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Thread: Changing Stance, Administration Now Defends Insurance Mandate as a Tax

  1. #91
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    Re: Changing Stance, Administration Now Defends Insurance Mandate as a Tax

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Ahh, so what you're doing is assuming that the family will reach their deductible limit every year. Ok then.

    How can a family in this situation be worse off because of the health care bill? They can elect to still not have health insurance and live exactly like they already live. The plan you're describing is still much more forgiving than any plan they'd have now, previously they'd be paying that extra $9081 themselves.



    This bill is most definitely not socialized medicine.
    A family that doesn't meet their deductible means they don't have doctor bills and aren't a burden on society anyway.

    Even if they don't meet their deductible, they still have to pay their share of the premium and foot the bill for the subsidy until getting part of it back the next year. They will also have to pay out of pocket up to the deductible.

    They may not be any worse off if they don't buy insurance, but they sure as hell aren't any better off are they ???

    How many millions of families will be in this situation ??? This bill relies on almost 100% participation to control costs. Instead there will be millions of families like the one in my example, plus millions of young people that choose to pay the penalty rather than buy insurance. Costs for insurance will skyrocket.

    This bill is a "charlie foxtrot" waiting to happen.
    Last edited by Gill; 07-21-10 at 09:00 AM.

    • "The America Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money." -- Alexis de Tocqueville





  2. #92
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    Re: Changing Stance, Administration Now Defends Insurance Mandate as a Tax

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Just like everyone gives Bush too much credit...I think you are giving Obama too much...all he did was signed that piece of **** that the house and senate rammed down everyones throat.
    I think he had a little more to do with it than just signing it. There's a year's worth of more... he wanted it, he pushed for it, he gave it over to Congress who mucked with it and turned it into a pile of crap, and then since he had over a year's worth invested, he HAD to sign it. Obama enabled the house and senate to ram it down everyone's throats.
    “I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on what’s being proposed here, he’d agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute.” - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


  3. #93
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    Re: Changing Stance, Administration Now Defends Insurance Mandate as a Tax

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    Obama enabled the (democratic majority) house and senate to ram it down everyone's throats. enact a bill over the period of more than a year in the usual manner in which our representation works.
    Fixed that for you. Conservatives call anything they don't like "rammed down our throats." What's this freudian obsession with that phrase anyway?
    The public was well in favor of this bill until the GOP spin machine told them it was going to pull the plug on grandma. Even now, when people have the bill's provisions actually explained to them, the bill is favored by a solid majority of the country.

    It fixes a few of the serious problems our citizens have with access to healthcare. Most of us will still be getting the exact same health plan from the exact same company going to the exact same doctor.
    Last edited by Deuce; 07-21-10 at 11:30 AM.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

  4. #94
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    Re: Changing Stance, Administration Now Defends Insurance Mandate as a Tax

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Fixed that for you. Conservatives call anything they don't like "rammed down our throats." What's this freudian obsession with that phrase anyway?
    The public was well in favor of this bill until the GOP spin machine told them it was going to pull the plug on grandma. Even now, when people have the bill's provisions actually explained to them, the bill is favored by a solid majority of the country.

    It fixes a few of the serious problems our citizens have with access to healthcare. Most of us will still be getting the exact same health plan from the exact same company going to the exact same doctor.
    The GOP spin machine ????

    If the Dems had given the public time to actually read the bill before ramming it down our throats, there would have been widespread opposition before it passed.

    • "The America Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money." -- Alexis de Tocqueville





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    Re: Changing Stance, Administration Now Defends Insurance Mandate as a Tax

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Fixed that for you. Conservatives call anything they don't like "rammed down our throats." What's this freudian obsession with that phrase anyway?
    It has to do with being force fed - intimating a person may not be eating or may be on a hunger strike where others then must force feed them something they do not want. Not sure about it being freudian.

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    The public was well never in favor of this bill until the GOP spin machine told them the public it was going to pull the plug on grandma increase their taxes, drive doctors out of medicine, lower quality of medical care, and would INCREASE the deficit.
    There - I fixed it for you. That's accurate and actually - the GOP was right.


    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Even now, when people have the bill's provisions actually explained to them, the bill is favored by a solid majority of the country.
    Source ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    It fixes a few of the serious problems our citizens have with access to healthcare. Most of us will still be getting the exact same health plan from the exact same company going to the exact same doctor.
    Yeah... that's not entirely true is it. Higher costs (per CBO), restrictive networks, and now a tax, and the doctors? Yeah, well... you probably won't keep your doctor unless they're in the restrictive networks. If they're not in network, you're on your own. And let's face it... before his law goes into full effect, there's a chance it won't be funded or will be shelved for years, will be re-written or something else... especially if Congress has a power shift in 2010. Maybe now that Berwick is in, he'll be able to redistribute health care... wealth... err.. money... whatever.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/18/bu.../18choice.html

    Let's go to the people to see how they are supporting healthcare:

    52% expect costs to increase
    17% expect costs to go down
    17% expect costs to remain the same
    56% favor repeal
    38% oppose repeal
    “I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on what’s being proposed here, he’d agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute.” - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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