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Obama at odds with Petraeus doctrine on 'Islam'

texmaster said:
Still with the same defeated talking points I see.
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Defeated my ass. Anyone can grab a concordance and jerk random quotes out of context for to try to prove a half assed point like you just. I was just hoping for a little more. You never fail to disappoint though.
 
texmaster said:
Keep it up Jallman. Thats just a starting point :)

And yes Christians can say we are less violent in our texts and most importantly in our actions because our book and teachings are far less violent in their teachings than those in Islam.

Only someone like yourself completely ignorant about the religious texts and complete lack of historical knowledge would ever proclaim they were equal.

PS. I had far more quotes but I simply ran out of room to post them all :2wave:
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Now on to this typical blathering. You have no concept of what my fields of study have been in my life and therefore, all your ad hom trying to prove your point by disproving my experience and knowledge is for nothing. Try arguing a topic and you might get somewhere. Try arguing me and you're only going to prove how stupid your stance is.

But then, you never do learn, do ya sport?
 
The thing Patreus should be careful of is alienating over a billion people. I personally think that the current mainstream practice of Islam is not compatible with western values, which creates a lot of the conflict we are currently seeing, but still, you have to be careful how you word things.

Sometimes PR matters.
 
megaprogman said:
I personally think that the current mainstream practice of Islam is not compatible with western values, which creates a lot of the conflict we are currently seeing, but still, you have to be careful how you word things.
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This is technically not true according to the data, most muslims approve of democracy and expanded rights, only about a third or so want sharia as the main source of law (whatever your opinion of it may be). Theres lots of data that contends against this statement.
 
TheNextEra said:
Yet again, you have no idea of the concept of blaming the people abusing the religion instead of blaming the religion. Yes, there are people that are doing bad things and they are abusing the religion to do it. That doesn't mean the religion is bad, only the people abusing it.

Do you deny that people abused Christianity is similiar manners in the past? Does that mean Christianity is to blame or does it mean the people that abused Christianity are to blame?
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Not at all. In fact I would say that there are indeed some Christian terrorists out there, however, their numbers, as well as their veracity in terms of the type of fear that they provoke within their community is so small as compared to that of radical Islam today, that you could say they're insignificant.

However, it seems that when ever the discussion on the threat of radical Islam comes up some in here would rather point to Christianity as a justification for what is going on today. It is IMHO, small minded to do such.


j-mac
 
j-mac said:
Not at all. In fact I would say that there are indeed some Christian terrorists out there, however, their numbers, as well as their veracity in terms of the type of fear that they provoke within their community is so small as compared to that of radical Islam today, that you could say they're insignificant.

However, it seems that when ever the discussion on the threat of radical Islam comes up some in here would rather point to Christianity as a justification for what is going on today. It is IMHO, small minded to do such.


j-mac
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I think it has very little to do with mitigating the threat of Radical Islam... but rather attempting to stop the rediculous notion that all muslims prescribe to Radical Islam, which they do not.
 
Jetboogieman said:
I think it has very little to do with mitigating the threat of Radical Islam... but rather attempting to stop the rediculous notion that all muslims prescribe to Radical Islam, which they do not.
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I don't think there is any basis for putting that out there as a generalization. it is a straw argument.


j-mac
 
j-mac said:
I don't think there is any basis for putting that out there as a generalization. it is a straw argument.


j-mac
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Some people do. But I think the rebuttal with the Christianity argument is that ALL religions have radical elements, I think the difference is... since most Christain nations are western nations, and are rich and have more progressive and better lifestyles those radical elements do not present themselves as often. When you look at the Geo-political and economic realities of the Middle East, the radical elements make sense being there. Since of course it is a scape goat "Well our lives suck now because we strayed too far from Islam" Argument. Which if America went to **** tommorow, would be the same argument of the Christain Right.
 
Jetboogieman said:
Some people do. But I think the rebuttal with the Christianity argument is that ALL religions have radical elements, I think the difference is... since most Christain nations are western nations, and are rich and have more progressive and better lifestyles those radical elements do not present themselves as often. When you look at the Geo-political and economic realities of the Middle East, the radical elements make sense being there. Since of course it is a scape goat "Well our lives suck now because we strayed too far from Islam" Argument. Which if America went to **** tommorow, would be the same argument of the Christain Right.
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Maybe, maybe not. America has been through tough times in the past, and you could argue that a resurgence of religion took place coinciding with that, however, I think you would be hard pressed to show that in that resurgence of religious times during the hard economic times of religious zealot Americans flying off to bomb and terrorize other nations.


j-mac
 
j-mac said:
Maybe, maybe not. America has been through tough times in the past, and you could argue that a resurgence of religion took place coinciding with that, however, I think you would be hard pressed to show that in that resurgence of religious times during the hard economic times of religious zealot Americans flying off to bomb and terrorize other nations.


j-mac
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Fair enough. But let's put it this way. Let's say America was in the same shape as say... Afghanistan or Iraq. And the evil imperialists in, I dunno. Beijing are imposing their will on you, and have military bases in your country. And you have nothing, and are told you can have everything if you go and bomb beijing.

I mean that's highly hypothetical. But if you're led to believe that crap from Birth. It's a possibility.
 
jallman said:
Defeated my ass. Anyone can grab a concordance and jerk random quotes out of context for to try to prove a half assed point like you just. I was just hoping for a little more. You never fail to disappoint though.
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The 10 myths about Islam

Realize however, that it is a death sentence for having written it, a death sentence for all who read it and a death sentence on me for having posted the link

Here we go.....Ten Myths About Islam Exposing Islamic Lies
 
j-mac said:
However, it seems that when ever the discussion on the threat of radical Islam comes up some in here would rather point to Christianity as a justification for what is going on today. It is IMHO, small minded to do such.


j-mac
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WRONG, and what you have just said is not what you and others have been typing.

I have no problem with what you have said above about RADICAL ISLAM. What I have a problem with is when people associate RADICAL ISLAM with ALL followers of Islam and blame the ENTIRE religion.

The only reason Christianity is brought up is to show that Christianity too was perverted by some and abused, much like people are doing with Islam now. It isn't the fault of the religion, but the fault of the people that abuse it.
 
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jallman said:
And I could swear not long ago Catholics and Protestants were bombing each other's cars in Ireland. Hmmmmmmm.....
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Truly ignorance is displayed here.....

Are you claiming that Northern Ireland was/is a religious conflict? That conflict was/is nationalist/separatist, not religious.
 
ric27 said:
Truly ignorance is displayed here.....

Are you claiming that Northern Ireland was/is a religious conflict? That conflict was/is nationalist/separatist, not religious.
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True ignorance is displayed here....

Are you claiming that Ireland has not had a history of Catholic/Protestant conflict?
 
TheNextEra said:
WRONG, and what you have just said is not what you and others have been typing.

I have no problem with what you have said above about RADICAL ISLAM. What I have a problem with is when people associate RADICAL ISLAM with ALL followers of Islam and blame the ENTIRE religion.

The only reason Christianity is brought up is to show that Christianity too was perverted by some and abused, much like people are doing with Islam now. It isn't the fault of the religion, but the fault of the people that abuse it.
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You are so wrong, its unbelievable

If you compare the Christianity and Islam of today, you will find some goofy radical and violent Christians and Christian groups. But those groups are very small, they are condemned publicly and actively with word and deed by other groups, and their violent and radical positions are very clearly refuted by the Bible.

Islam on the other hand, does not police their radicals themselves except in rare circumstances. The Koran also supports the radical's religious position rather than condemning it.
 
jallman said:
True ignorance is displayed here....

Are you claiming that Ireland has not had a history of Catholic/Protestant conflict?
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Tell me something, wise one... Was, the IRA acting in the name of The Church or with the Pope's blessing?
 
ric27 said:
Tell me something, wise one... Was, the IRA acting in the name of The Church or with the Pope's blessing?
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Tell me something, wise one....did I mention the IRA specifically?
 
SE102 said:
Something else more fun from my book! All studies of suicide attacks from 1980 to 2004 cited foreign occupation as the main reason.
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More fantasy. That must be one hell of a book. lol

This thing is just full of great stuff. Also only 7% of muslims qualify as radicals!
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Until you can start actually bringing in FACTS to support these laughable conclusions don't bother.
 
jallman said:
Defeated my ass. Anyone can grab a concordance and jerk random quotes out of context for to try to prove a half assed point like you just. I was just hoping for a little more. You never fail to disappoint though.
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Nice dodge jallman. Way to stay predictable. Running from the facts instead of addressing them :)

jallman said:
Now on to this typical blathering. You have no concept of what my fields of study have been in my life and therefore, all your ad hom trying to prove your point by disproving my experience and knowledge is for nothing. Try arguing a topic and you might get somewhere. Try arguing me and you're only going to prove how stupid your stance is.

But then, you never do learn, do ya sport?
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You are judged by your claims. Make a stupid claim thats easily disproven as you have and you are judged on that claim.

And since you can't argue the facts and would instead like to live in the world of insults, I think your "fields of study" are well defined.
 
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texmaster said:
Nice dodge jallman.
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You didn't present any facts. You lifted a bunch of stuff out of a text file, slapped it in a post, and then strutted and preened like you accomplished something. Typical texmaster MO.

You are judged by your claims. Make a stupid claim thats easily disproven as you have and you are judged on that claim.
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You might have a point if that had actually happened. :shrug:

And since you can't argue the facts and would instead like to live in the world of insults, I think your "fields of study" are well defined.
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And I think you're a bipolar half-wit but our opinions of each other are not the topic here, are they?
 
jallman said:
Tell me something, wise one....did I mention the IRA specifically?
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LOL Spare us Jallman. The IRA was the biggest terrorist organization in Northern Ireland and at the center of the conflict since England occupied Northern Ireland. If you weren't referring to them wise one, whom were you referring to with your

Are you claiming that Ireland has not had a history of Catholic/Protestant conflict
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Enlighten us
 
texmaster said:
LOL Spare us Jallman.
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LOLOLOLOLOL spare yourself. You aren't my responsibility.

The IRA was the biggest terrorist organization in Northern Ireland and at the center of the conflict since England occupied Northern Ireland.
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Did you have a point in stating the obvious?

If you weren't referring to them wise one, whom were you referring to with your
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Maybe the Provisional Irish Republican Army I thought you were well versed in history and this topic....silly me for thinking you did.

Enlighten us
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I'm not going to sit here and throw gems before pigs. Everyone in this thread knows your request is insincere and lacking anything remotely likened to honest discussion. If you aren't aware of Catholic/Protestant conflict in Ireland, then you are sorely lacking enough education in this area to be having this discussion at all. I don't believe for a minute that you are ignorant of the issue, though, which leads me to believe that your request is more of your typical mouth breathing antics.
 
Jetboogieman said:
Fair enough. But let's put it this way. Let's say America was in the same shape as say... Afghanistan or Iraq. And the evil imperialists in, I dunno. Beijing are imposing their will on you, and have military bases in your country. And you have nothing, and are told you can have everything if you go and bomb beijing.

I mean that's highly hypothetical. But if you're led to believe that crap from Birth. It's a possibility.
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First of all, you use a term from the liberal side of things in setting up your hypothetical, America is not "Imposing" its will on anyone. To take that stand is to say that we are somehow acting as some sort of Imperialist country, and we are not.

We are promoting freedom, and the ability of the people to chose, and standing with other free nations including Israel (which is the real crux of the animus against us)...


j-mac
 
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