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Thread: Crist wants drilling ban on the ballot

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    Re: Crist wants drilling ban on the ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post

    I do have to question, why, as a libertarian, you are so opposed to letting Floridians decide, for ourselves, whether we want drilling off our coasts.

    Because I'm opposed to hypocrisy funnily enough. Like I said all you're doing is shifting the dirt from one rug to another and then saying it's not your problem anymore.
    And did you even read the article I posted. China is already dealing with the backlash of our "Green" movement. Some parts of China that used to be great farmlands now can't grow a thing. All because you want to have your Prius, your little "Green" lightbulbs, and your turbines. The point is a movement to have sustainable energy is good! But rushing into it causes things like this to happen and it destroys lives and destroys people. You treat me like I have some sort of love for oil, you probably think I bathe in the stuff or something. I don't, but I am a realist and I realize that while sustainable energy is good we can't just flip a switch and say "Okay we don't need oil anymore". I would LOVE to not have to deal with oil, but until that's a reality we shouldn't go making it harder for us to get oil. If we have to spend more money on oil that's less money we can spend on switching to alternate energy sources and finding new forms of sustainable energy.

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    Re: Crist wants drilling ban on the ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    Tell me, as a libertarian, how to you justify telling Floridians that we can't enact a ban on drilling off our coast?
    What the heck is wrong with you? I never said you COULDN'T. I'm saying you SHOULDN'T because it is stupid. Gosh stop taking everything I say to one extreme or another. READ WHAT I SAY AND DEBATE IT! Stop forcing my argument into an extreme and then debating it that way because that doesn't accomplish anything.

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    Re: Crist wants drilling ban on the ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post
    From the Miami Herald



    I for one am thrilled about this. One thing Florida definitely does not need is a repeat of this oil spill. Of course, Florida already bans offshore drilling, but a constitutional amendment is probably the best way to preserve the lesson from this tragedy and protect Florida's beaches from a future of short sighted oil-drilling.

    Of course, this is being turned into a Republican talking point, to be used as a bludgeon against Crist in his upcoming Senate race against tea party hack Marco Rubio. What else is new. But I don't think it will work, the people of Florida know what is in their best interest and Crist really is looking out for the state here.

    As long as it is deep off shore oil drilling that they ban I say good. Logic should dictate that if it takes more than a week a to fix and possibly decades to clean up then you shouldn't drill there.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

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    Re: Crist wants drilling ban on the ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by Frozengale View Post
    I would LOVE to not have to deal with oil, but until that's a reality we shouldn't go making it harder for us to get oil. If we have to spend more money on oil that's less money we can spend on switching to alternate energy sources and finding new forms of sustainable energy.
    Wrong. Forcing the American public to pay the REAL PRICE for petroleum products provides a financial incentive that is not currently present to change our way of life. We've already seen how it works when gas prices shot up above $3 a gallon. In reality, petroleum products in America are heavily subsidized by tax incentives and corporate welfare. The fact that the actual price of these products to us as taxpayers is hidden from us to keep us from having sticker shock is a huge part of the reason that we haven't pursued sustainable measure more aggressively.

    As far as China's decision, China has every right to determine for themselves how their priorities will be set. If they choose to poison their water and land, that's THEIR CHOICE. I don't have a say over what China does or doesn't do, though the sustainable measures I've enacted in my house don't rely on toxic production methods, for the most part. What I do have a say on is what we do IN FLORIDA. If, by voting for this measure, I make it less likely that there will be another deepwater, that makes me happy. If by voting for this measure, I make gas prices go up, GREAT. That gives Americans around the U.S. an incentive to reduce their petroleum consumption.

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    Re: Crist wants drilling ban on the ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by Frozengale View Post
    Because I'm opposed to hypocrisy funnily enough. Like I said all you're doing is shifting the dirt from one rug to another and then saying it's not your problem anymore.
    You see, these particular rugs are in our house, and we like our nice clean rugs, in fact many of us depend on them. It is our perogative whether or not we allow dirty boots to track **** onto our rugs in our house or not. You may see it as shifting dirt to other rugs, perhaps so, but we see it as keeping the dirt from spreading to ours. Other rugs are not our rugs, and we have [essentially] no control nor say as to whether or not dirt gets tracked onto them. We happen to depend on our nice clean rugs they are integral to our economy, as well as to our pride, and we would like to keep them nice and clean, and we can and will use what control and say we have in this matter to decide what happens to our rugs here in our house..
    Last edited by marduc; 07-09-10 at 02:26 PM.
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    Re: Crist wants drilling ban on the ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    As long as it is deep off shore oil drilling that they ban I say good. Logic should dictate that if it takes more than a week a to fix and possibly decades to clean up then you shouldn't drill there.
    That's very reasonable of you jamesrage!

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    Re: Crist wants drilling ban on the ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    Wrong. Forcing the American public to pay the REAL PRICE for petroleum products provides a financial incentive that is not currently present to change our way of life. We've already seen how it works when gas prices shot up above $3 a gallon. In reality, petroleum products in America are heavily subsidized by tax incentives and corporate welfare. The fact that the actual price of these products to us as taxpayers is hidden from us to keep us from having sticker shock is a huge part of the reason that we haven't pursued sustainable measure more aggressively.

    As far as China's decision, China has every right to determine for themselves how their priorities will be set. If they choose to poison their water and land, that's THEIR CHOICE. I don't have a say over what China does or doesn't do, though the sustainable measures I've enacted in my house don't rely on toxic production methods, for the most part. What I do have a say on is what we do IN FLORIDA. If, by voting for this measure, I make it less likely that there will be another deepwater, that makes me happy. If by voting for this measure, I make gas prices go up, GREAT. That gives Americans around the U.S. an incentive to reduce their petroleum consumption.
    Well then let's make them pay the real price. But let's also make sure we use the RIGHT kinds of sustainable energy. And you're right they do have the right to poison their water and land, but you seem to fail to see that SOMEONE has to get poisoned and YOU are reaping the benefits. And if that is how we are going to do sustainable resources how is that any worse then what we have in place already? You're all gun-ho for making sure YOUR land doesn't have anything bad for it (as you should be) but you don't seem to mind that some of our "Green" solutions threaten other people's land, and in my book that is hypocrisy.

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    Re: Crist wants drilling ban on the ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by marduc View Post
    You see, these particular rugs are in our house, and we like our nice clean rugs, in fact many of us depend on them. It is our perogative whether or not we allow dirty boots to track **** onto our rugs in our house or not. You may see it as shifting dirt to other rugs, perhaps so, but we see it as keeping the dirt from spreading to ours. Other rugs are not our rugs, and we have [essentially] no control nor say as to whether or not dirt gets tracked onto them. We happen to depend on our nice clean rugs they are integral to our economy, as well as to our pride, and we would like to keep them nice and clean, and we can and will use what control and say we have in this matter to decide what happens to our rugs here in our house..
    So you have no problem with someone having to be dirty as long as it is not you?

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    Re: Crist wants drilling ban on the ballot

    Crist wants drilling ban on the ballot

    Crist, and all those that are frothing at the mouth over this ban are just plain ignorant.


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    Re: Crist wants drilling ban on the ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by Frozengale View Post
    So you have no problem with someone having to be dirty as long as it is not you?
    You are trying to set up a straw man here and you are wrong.

    to continue with analogies

    I would rather no one got dirty, but if someone else decides to let pigs wallow in their yard to make a few bucks selling ham, that does not mean that I have to as well. They have their product to sell and their, means of income for their household, if they decide to not want to be in that business so be it the cost of bacon would go up, and It would likely pressure people to have more pancakes and less bacon. Our household has other ways of making money and we do not need the pigs.
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