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Thread: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

  1. #1171
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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    This is seriously beginning to look like baiting.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    Well is marriage in your opinion fundamental or isn't it? We already know that the law says it's between two people, but that's a substantive interpretation. You're logic essentially states that because the courts say so in Perez v Sharp it is so..

    Answer the question. Is marriage a fundamental right or isn't it?


    Tim-

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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    Irrelevant........
    you surprise me, friend

    the one person irreplaceable CA defined was as a matter of law of opposite sex

    the point---things change

    if the standard, one person (of opposite sex) irreplaceable, can be morphed down the road to gender neutrality, so can other things...

    and for substantially the same reasons

    think about it
    Last edited by The Prof; 08-05-10 at 07:10 PM.

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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    I respectfully disagree. If the government can pick and choose which marriages to give benefits to, then it has violated the 14th Amendment, and therefore it's business is not being conducted in a constitutional way.
    Actually, that's not entirely true, dana. The marriage contract, as it stands today, is a contract between two individual parties granting them joint power of attorney with one another. That contract can work between two people, reasonably, because there is an expected mutual designation of one another as THE spokesperson for the other in their absence (be that medical reasons, disappearance, or even death).

    The polygamous relationship guarantees that this mutual power of attorney benefit and designation of "most important person", so to speak, cannot happen. The closest thing we have to a workable contract for polygamists is a corporation contract. I am not opposed to letting them have this if they want. And no, I dont care if they call it a marriage either.

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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    Quote Originally Posted by BDBoop View Post
    This is seriously beginning to look like baiting.
    Please, I'm asking a question, what's your answer?

    Tim-
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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    Actually, that's not entirely true, dana. The marriage contract, as it stands today, is a contract between two individual parties granting them joint power of attorney with one another. That contract can work between two people, reasonably, because there is an expected mutual designation of one another as THE spokesperson for the other in their absence (be that medical reasons, disappearance, or even death).
    And that is stripping it down to the absolute bare essentials right there.
    Last edited by marduc; 08-05-10 at 07:15 PM.
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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    Well is marriage in your opinion fundamental or isn't it? We already know that the law says it's between two people, but that's a substantive interpretation. You're logic essentially states that because the courts say so in Perez v Sharp it is so..

    Answer the question. Is marriage a fundamental right or isn't it?


    Tim-
    I believe the courts have designated our right to contract to be fundamental. I confess not really knowing or caring whether it is fundamental or constitutional...nor can I make myself care enough to research the difference.

    My point is that there are basic differences between marriage and a polygamous relationship that are separate from gender issues. Namely, that when you involve more than two people, the joint power of attorney privileges become more and more complex and a heirarchy begins to takes shape. In this structure, it becomes a given that certain "partners" will fall lower and some will rise higher in the power structure, completely negating the mutual responsibility and decision making legal equality that a marriage insists.

    In essence, the contracted become members of a corporate structure rather than an unlimited partnership.
    Last edited by jallman; 08-05-10 at 07:20 PM.

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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    Here it is.

    You asking a question does not automatically entitle you to an answer. The more you repeat it, the less likely it is people are going to answer it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    Please, I'm asking a question, what's your answer?

    Tim-

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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    Quote Originally Posted by BDBoop View Post
    Here it is.

    You asking a question does not automatically entitle you to an answer. The more you repeat it, the less likely it is people are going to answer it.
    Then don't answer it? I don't care one iota?

    Tim-
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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    I believe the courts have designated our right to contract to be fundamental. I confess not really knowing or caring whether it is fundamental or constitutional...nor can I make myself care enough to research the difference.

    My point is that there are basic differences between marriage and a polygamous relationship that are separate from gender issues. Namely, that when you involve more than two people, the joint power of attorney privileges become more and more complex and a heirarchy begins to takes shape. In this structure, it becomes a given that certain "partners" will fall lower and some will rise higher in the power structure, completely negating the mutual responsibility and decision making legal equality that a marriage insists.

    In essence, the contracted become members of a corporate structure rather than an unlimited partnership.

    Thanks for the courtesy of the answer. I'm going to smoke a cig, but I'll be back.

    Tim-
    “When buying and selling are controlled by legislation, the first things to be bought and sold are legislators.” - P. J. O’Rourke
    “Socialism is great until you run out of someone elses money” Margaret Thatcher

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    Re: California gay marriage ban overturned: report

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    The only way to not abide by a SCOTUS decision is to amend the constitution, which is unlikely to pass either way. So it's kinda a nonquestion.
    Another way is to beat the issue like a dead horse...........
    "God Bless Our Troops in Harms Way."

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