is the problem with your analysis.

    The "state of being" is only to identify the category. Why analyze data that places a conclusion on a group of people, if you're not going to identify who the group of people are?
    Problem is that your analysis does not conclude what you are claiming. So categorizing it helps MY position. Now, if you want to do that, be my guest, but, based on how you have debated this issue, you're the one who needs help, not me.



    Thanks for pointing out the blatantly obvious?
    Good. So we agree. Orientation is irrelevant, behavior IS relevant. I appreciate the assistance, but I don't need it.



    No.. I mean you're sampling a large sample to make a more narrow conclusion. You cannot take a single narrow experience, and apply it to a broad sample. That's ridiculous!
    I'm not doing that. What you are doing is taking a sample and making an invalid conclusion with it.

    Umm.. Yeah, this is what I have been saying?
    No, it's not. You tried to eliminate data from lesbians... until you were called on it. You tried to make irrelevant data from heterosexuals... until you were called on it. You've been trying to manipulate statistics from the moment you started debating this issue.

    I said -

    You say -

    Huh?
    The difference is the word "responsible". That denotes cause. Either change the word, or you sentence is invalid, since you can't prove cause.

    No.. Um, no it doesn't, not in the slightest!
    Absolutely did, as I showed. Just saying "no it doesn't" is pretty weak debating.



    I never made this conclusion, you just did! However, it also happens to be true according to my analysis; at least statistically.
    Now you are just lying. Here are your words: 'Therefore it is reasonable, and in fact completely conclusive that homosexuals, as a group, are a risk factor in contracting HIV." Completely conclusive that homosexuals are a risk factor in contracting HIV. That indicates cause. And, you just said it again, contradicting yourself.

    So, once again, you have presented an invalid conclusion. Congratulations.



    I don't need to show causation. I never made that claim. However, I also proved it in my analysis, you just missed it again for the first time.
    I showed how you made the claim and how your analysis failed in it's attempt to prove it. As I have been saying. Go ahead, Hicup. Rebut... and please do it with something other than "nuh huh". I showed where you made the claim and I showed where your claim is invalid. Either show us SOMETHING or stand down.

    And I would add that you can't be asking me if I made the claim that homosexuality causes HIV? No one knows what causes HIV, if I did , I'd be rich beyond belief.
    So, then this statement is false: "Therefore it is reasonable, and in fact completely conclusive that homosexuals, as a group, are a risk factor in contracting HIV." Good to know.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


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    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    Baloney!
    Actually, she got it right. You are, again, showing your ignorance on the topic. One can be heterosexual without ever having sex.

    Yeah but you said -

    So you bring in the act of sex, as a defining parameter for sexual orientation, and then now deny it has any bearing on your argument?

    Weak.. Actually it's not weak, it's pathetic as a rebutal.

    Tim-
    No, she didn't say that. Your ability to understand the debate is seriously lacking. These were two different arguments, not the same one. Try to follow along.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  9. #1479
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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    I stated that heterosexuals have just as much anal sex as homosexuals, so that logic if flawed
    No, this statement is completely and utterly false. How can it possibly be true? Even if one were to ignore the blatantly obvious for a moment, homosexuas have a single choice for sexual intercourse, whereas heterosexuals have two. The law of averages alone would completely, and utterly refute your asssertion.

    I never stated that sexual activity defines one's sexuality, so don't twist my words.
    yes, but..ummm.. hmmm. Sexual activity is what is sampled in the HIV CDC sample, and it is designated by sexual orientation. Do you really not see this as relavant to my analysis?

    The fact is, even if you don't want to see it, that one's orientation is determined by attraction, not activity. Or are you saying that heterosexual people that have anal sex are less hetero? Because that makes no sense.
    The fact is that a homosexual, or a heterosexual that doesn't have sex, is rendered moot in my analysis, and I would also argue rendered moot in any meaningful debate on sexuality.


    Tim-
    “When buying and selling are controlled by legislation, the first things to be bought and sold are legislators.” - P. J. O’Rourke
    “Socialism is great until you run out of someone elses money” Margaret Thatcher

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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    They do? Wouldn't that kind of be a silly assumption? Since part of what constitutes a heterosexual is how they make love? LOL You can't be that serious? Were you joking with me?


    Tim-
    More evidence that you do not understand this debate or the issues that surround it. Sexual orientation is defined as such... by a few sources:

    The direction of one's sexual interest toward members of the same, opposite, or both sexes
    sexual orientation - Medical Definition
    Sexual orientation, sexual preference or sexual inclination describes the focus of a person's amorous or erotic desires, fantasies, and feelings.
    Sexual orientation - Definition
    The direction of one's sexual interest toward members of the same, opposite, or both sexes.
    sexual orientation: Definition from Answers.com
    Sexual orientation describes a pattern of emotional, romantic, and/or sexual attractions to men, women, both genders, neither gender, or another gender. Sexual orientation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    See? Your Star is correct. You are wrong. With your lack of understanding of this issue, I am starting to wonder if you are here to make the anti-GM side look ridiculous.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

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