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Thread: Britain Plans to Decentralize Health Care

  1. #61
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    Re: Britain Plans to Decentralize Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack
    Two obvious points...

    1-The pictures I posted are the societal norm for Cuba...a system which everyone holds out as desirable in the socialized health care realm whereas the pictures you depicted are 'events'.

    2-There is a world of difference even in the voluntarily provided and free (notice...people did it without government mandate) healthcare services you posted and the standard ops in Cuba.

    And the funny part is I bet you think you made a POINT by posting your pics. Well..you did...you made mine...
    Two obvious points...

    1-You haven't shown that the pictures you posted are the "societal norm for Cuba". You may right, they may very well be the norm, but a couple of pictures and your assertions doesn't prove that. I've read many articles from many different sources that say you are correct. I've also read many articles from many different sources that say you are incorrect. Who are these "everyone" that holds Cuba system as desirable, a few maybe, but I don't think "everyone". Enough isn't known.

    2-The turnout for the occasional "voluntarily provided and free" clinics show the enormous need of readily available and affordable healthcare for our citizens.

    I did make a POINT by showing how desperate our citizens are for healthcare, that they will stand all night in below freezing weather 'just to be seen' by a medical professional.


    Besides, the whole point of your photos was to wonder if people who thought that Cuba's system was so great, thought of the pictures you posted.

    The point of my photos was to wonder if people who thought our system was so great, thought of the photos that I posted.
    “We just simply don’t know how to govern” - Rep. Steve Womack (R-AR) a member of the House Budget Committee

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    Re: Britain Plans to Decentralize Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by BWG View Post
    Just because someone is a dirtbag doesn't mean they aren't in need of help.
    Sure they might be in need, but they sure as hell don't deserve it. Let the career criminals, abusers, rapists etc. rot.

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    Re: Britain Plans to Decentralize Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    For the excessive money we spend on healthcare, no one should be with ten points of us in any category.
    Says you?

    (character limit)

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    Re: Britain Plans to Decentralize Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter
    He is a dishonest debator, which is why I have him on ignore.
    Translation - He won't settle for my 'Because I Say So' as a rebuttal...LOL
    “We just simply don’t know how to govern” - Rep. Steve Womack (R-AR) a member of the House Budget Committee

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    Re: Britain Plans to Decentralize Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by BWG View Post
    Two obvious points...

    1-You haven't shown that the pictures you posted are the "societal norm for Cuba". You may right, they may very well be the norm, but a couple of pictures and your assertions doesn't prove that. I've read many articles from many different sources that say you are correct. I've also read many articles from many different sources that say you are incorrect. Who are these "everyone" that holds Cuba system as desirable, a few maybe, but I don't think "everyone". Enough isn't known.

    2-The turnout for the occasional "voluntarily provided and free" clinics show the enormous need of readily available and affordable healthcare for our citizens.

    I did make a POINT by showing how desperate our citizens are for healthcare, that they will stand all night in below freezing weather 'just to be seen' by a medical professional.


    Besides, the whole point of your photos was to wonder if people who thought that Cuba's system was so great, thought of the pictures you posted.

    The point of my photos was to wonder if people who thought our system was so great, thought of the photos that I posted.
    If I give you a link that shows the other side of Cuba would that count? therealcuba.com

    I guess 'everyone' is the liberals that swallowed Michael Moores syrupy goo without using their brains that maybe they shouldnt oughta be doin that!

    Those 'desperate people' can go to any publicly funded hospital in the country and get help. Period. And not in someones garage, nor piled up with a 100 person waiting list ALA Canadas walk-in clinics. Creating a universal healthcare system is going to be hugely expensive and its not going to help those people...if anything it will REINFORCE the tendency towards the crippled and dependent state they are currently in.
    Last edited by VanceMack; 07-27-10 at 06:10 PM.

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    Re: Britain Plans to Decentralize Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by BWG View Post
    Just because someone is a dirtbag doesn't mean they aren't in need of help.
    Enabling dirtbags and creating more social systems doesnt 'help' said dirtbag...

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    Re: Britain Plans to Decentralize Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    I never said it would.. so stop putting words in my mouth. The real question is how big part of the life expectancy statistic are they.. ball is in your court. While you are at it, find it for all countries so we can remove them there too. Also dont forget drinking and smoking habits and so on and so on.
    I'll start out by saying sorry that I can't source this anymore. I used to have a link directly to the study, but lost it when the website I stored it at was deleted.

    There was a statistical analysis done that I read about in the Sun Times about 2 years ago, in which they removed motor vehicle accidents and violent deaths (murders, etc) from the life expectancy statistics of every country. The result was that by removing these causes of death from all countries, the US was number one in life expectancy by a bit.

    In other words, using life expectancy to argue that one health care system is better than another doesn't quite work. Although, it will never stop some from trying their darndest to shoe-horn it in.

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    Re: Britain Plans to Decentralize Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Add in statistics for different diseases, and so on, and you can break down where the different health care systems are good and bad. That in turn has an impact on life expectancy much more than car wrecks.
    I'm not certain that the last sentence is quite true. The reason is that most diseases caused by eating fatty foods (CHF/ MI) or binge drinking (liver damage) are likely to kill someone when they are older, then a car accident or gun shot wound / stabbing, which is more likely to kill someone that is younger. Obviously, the death of a 16 year old has a greater impact on life expectancy than the death of a 60 year old due to cirrhosis.

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    Re: Britain Plans to Decentralize Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by Rightwingnutjob View Post
    Says you?

    (character limit)
    Yep, says me. Stand by it as well.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Britain Plans to Decentralize Health Care

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Boo...I do more work with all those categories than you can imagien. Im not without compassion...believe it or not. At the end of the day I take people at their word when they say their desire for government health care is because they believe it will eb the 'right thing'. My experience with government health care is that it is SOOOOO not healthy. It is the lowest levels of treatment. Our social services dont help. Period. People survive in the system...they do not thrive. And with VERY RARE exceptions they DO NOT GET OFF of the system unless they simply drop off the map and have NO services. Add to the dismal delivery the fact that the government has PROVEN they are incapable of running their own house, forget about a trillion dollar a year system.
    Right now, government health care amounts to people trying not to have it. This does effect efficiency. Perhaps if we quit playing games and simply tried to do it right things would be better.

    BTW, remember the VA hospital that was mostly privatized? As I recall, that got worse. Oh well, so much stereotypes.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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