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Obama to invest $2 billion in solar power

Why hasn't solar power taken over, then? If the market is as strong as you say, we should have decreased our oil usage by at least 15%. What's the deal?

As strong as I say? $70 billion isn't that large. It's large, but not like natural gas. Furthermore, you seem to be extremely unaware of the differences between US tax/regulations and foreign regulations. Was I talking about the US or the world? Please actually read posts before replying to them.

The part that I think most folks don't get, is that when a storm rips through and tears the hell out of your solar power system, the replacement cost is on you.

Hence why you get insurance. For the same reason replacing parts of your house is on you. What's your point? That's hardly a reason not to get solar. By that measure, we shouldn't buy anything.

There's no tax credit, no government bailout and the local power company sure as hell isn't going to replace your $20,000 solar system.

Ever heard of a thing called "Home Owner's Insurance?"

Home Solar Panels: How Do They Affect Your Homeowners Insurance?

Oh boy. Seriously.

Google.com Start.Using.It.Now.

So, do you admit your comment on "There's no market" is dead wrong?
 
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People are still figuring out how to best employ solar power to replace our current energy sources.

IOW, they don't really have the first ****ing clue what to do. Right? That's what I thought. It's not like solar panels were invented last year. They've been around for, what? 30 years? Weren't there solar panels powering Sky Lab? And, you claim that folks still haven't figured a way to employ solar power to replace petro-fuels?



No, it's more like you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about when it comes to alternative energy.

Educate me! Please!!!!

I'm all for solar power. I think it's neater than a cat's ass; neatest thing since sliced bread. I have a solar panel that keeps the batteries in my boat charged up. I have both solar and wind power generating electricity for my hunting camp. I even have a solar panel that keeps my lawn mower battery charged. I'm down, but, you know, I think that's the extent of it's praticality.



That's what insurance is for. :lol:

Ahhh, I see. So, the answer that the treehuggers have--as usual--means more money out of the common man's pocket. yes?

Ya' know what? Right now, I don't have to carry insurance on my electric service. Why the hell would I want to spend my own money on a system, that I had to insure? Care to explain how this good for me again?
 
Ahhh, I see. So, the answer that the treehuggers have--as usual--means more money out of the common man's pocket. yes?

By that measure, don't buy a house. Apparently you missed the link where some insurance carriers reduce your insurance. So less money out your pocket.

Ya' know what? Right now, I don't have to carry insurance on my electric service. Why the hell would I want to spend my own money on a system, that I had to insure? Care to explain how this good for me again?

For the same reason you insure your house against damage? And why would you want to spend your money on such a system? Because it reduces your electrical bill.

Maybe you don't have a home? Maybe that's why you are so confused about what insurance is?
 
As strong as I say? $70 billion isn't that large. It's large, but not like natural gas. Furthermore, you seem to be extremely unaware of the differences between US tax/regulations and foreign regulations. Was I talking about the US or the world? Please actually read posts before replying to them.



Hence why you get insurance. For the same reason replacing parts of your house is on you. What's your point? That's hardly a reason not to get solar. By that measure, we shouldn't buy anything.



Ever heard of a thing called "Home Owner's Insurance?"

Home Solar Panels: How Do They Affect Your Homeowners Insurance?

Oh boy. Seriously.

Google.com Start.Using.It.Now.

So, do you admit your comment on "There's no market" is dead wrong?

The point, you ask? It costs MORE money and we're in the middle of a recession. How stupid is it to force people into spending more money on their light bill, in the middle of the worst economic downturn since the Great Depression?

Not only do people have to pay for the installation and maintanance of their solar power system, now, they have to insure it? And, you called me stupid?!? :rofl
 
IOW, they don't really have the first ****ing clue what to do. Right? That's what I thought.

No, you're completely wrong, but I guess that's nothing new.

It's not like solar panels were invented last year. They've been around for, what? 30 years? Weren't there solar panels powering Sky Lab? And, you claim that folks still haven't figured a way to employ solar power to replace petro-fuels?

No, I'm claiming that up until relatively recently there hasn't been the kind of investment in this field that there needs to be simply because there hasn't been a whole lot of incentive. That is changing.

Educate me! Please!!!!

I would absolutely love to, but I can't. I'm currently involved in some of the work that you're so blithely ridiculing me, but I've signed an NDA so I can't demonstrate to you how ignorant you really are.

I think that's the extent of it's praticality.

I know you do, but you're wrong.

Ahhh, I see. So, the answer that the treehuggers have--as usual--means more money out of the common man's pocket. yes?

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Are you kidding me?

Insurance doesn't mean more money out of the taxpayer's pocket. Oh brother.

Ya' know what? Right now, I don't have to carry insurance on my electric service. Why the hell would I want to spend my own money on a system, that I had to insure? Care to explain how this good for me again?

You don't insure the system.

You insure the house it is installed in. Just like you would even if you didn't have such a system.

Duh.
 
[By that measure, don't buy a house. [/b]Apparently you missed the link where some insurance carriers reduce your insurance. So less money out your pocket. [/b]



For the same reason you insure your house against damage? And why would you want to spend your money on such a system? Because it reduces your electrical bill.

Maybe you don't have a home? Maybe that's why you are so confused about what insurance is?

Additional insurance premiums equate to less money out of my pocket? How does that work exactly? :rofl

And why would you want to spend your money on such a system? Because it reduces your electrical bill.

My light bill, in the summer, in one of the hottest, most humid parts of the United States is between $120 and $150 a month. How long would it take, for my solar system with it's $20,000+ price tag, my maintanance bills and insurance bill, to pay for itself? I'm 41, will it happen before I die? Let's see some numbers on that since you know more than the rest of us working stiffs.
 
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Additional insurance premiums equate to less money out of my pocket? How does that work exactly? :rofl

We're talking about the kind of insurance that any responsible homeowner would have on their home to begin with. :lol:
 
The point, you ask? It costs MORE money and we're in the middle of a recession. How stupid is it to force people into spending more money on their light bill, in the middle of the worst economic downturn since the Great Depression?

What do you mean more? Do you understand the concept of per kilowatt subsidies in the same fashion that are given to nuclear? What are you talking about?

Not only do people have to pay for the installation and maintanance of their solar power system, now, they have to insure it? And, you called me stupid?!? :rofl

Do you own a car? Why should someone else have to pay for the costs? It's pretty clear you have no idea what the hell Tac and I are talking about.

Watch:

Not only do people have to pay for the installation and maintenance of their roofs, now, they have to insure it? And, you called me stupid?!?

You're a hoot Apdst.

Additional insurance premiums equate to less money out of my pocket? How does that work exactly?

You could read the link. Seriously, what's your problem with reading articles?

So, do you admit your comment on "There's no market" is dead wrong?

My light bill, in the summer, in one of the hottest, most humid parts of the United States is between $120 and $150 a month. How long would it take, for my solar system with it's $20,000+ price tag, my maintanance bills and insurance bill, to pay for itself? I'm 41, will it happen before I die? Let's see some numbers on that since you know more than the rest of us working stiffs.

First of all, who the hell spends $20,000 on an home system? Can your roof even support that weight?

First of all, you get solar water heating which is generally pretty cheap at under $2k. And considering the necessary power requirements to actually reduce your power bill, photovoltaic don't make sense at the moment for individuals.

http://www.energysavers.gov/your_home/water_heating/index.cfm/mytopic=12910

That estimate is 1.5 years payback. Pretty cheap. And I don't think it's counting the 30% federal tax credit.

But commercial solar panels make sense, especially for power companies as it reduces their long term fuel costs. Expensive to build, cheap to run verse cheap to build and expensive to run.
 
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No, you're completely wrong, but I guess that's nothing new.



No, I'm claiming that up until relatively recently there hasn't been the kind of investment in this field that there needs to be simply because there hasn't been a whole lot of incentive. That is changing.



I would absolutely love to, but I can't. I'm currently involved in some of the work that you're so blithely ridiculing me, but I've signed an NDA so I can't demonstrate to you how ignorant you really are.



I know you do, but you're wrong.



:lol: :lol: :lol:

Are you kidding me?

Insurance doesn't mean more money out of the taxpayer's pocket. Oh brother.



You don't insure the system.

You insure the house it is installed in. Just like you would even if you didn't have such a system.

Duh.

There in lies the bottom line of the treehugger bull****: "I can't, because I'm too busy". That's what I thought. You're not too busy to post on an internet discussion forum about how ignorant I am, but you're too busy to explain to me why you're right and I'm wrong.

Right-oh, my man!

You insure the house it is installed in. Just like you would even if you didn't have such a system.

You add a $20,000+ system to your home and your insurance bill isn't going to go up. Yeah! Right!! Do you even own a home??
 
The U.S. government is handing out nearly $2 billion US for new solar plants that President Barack Obama says will create thousands of jobs and increase the use of renewable energy sources.[/url]

No.

The US government is stealing two billion dollars from America's children to dole out to connected favorites.

Because Obama says it will create jobs the probability that jobs will be lost is almost unity.

Not to mention that Spain's lame green jobs attempt ended in miserable failure.

Finally, some forward thinking.

Centralized government is SOOOOO Twentieth Century.

Nothing forward about going backwards.

I don't think anyone is suggesting that solar polar can replace fossil fuels, but it can still be an effective supplement. And in a country that is apparently debating the use of foreign oil and offshore drilling, it makes sense to at least start the renewable energy process.

No debate. We should drill off shore to stop foreign oil dependency. Solar is never going to be more than a fringe market, so it's not part of the discussion.

Also, the best way to conduct forward research is to be actively using solar.

The best way to conduct research is to stop taxing private businesses so people with money to invest can calculate rewards against known risks and make their personal free decisions without government punishment.

Now,that's "forward" thinking.
 
What do you mean more? Do you understand the concept of per kilowatt subsidies in the same fashion that are given to nuclear? What are you talking about?



Do you own a car? Why should someone else have to pay for the costs? It's pretty clear you have no idea what the hell Tac and I are talking about.

Watch:

Not only do people have to pay for the installation and maintenance of their roofs, now, they have to insure it? And, you called me stupid?!?

You're a hoot Apdst.



You could read the link. Seriously, what's your problem with reading articles?

So, do you admit your comment on "There's no market" is dead wrong?

If there was any kind of real market, the government wouldn't have to piss out $2 billion to promote solar energy. I thought you were supposed to be some kinda financial/entrepreneur/business goo-roo.

The market doesn't extend past trolling motor batteries.
 
There in lies the bottom line of the treehugger bull****: "I can't, because I'm too busy". That's what I thought. You're not too busy to post on an internet discussion forum about how ignorant I am, but you're too busy to explain to me why you're right and I'm wrong.

Right-oh, my man!

Either you are complete and total moron, or you are attempting to piss me off in the hopes that I will make a mistake and give you an opening to win this retarded little argument, but it's not going to happen.

If you read the rest of the sentence you would've realized I can't talk about it because of non-disclosure agreements, not because I don't have time to talk about it.

You add a $20,000+ system to your home and your insurance bill isn't going to go up. Yeah! Right!! Do you even own a home??

I'm not even going to bother answering that question. You have proven so many times in this thread that you don't know the first thing about this subject, so I'm done proving to you how full of crap you are.
 
If there was any kind of real market, the government wouldn't have to piss out $2 billion to promote solar energy. I thought you were supposed to be some kinda financial/entrepreneur/business goo-roo.

The market doesn't extend past trolling motor batteries.

The government spends money on R&D because private industry is often reluctant to spend money on something that may or may not work.

This has been said before.

Is English not your first language?
 
If there was a market, private industry would already be all over. Obviously, there's no market. Could that be, because it isn't cost effective?


That blast of common sense deserves a thank you.

So thank you.

If government has to subsidize it, it's not cost effective, it's not efficient, and it's not Constitutional.

That's three "no's".

How many more does anyone need?
 
We're talking about the kind of insurance that any responsible homeowner would have on their home to begin with. :lol:

Right! Right! Explain how my homeowner's insurance bill isn't going up, when I add $20,000 worth of net loss to it.

I can't wait for this one. I'll be waiting.
 
That blast of common sense deserves a thank you.

So thank you.

If government has to subsidize it, it's not cost effective, it's not efficient, and it's not Constitutional.

That's three "no's".

How many more does anyone need?

There it is. Some folks are so blinded by the propaganda, that they can't see the trees for the forest.
 
The government spends money on R&D because private industry is often reluctant to spend money on something that may or may not work.

This has been said before.

Is English not your first language?

The government spends money on R&D, because the private sector is purdy much sure that, 1) there's no real market and, 2) it won't work as well as some folks think.

Does common sense exist in your thought patterns? How old are you?
 
The government spends money on R&D, because the private sector is purdy much sure that, 1) there's no real market and, 2) it won't work as well as some folks think.

Does common sense exist in your thought patterns? How old are you?

I'm 33 and I've been working in R&D for the past decade plus, so I know a hell of a lot more about it than you do. You're so ignorant on the subject, you don't even know enough to know what you don't know.
 
Either you are complete and total moron, or you are attempting to piss me off in the hopes that I will make a mistake and give you an opening to win this retarded little argument, but it's not going to happen.

If you read the rest of the sentence you would've realized I can't talk about it because of non-disclosure agreements, not because I don't have time to talk about it.



I'm not even going to bother answering that question. You have proven so many times in this thread that you don't know the first thing about this subject, so I'm done proving to you how full of crap you are.

Oh yeah, right, that's it!!! You got all the answers; you just can't tell us about it, right now. Hey! I get it, dude! :rofl
 
Oh yeah, right, that's it!!! You got all the answers; you just can't tell us about it, right now. Hey! I get it, dude! :rofl

There isn't a single person that does R&D work that CAN talk to you. Because NDAs are an industry standard.
 
I'm 33 and I've been working in R&D for the past decade plus, so I know a hell of a lot more about it than you do. You're so ignorant on the subject, you don't even know enough to know what you don't know.

Tell us all about it, bro. It's not like solar panels are some state secret.
 
It was about 20 years ago someone suggested Large Solar plant in the Four Corners area of the Southwest could power the whole country.


And what was a stupid idea, condidering the energy needs of the nation in 1990 is three times as stupid today.

The area of the collectors needed would be something the area of Massachusetts, I recall.

Just think of what putting an area in the desert in permanent shade will do to the ecosystem of a large area of the Southwest United States.

Just think of the shear impossibility of moving that electricity to Portland, Maine.

Just think.
 
Why hasn't solar power taken over, then? If the market is as strong as you say, we should have decreased our oil usage by at least 15%. What's the deal?

That's the thing with all these "green" energy sources, if they are so competitive then they would already be driving coal fired plants out of business.

It's not ready yet.
The market is still a niche by and large.
 
Tell us all about it, bro. It's not like solar panels are some state secret.

Do you not understand what an NDA is?

I can talk about the subject in general terms, as I've been doing. Beyond that, if you feel like you need to bone up on solar panels, I recommend Google.
 
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