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Crist wants drilling ban on the ballot

Catz Part Deux said:
Actually, we shouldn't be drilling in the gulf AT ALL. This has been coming a long time. All it would have taken was a good whack by a hurricane, and this could have happened anytime in the last 20 years. But thanks for your false dichotomy. Nice try.
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What? You must either be joking, or just not fully understand what drilling in the Gulf means for America. The jobs, the supply, what it means for this country and our economy period. Plus you are duped into somehow believing that if we were to stop drilling there that nobody would? That's just plain dumb.

I suggest you do the slightest bit of research into just how many different countries are there, and how many accidents there have been since 1946 and you would see that not only are we not the only ones there, but that as a percentage, accidents are less than 1/1000th of 1% from that drilling. I assure you, you're not even that safe in your own life.

'shouldn't be drilling in the Gulf'.... What a joke! Get a clue.


j-mac
 
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Guy Incognito said:
From the Miami Herald



I for one am thrilled about this. One thing Florida definitely does not need is a repeat of this oil spill. Of course, Florida already bans offshore drilling, but a constitutional amendment is probably the best way to preserve the lesson from this tragedy and protect Florida's beaches from a future of short sighted oil-drilling.

Of course, this is being turned into a Republican talking point, to be used as a bludgeon against Crist in his upcoming Senate race against tea party hack Marco Rubio. What else is new. But I don't think it will work, the people of Florida know what is in their best interest and Crist really is looking out for the state here.
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Along with banning oil drilling off the coast of Florida, it should totally exempt, forever, Florida receiving a cut of oil and gas royalties from other parts of the GOM, as she does now.

Although, I don't know what Florida's deal is, the Spanish and the Chinese are drilling in the North Cuba Basin as we speak. How far is that from the Keys?
 
apdst said:
Although, I don't know what Florida's deal is, the Spanish and the Chinese are drilling in the North Cuba Basin as we speak. How far is that from the Keys?
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Well, that's just false, nobody is drilling off the coast of Cuba, unless they're doing it with top-secret communist invisible oil rigs.

And even if they were drilling there--they aren't-- this is still a red herring. I know that Cuba is farther away (about 90 miles) from the Florida Coast than Deepwater Horizon was from the Lousiana coast (about 50 miles). Not to mention it is outside of Florida's jurisdiction. Floridians have to protect Florida as best as we can, our beaches are far more important than any piddling oil assets that might be off the coast. Believe me, if we had more to gain from drilling than we had to lose I'd be the first one out there yelling "drill, baby, drill." But we don't, drilling of Florida's coasts is a terrible, awful, rotten idea. And "they're doing it in Cuba" isn't a good reason, especially since they actually aren't.
 
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Guy Incognito said:
Well, that's just false, nobody is drilling off the coast of Cuba, unless they're doing it with top-secret communist invisible oil rigs.
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You might want to keep with current events a little better.

Cuban Drilling Poses New Threat to Florida Beaches - WSJ.com

Cox Reporter Rips Right-Wing Luminaries for 'Rumor' About Offshore Drilling Plans in Cuba, Burns Herself | NewsBusters.org

And even if they were drilling there--they aren't-- this is still a red herring. I know that Cuba is farther away (about 90 miles) from the Florida Coast than Deepwater Horizon was from the Lousiana coast (about 50 miles). Not to mention it is outside of Florida's jurisdiction. Floridians have to protect Florida as best as we can, our beaches are far more important than any piddling oil assets that might be off the coast. Believe me, if we had more to gain from drilling than we had to lose I'd be the first one out there yelling "drill, baby, drill." But we don't, drilling of Florida's coasts is a terrible, awful, rotten idea. And "they're doing it in Cuba" isn't a good reason, especially since they actually aren't.[/QUOTE]

Cuba is 90 miles from Florida. The North Cuba Basin, isn't. How far is MC 252 from Pensacola?

Mississippi Canyon
cox-reporter-rips-right-wing-luminaries-rumor-about-offshore-drilling-pl


North Cuba Basin
443-NorthCubanBasin.jpg
 
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j-mac said:
What? You must either be joking, or just not fully understand what drilling in the Gulf means for America. The jobs, the supply, what it means for this country and our economy period. Plus you are duped into somehow believing that if we were to stop drilling there that nobody would? That's just plain dumb.

I suggest you do the slightest bit of research into just how many different countries are there, and how many accidents there have been since 1946 and you would see that not only are we not the only ones there, but that as a percentage, accidents are less than 1/1000th of 1% from that drilling. I assure you, you're not even that safe in your own life.

'shouldn't be drilling in the Gulf'.... What a joke! Get a clue.


j-mac
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Only problem with that safety record is that when things go wrong, it does a LOT of damage, crippling entire industries and regions. We should be activily looking for alternative energies that can replace the fact that we get 8% of our oil from the gulf, then we should shut it down. The jobs are minimal, and could easily be replaced with jobs maintaining alternative energy sources.
 
apdst said:
You might want to keep with current events a little better.
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Ok, so they might be doing some drilling in Cuba at some point in the future, what's your point? They still aren't drilling there now, and despite a bunch of right wing hacks mounting a whisper campaign to the contrary, they probably won't be doing it at all.

And, once again, even if they do drill in Cuba, why on earth does that mean that we should drill in Florida? Did I say an oil spill in Cuba would be good for Florida? An oil spill off the coast of Cuba (if they ever drill there, which they probably won't), wouldn't be nearly as bad as an oil spill off the coast of Florida would be for Florida, now would it? Florida can only control Florida, it can't control Cuba.

Nice map, by the way, it only goes to prove my point. Any drilling off Cuba would be farther from Florida than Deepwater Horizon was from Louisiana. And even if Cuba put an oil rig closer than that it wouldn't matter. If Cuba jumped off the Brooklyn Bridge I suppose you think Florida should do that, too?
 
I am not a Floridan as you can see by my profile on the left. However even I know that your economy is ran by tourism , so basically this is a way to save that industry. I applaud the people who vote in favor of the drilling ban, since it will cause less damage to already Florida weaken economy which most of the southern state near the spill can't afford right know. Yes Texas is more like a third world country, because of the religious right fraken things up.
 
marduc said:
Gas prices are currently roughly what they were 5 years ago, and if you were to average out the fluctuations over the last 5 years we would be just that...average.. ohh the pain of that steady uprise... or are you considering a long time to be more like a 20 year time frame?

ch.gaschart
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Oh hey guess what. Looking at that Chart we can see that over the past two years it has been steadily increasing! Oh hey guess what it's going to keep doing that. Just because it was lowered in 2008 doesn't mean that it isn't still increasing. And guess what, the more we pay for fuel the more we pay for everything else, such as food. We saw it happen when Gas was $ 4.00, things like bread suddenly shot up in price. Not to mention we are still falling on hard times. So I say make the switch painless so we don't have to waste money to get going on Sustainable resources. Otherwise all that's going to happen is it's going to hurt EVERYONE once oil starts shooting up. Why do you think having easily accessible oil is a bad thing when we are already working on switching to other resources?
 
Frozengale said:
Oh hey guess what. Looking at that Chart we can see that over the past two years it has been steadily increasing! Oh hey guess what it's going to keep doing that. Just because it was lowered in 2008 doesn't mean that it isn't still increasing. And guess what, the more we pay for fuel the more we pay for everything else, such as food. We saw it happen when Gas was $ 4.00, things like bread suddenly shot up in price. Not to mention we are still falling on hard times. So I say make the switch painless so we don't have to waste money to get going on Sustainable resources. Otherwise all that's going to happen is it's going to hurt EVERYONE once oil starts shooting up. Why do you think having easily accessible oil is a bad thing when we are already working on switching to other resources?
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thankfully, your opinion on this subject doesn't hold any water (pardon my pun).
 
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apdst said:
You might want to keep with current events a little better.
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We can't control what the Cuban government does. We can, however, control what the government of Florida does. Why would you be bothered if Florida decided not to allow drilling? It's not like we could control your decisions, in Louisiana.
 
ScottD said:
Only problem with that safety record is that when things go wrong, it does a LOT of damage, crippling entire industries and regions.
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No doubt, and therefore it needs to be regulated, and actually inspected instead of just wavered like the Obama administration did.

We should be activily looking for alternative energies that can replace the fact that we get 8% of our oil from the gulf, then we should shut it down.
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First off your number of 8% is just wrong. Latest figures show that we get in the neighborhood of 11% out of the gulf, that is equal to all of the oil we import from Canada, our largest import partner. Second, I agree that we should be developing alternatives to oil along side of exploration, and extraction increases of our own resource, making us less dependent on foreign sources. However, this is a long term thing. Viable sources of energy other than oil, and or coal are years, if not decades off from being usable on a large scale, and then you have to tackle infrastructure problems. So your theory of 'just shut it off' is a suicide solution for this country.

The jobs are minimal, and could easily be replaced with jobs maintaining alternative energy sources.
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Minimal? Last I heard the jobs in the gulf due to off shore drilling and support were in the realm of 130,000 +....Now last month the private sector in the entire US created some 86,000 new jobs, and your boy Obama is out there touting that shows a great job gain, and shows his stimulus worked....Falsely ofcourse, Now you term almost twice that number of jobs as "minimal" because you don't like the industry for ideological reasons...Come on man, think.


j-mac
 
Frozengale said:
Oh hey guess what. Looking at that Chart we can see that over the past two years it has been steadily increasing! Oh hey guess what it's going to keep doing that. Just because it was lowered in 2008 doesn't mean that it isn't still increasing. And guess what, the more we pay for fuel the more we pay for everything else, such as food. We saw it happen when Gas was $ 4.00, things like bread suddenly shot up in price. Not to mention we are still falling on hard times. So I say make the switch painless so we don't have to waste money to get going on Sustainable resources. Otherwise all that's going to happen is it's going to hurt EVERYONE once oil starts shooting up. Why do you think having easily accessible oil is a bad thing when we are already working on switching to other resources?
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You cannot even accurately cherry pick a time frame to try to make your point?

2 years ago would be July 08.. wow look ~$4.00 a gallon.. how about you try agin (hint... try 18 months ago to best bolster your position.. even then that steady increase only lasted all of 6 months)

Regadless of this, a few wells off the local beaches here that would have a negligible influence on gas prices would potentially be more catastrophic to my well being (and the local economy) than a few cents (or even a dollar or two for that matter) change in fuel prices.
 
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MrVicchio said:
:blink: Sometimes, I just wonder how people think the things they think.
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Like thinking that BP isn't responsible for the **** they unleashed upon the people who rely on the Gulf for their livings? Because that's pretty freakin' crazy.
 
FilmFestGuy said:
Like thinking that BP isn't responsible for the **** they unleashed upon the people who rely on the Gulf for their livings? Because that's pretty freakin' crazy.
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No one is saying that BP isn't a responsible party for this disaster. It is only the repeated use of them as a bludgeoning tool to deflect the administrations piss poor track record in this that grows tiresome.

Look, BP did intentionally unleash this disaster, any more than Obama blew it himself, so that is over the top. Second, Obama's refusal to act swiftly, and bring to bear any and all resources to battle this spill, then at the same time callously use it as a political tool to try and ram cap and trade through, is despicable. And in some cases maybe even criminal. Too bad there won't be any serious investigation of this until he is long disgraced out of office.


j-mac
 
Catz Part Deux said:
thankfully, your opinion on this subject doesn't hold any water (pardon my pun).
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Ahh so opinions from me are worthless but opinions from the all knowing Catz are life altering and the best things ever? I'm sorry I have an opinion on a debate forum. From now on I will agree with whatever you say no matter what.
 
marduc said:
Regadless of this, a few wells off the local beaches here that would have a negligible influence on gas prices would potentially be more catastrophic to my well being (and the local economy) than a few cents (or even a dollar or two for that matter) change in fuel prices.
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Why? Why would it alter the local economy? Miles and miles of the coast of Florida suddenly make it an eyesore or something and destroy tourism?
 
j-mac said:
Look, BP did intentionally unleash this disaster, any more than Obama blew it himself, so that is over the top.
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It was BP's gross negligence in building a deepwater rig without any failsafe measures that led to the spill, so yes, actually, they did intentionally unleash this disaster more so than Obama.

j-mac said:
I suggest you do the slightest bit of research into just how many different countries are there, and how many accidents there have been since 1946 and you would see that not only are we not the only ones there, but that as a percentage, accidents are less than 1/1000th of 1% from that drilling.
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Why don't you take that 1/1000th of a percent and go play Russian Roulette with you own state. We down here in Florida are conservative types, we like to play it safe.
 
Guy Incognito said:
It was BP's gross negligence in building a deepwater rig without any failsafe measures that led to the spill, so yes, actually, they did intentionally unleash this disaster more so than Obama.
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*Sigh* I am sure that this has been covered already, which makes your statement above all the more disingenuous.


Why don't you take that 1/1000th of a percent and go play Russian Roulette with you own state. We down here in Florida are conservative types, we like to play it safe.
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I almost let out a cackle on that one...Conservative types eh? Like Crist? Well, don't let facts get in your way while in full demonizing mode.


j-mac
 
j-mac said:
*Sigh* I am sure that this has been covered already, which makes your statement above all the more disingenuous.
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Nonsense. The only thing disingeuous is your claim that BP didn't intend the spill any more than Obama. That's absurd. BP might not have literally plotted to spill all that oil, but their grossly negligent actions are tantamount to intent. Obama has absolutely nothing to do with the causation of the spill whatsoever. To any reasonable person it is clear who is closer to intending the spill. Now if you're a corporate shill I guess it's a little fuzzier...


j-mac said:
*
I almost let out a cackle on that one...Conservative types eh? Like Crist? Well, don't let facts get in your way while in full demonizing mode.
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Apparently knowing nothing about Florida politics isn't stopping you from forming opinions about it huh? Yes, Crist is a very conservative politician, and was formerly a Republican before Rubio edged him out for the Senate nomination, so now he is running as an Independent, but still very conservative. And really, even a Florida Democrat is more conservative than a Massachucetts Republican. Just a friendly tip: Do a little research before you start spouting off next time.

But that's really neither here nor there, because I use the term "conservative" more generally, as in, "risk averse." Like I said, feel free to play Russian Roulette with the economy of your own state, but that 1/1000 of a percent is more of a risk than most Floridians would like to take with our beaches.
 
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Guy Incognito said:
Nonsense. The only thing disingeuous is your claim that BP didn't intend the spill any more than Obama. That's absurd. BP might not have literally plotted to spill all that oil, but their grossly negligent actions are tantamount to intent.
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And how about the governments negligence in this? Matters not? MMS ring a bell?

I'm not saying that BP is free of any blame in the spill, however if you really want to start with the finger pointing before the spill is stopped, and cleaned up then the administrations actions are so incompetent as to be criminal.

Libtards are making this political in order to promote their far left agenda, and they are doing it by purposely killing the eco system in the gulf in by far one of the most cynical acts of shameless politics I have ever seen in my lifetime.


Obama has absolutely nothing to do with the causation of the spill whatsoever.
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Causation? well, you're wrong there, as I have already eluded to concerning the MMS, and waivers Obama granted to BP before the spill happened.

Now, during the early stages, and up to now the Obama administration has stood firmly in the way up any effort to mitigate the spill, aid in stopping it, or accepting outside help to control it.

He is a joke, and whether it is incompetence, or willful destruction of our nations gulf coast, it IMHO is criminal.

Apparently knowing nothing about Florida politics isn't stopping you from forming opinions about it huh? Yes, Crist is a very conservative politician, and was formerly a Republican before Rubio edged him out for the Senate nomination, so now he is running as an Independent, but still very conservative. And really, even a Florida Democrat is more conservative than a Massachucetts Republican. Just a friendly tip: Do a little research before you start spouting off next time.
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obama_Crist21.jpg


yep, I can tell.


But that's really neither here nor there, because I use the term "conservative" more generally, as in, "risk averse." Like I said, feel free to play Russian Roulette with the economy of your own state, but that 1/1000 of a percent is more of a risk than most Floridians would like to take with our beaches.
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So it's true, liberals like yourself were just waiting for any little thing you could to exploit and kill energy in this country, and therefore the economy. Allensky would be proud.

Run along now son, you've been outed.


j-mac
 
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Catz Part Deux said:
Tedminator said:
yay Crist! :ind: He gets my vote to become FL Senator.
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It's interesting how the actual Floridians on this thread seem to approve of this move by Crist, but the people who have no idea of what matters to us in Florida (i.e., we know what side our bread is buttered on...tourism is what makes our economy tick) are up in arms.

I'll tell ya what...you outsiders worry about your states, and let us worry about ours.

States rights, ftw.
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yeah! grrr.. those foreigners need take care of their own states first.

anyhooo it's gonna be an exciting race between Crist and Rubio. The DNC shouldn't bother wasting their money running the dem candidate for senator.
 
Guy Incognito said:
Florida already bans offshore drilling
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The oil spill occurred while Florida had offshore drilling banned. How will banning it harder (Constitutionally rather than by statute) prevent similar future failures?
 
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