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Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Finds

Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

I see your edit. You want me to state that conservatives also commit cimes?


Well duh...... :roll:


:lamo

No, I'm looking for someone to admit that 92% of felons in Minnesota being liberal is an absurd idea, and also that prison does not magically convert people to liberalism.

edit: or you can keep playing word games. Whichever you like.
 
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Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

So are you more concerned with this specific race or with the voting fraud that was perpetrated on the people of Minnesota? Convicted felons being able to vote is a problem - no matter who they vote for. Franken won because of voting fraud. If you think that the felons would actually vote for the conservative candidate, you simply aren't thinking.

Altouhg most conservatives would like to see Franken thrown out and replaced with the real winner of the election, this isn't going to happen. What I want to see is voter fraud prosecuted to the fullest extent - no matter who commits it. The integrity of an election must remain in tact and when things like this are allowed to happen, the people lose, not the candidates.

Amen! If Franken and the Dems are behind it all, prosecute them to the fullest extent of the law!

However, you should probably consider removing your post. Given the raging partisanship of this thread thus far, your common sense and penchant for intelligent discourse has no place here, methinks.
Well, hold on now Singularity. If the opposite had happened and Coleman won the exact way that Franken did and this came out, dependant on credibility I would feel the same way. The credibility argument only because I as many others have seen some dirty journalistic/political group tactics in the past. I feel that the candidate that wins gets seated whether or not I like them as long as it was a legitimate win. Hugh is exactly right here.
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

No, I'm looking for someone to admit that 92% of felons in Minnesota being liberal is an absurd idea, and also that prison does not magically convert people to liberalism.



I think 46% of statistics are made up....


I think most felons are a-political, but logic would dictate if they are voting, they are going to vote for the guy who's going to give them more, and not the guy who would be tougher on crime.

Historically that would mean liberal....


To me, though, if felons are voting, they are being egged on to by sinister characters of ill repute. Again, historically, the dead and felons have indeed voted for dems.
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

It's your wit that makes you so adorable....

I say we bail on this thread, go grab a beer, and smoke a nice cigar, Rev. =)

Oh, and again, if this really was voter fraud, prosecute the sumabitches imho!
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

I say we bail on this thread, go grab a beer, and smoke a nice cigar, Rev. =)

Oh, and again, if this really was voter fraud, prosecute the sumabitches imho!



That sounds like a plan, a good Sierra Nevada and a nice Cohiba. :thumbs:
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

I would like to see proof that these people vote for Franken before casting judgment. I know what the stereotype is, but a stereotype is not enough to convince me.
That's fair. Still I wouldn't be surprised at anything in politics especially coming from Louisiana, we have dirty politics down to a science, even though Illinois elevated it to an art form.
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

Well, hold on now Singularity. If the opposite had happened and Coleman won the exact way that Franken did and this came out, dependant on credibility I would feel the same way. The credibility argument only because I as many others have seen some dirty journalistic/political group tactics in the past. I feel that the candidate that wins gets seated whether or not I like them as long as it was a legitimate win. Hugh is exactly right here.



You're correct. Hugh Akston is spot on, which is why I thanked him and told him his common sense and inclination towards intelligent, honest discourse has no place on this thread, given the "OMG OBAMA IS TEH LIARZ" and subsequent partisan bashing. This is a topic that conservatives and libs can probably all agree on, but given the rampant accusations that liberals lean towards voter fraud simply to ensure their candidate wins, I think any sort of honest discussion hit the wastebasket by page 2.
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

I think 46% of statistics are made up....


I think most felons are a-political, but logic would dictate if they are voting, they are going to vote for the guy who's going to give them more, and not the guy who would be tougher on crime.

Historically that would mean liberal....


To me, though, if felons are voting, they are being egged on to by sinister characters of ill repute. Again, historically, the dead and felons have indeed voted for dems.

"Logic dictates they'd vote for those who give them more?" If that were true, nobody under a certain income level would vote liberal. This is just burying your head in the sand type of thinking. Besides, you're failing to consider that these people had lives before prison. Redneck gun carrying bible thumper man isn't going to suddenly become liberal just because he got arrested. The Aryan Brotherhood is still a strong presence in prisons, they're certainly conservatives. This "historical" record of dead people voting is irrelevant, because dead people don't actually vote. Sombody living had to do it, and they're going to fake votes towards whichever candidate they personally prefer.

92% wasn't a made up statistic. It's the percentage of these felon-voters that would have to vote for Franken in order to have changed the election outcome. (91.7%, actually) You don't think that 9% of felons might be redneck conservative types who wouldn't vote Democrat if you put a gun to their head? Remember, this is Minnesota. From about St. Cloud on northward it's a pretty conservative state.
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

I think 46% of statistics are made up....


I think most felons are a-political, but logic would dictate if they are voting, they are going to vote for the guy who's going to give them more, and not the guy who would be tougher on crime.

Historically that would mean liberal....


To me, though, if felons are voting, they are being egged on to by sinister characters of ill repute. Again, historically, the dead and felons have indeed voted for dems.

I think you are stereotyping here though. We don't know anything about these felons, except that they voted (or someone registered their name and voted for them). They could be anything from hardened sociopathic murdering pedophiles to the highly religious who reformed in jail or anything in between. I don't think it would be a good idea to speculate on their motivations until we find out what they are, factually.
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

Norm Coleman just never gives up, does he.
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

I guess the really sad part is that the liberals are having to figure out the voting demographics of convicted felons to figure out if their guy got in legitimately or not.

I wouldn't be defending this if I were a lib, I'd be hiding under the bed.
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

I guess the really sad part is that the liberals are having to figure out the voting demographics of convicted felons to figure out if their guy got in legitimately or not.

I wouldn't be defending this if I were a lib, I'd be hiding under the bed.

And I find it really sad that conservatives are jumping on the utterly desperate straw that is the belief that 90% of felons are liberal.
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

So are you more concerned with this specific race or with the voting fraud that was perpetrated on the people of Minnesota? Convicted felons being able to vote is a problem - no matter who they vote for. Franken won because of voting fraud. If you think that the felons would actually vote for the conservative candidate, you simply aren't thinking.

Altouhg most conservatives would like to see Franken thrown out and replaced with the real winner of the election, this isn't going to happen. What I want to see is voter fraud prosecuted to the fullest extent - no matter who commits it. The integrity of an election must remain in tact and when things like this are allowed to happen, the people lose, not the candidates.

Felons should not vote, but to say that Franken won because just about all the felons voted for him is a stretch. Would white collar criminals vote Democratic? I don't know about Minnesota, but here in Houston, just about all of the Enron folks who got convicted were staunch Republicans. And what about child molesters? They could break either way. Jon Matthews, a Republican talk show host here in Texas, was convicted of exposing himself to children. Drug users? OK, they are probably Democrats.... Oops, I missed Ted Haggard, who was Republican. And what about tax cheaters who got caught? You think that they are all Democrats too? LOL.

The point that I am making here is that some talking head website is trying to tell us that all the felons vote for Democrats, when truth be told, they are most likely voting in fairly equal numbers for Democrats and Republicans. In playing music, I have run across plenty of felons over the years, and there seem to be just about as many Republicans as Democrats. But, I suppose, that whichever side loses an election is going to make **** up as they go along. That's true for either side.

The cold hard fact is that, without looking at the actual ballots cast by those felons, you are not in any way able to deduce whether Franken won the election because of them. You can speculate all you want to, though. By the same token, I guess that Democrats can claim that Coleman almost stole the election because felons voted for him. Nobody knows except the blowhards, who think they know everything.
 
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Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

Well, well, well.....Demo's cheating to gain a Senate seat? Parish the thought! :shock:

Now stonewalling to make sure that they can cheat in the future. Is anyone really surprised. Frankin is a joke! A mental midget! And a liar. Just like his boss Obama.



Thoughts?


j-mac

Well well well...


... more sour grapes bull **** from the Party of No.

In Minnesota, two things the clowns at "Minnesota Majority" apparently aren't informed enough to know about ELECTION LAW is that one, upon completing the terms of their conviction, felons regain their sufferage. Two, we have secret ballots and voting booths, so these fools have absolutely no way of knowing WHO VOTED FOR WHO. As a matter of fact, considering all of the sleazy crap "Norm" did, I'm betting the criminal element backs him. Birds of a feather.
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

Under the bed, really? Seems a bit over-the-top as a response, don't you think?

By the way, good article here.

I wouldn't be defending this if I were a lib, I'd be hiding under the bed.
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

I wanted to edit my last post, but that's not an option, so here's another good read.

MinnPost - The latest scuttlebutt about Al Franken, felons and a supposedly stolen election


What? Another liberal using Allinsky tactics to discredit anyone who dares to question the validity of their status quo today? That's a good read for you? Hmmmm....Bet you think Olberman is a straight up Journalist too eh?


j-mac
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

Thanks for the personal attack, it made my day! :)
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

Thanks for the personal attack, it made my day! :)


Well, In reading your article, it reads like something poorly written by mediamatters. The author is clearly in Frankin's camp.

BTW, do you think Olberman is a journalist?

j-mac
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

What? Another liberal using Allinsky tactics to discredit anyone who dares to question the validity of their status quo today? That's a good read for you? Hmmmm....Bet you think Olberman is a straight up Journalist too eh?
j-mac

Dude, just the title of that **** pile article indicates tons of bias. I didn't even bother reading it.
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

What? Another liberal using Allinsky tactics to discredit anyone who dares to question the validity of their status quo today? That's a good read for you? Hmmmm....Bet you think Olberman is a straight up Journalist too eh?


j-mac


Funny. I decided to take a quick look at the Minnesota Majority who wrote the "objective" study. Who are they? They were originally headed by the prior Republican Secretary of State who was defeated. (see these three articles under Jeff Davis « Minnesota Independent: News. Politics. Media.) They made several charges of voter fraud that was not being stopped by the current Secretary of State both prior to the election and after the election.

They brought suit along with other Republican state representives in the Minnesota Supreme Court in 2009 and their claim was rejected by the Minn SP, which stated:

..........the plaintiffs “neither describe nor identify any wrongful acts, omissions or errors of respondents concerning a specific election as required” by Minnesota statute. It added that they requested “no relief specific” to the 2008 election, noting that even if they had tied it to the election, the window for contesting the election has passed.


In effect, the Minnesota Majority has made several claims of fraud, but you might note they do not mention much about all their other charges they have made in the past since they have been discredited.

If you truly believe that Minnesota Majority qualifies as an objective "watchdog" group. I strongly recommend that you visit their website to get a slice of their viewpoint. I found it interesting that they financed an ad campaign against "Obamacare." Here's an ad from their own website. What a hoot :lamoMinnesota Majority - Standing Together for Traditional Values
 

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Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

While it is upsetting that felons were voting, I don't really know how much their votes would have changed anything. We can sit here and say you know most would have voted Democrat and yes that maybe true, but that doesn't say how many actually voted for Franken. As Deuce said something like 90% of the felons would have to vote for Franken and that number, even if we were generalizing, does seem high. Most of this to me is an attempt to get back at Franken over a recount that I assume a decent number of people in Minnesota felt should not have happened.
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

While it is upsetting that felons were voting, I don't really know how much their votes would have changed anything. We can sit here and say you know most would have voted Democrat and yes that maybe true, but that doesn't say how many actually voted for Franken. As Deuce said something like 90% of the felons would have to vote for Franken and that number, even if we were generalizing, does seem high. Most of this to me is an attempt to get back at Franken over a recount that I assume a decent number of people in Minnesota felt should not have happened.

For me at least, the issue isn't who the felons voted for, it's that their votes even counted. How were they able to register to vote? It doesn't matter who won at this point. Even if every single one of them voted for Stuart Smalley, it won't change the fact that Stuart Smalley is a Congressman from the state of Minnesota. Ths issue here, and some people on both sides seem to be blurring the issue with reciting their party's talking points, is that this is voter fraud - plain and simple. The people of MN should be outraged - not that Smalley may or may not have won because of voter fraud, but that the integrity of the state's election system is seriously flawed.
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

While it is upsetting that felons were voting, I don't really know how much their votes would have changed anything. We can sit here and say you know most would have voted Democrat and yes that maybe true, but that doesn't say how many actually voted for Franken. As Deuce said something like 90% of the felons would have to vote for Franken and that number, even if we were generalizing, does seem high. Most of this to me is an attempt to get back at Franken over a recount that I assume a decent number of people in Minnesota felt should not have happened.

The recount was required by law due to the very close initial results. If people feel it should not have happened, well... they're wrong.
 
Re: Felons Voting Illegally May Have Put Franken Over the Top in Minnesota, Study Fin

For me at least, the issue isn't who the felons voted for, it's that their votes even counted. How were they able to register to vote? It doesn't matter who won at this point. Even if every single one of them voted for Stuart Smalley, it won't change the fact that Stuart Smalley is a Congressman from the state of Minnesota. Ths issue here, and some people on both sides seem to be blurring the issue with reciting their party's talking points, is that this is voter fraud - plain and simple. The people of MN should be outraged - not that Smalley may or may not have won because of voter fraud, but that the integrity of the state's election system is seriously flawed.

Now, I admit I don't have time yet to read the whole thread, but one thing confuses me. In Minnesota, a felon, once they have served their time, is eligible to vote. So I have to assume that this means that convicted felon in prison voted. How? Does the state normally send absentee ballots to prisons? How do you make a mistake like this? That is what I want to know.
 
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