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Thread: Chicago approves new handgun restrictions

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    Re: Chicago approves new handgun restrictions

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    I'm well aware of that and I spoke to nothing concerning the make-up of the marriage in those opinions. That still doesn't change the fact that both opinions state plainly that marriage is a fundamental right and not a privilege.
    Keep and carry arms is a right, that doesn't mean you can carry whatever you want.

    So to is marriage a right, that doesn't mean you can marry whomever you want.

    No right is unlimited so stating that marriage is a right does nothing for your argument as you're not addressing those limits.

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    Re: Chicago approves new handgun restrictions

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    I'm well aware of that and I spoke to nothing concerning the make-up of the marriage in those opinions. That still doesn't change the fact that both opinions state plainly that marriage is a fundamental right and not a privilege.
    That is "marriage" as it is defined between one man and one woman is a right for any many that wants to marry a woman,... and for any woman that wants to merry her man."

    Please try to keep up with the details.

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    Re: Chicago approves new handgun restrictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    That is "marriage" as it is defined between one man and one woman is a right for any many that wants to marry a woman,... and for any woman that wants to merry her man."

    Please try to keep up with the details.
    Just like "arms" in the 2nd amendment is defined as non-dangerous firearms in common use at the tame; not guided munitions, not launch weapons, not Active Denial Systems, not WMDs.

    If gays want to include a new category, that's fine, let's hear arguments specifically supporting that exact category. Gays can't come out with "we want the 2nd to protect private ownership of Active Denial Systems because having 'arms' is a right". By that logic missiles should also be legal to carry. Let's hear the merits of Active Denial Systems and address that.
    Last edited by Jerry; 07-03-10 at 01:37 PM.

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    Re: Chicago approves new handgun restrictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Just like "arms" in the 2nd amendment is defigned as non-dangerous firearms in common use at the tame; not guided munitions, not launch weapons, not Active Denial Systems, not WMDs.
    While I do see your point (and agree with it for the most part),....

    I don't know if I would go so far as to say "just like."

    The right to keep and bear arms is an enumerated right with a specific purpose that pre-dates the Constitution itself. For example,... were we the people ever to again wage a "revolutionary War" against our (gone tyrannical) government,... we certainly would have the right to "carry and use any weapon of our choice." It would essentially be "anything goes."

    The same arguments could never be made for 'marriage.'

    The right for a man and woman to marry is on a completely different radar screen.
    Last edited by Chuz Life; 07-03-10 at 01:39 PM.

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    Re: Chicago approves new handgun restrictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    While I do see your point (and agree with it for the most part),....

    I don't know if I would go so far as to say "just like."

    The right to keep and bear arms is an enumerated right with a specific purpose that pre-dates the Constitution itself.

    The right for a man and woman to marry is on a completely different radar screen.
    Try not to lock onto specific wording. It's a hell of a morning so far, I'm moving, the kids are stressed out and I'm bouncing on and off the forum for a brake. I'm not even trying to word my posts with the degree of precision you seem to be looking for.

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    Re: Chicago approves new handgun restrictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Just like "arms" in the 2nd amendment is defined as non-dangerous firearms in common use at the tame; not guided munitions, not launch weapons, not Active Denial Systems, not WMDs.

    If gays want to include a new category, that's fine, let's hear arguments specifically supporting that exact category. Gays can't come out with "we want the 2nd to protect private ownership of Active Denial Systems because having 'arms' is a right". By that logic missiles should also be legal to carry. Let's hear the merits of Active Denial Systems and address that.
    Its all they've got. We went through pages of claims of genetics and now after being proven they don't have a leg to stand on they continue this fantasy that if its ruled a right based on race that covers sexual preference so they are back to their genetic claim even after they deny they are.

    The right to keep and bare arms is a right for every american spelled out specifically in the Constitution. If they want gay marriage so badly, let them propose an Ammendment as it was defined by the rules of government. Thats how we abolished slavery, gave women the right to vote, set the voting age, etc. Or get a law passed through Congress, the House and signed by the president.

    But they know they will fail that route since they've failed at every popular vote to even get a proposition through at the state level despite 31 tries so their only hope is to bastardize a judge's ruling on a totally different subject not related to their cause in any way to circumvent the will of the people.
    Last edited by texmaster; 07-03-10 at 01:54 PM.
    Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.

    John Adams

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    Re: Chicago approves new handgun restrictions

    Quote Originally Posted by texmaster View Post
    Its all they've got. We went through pages of claims of genetics and now after being proven they don't have a leg to stand on they continue this fantasy that if its ruled a right based on race that covers sexual preference so they are back to their genetic claim even after they deny they are.

    The right to keep and bare arms is a right for every american spelled out specifically in the Constitution. If they want gay marriage so badly, let them propose an Ammendment as it was defined by the rules of government. Thats how we abolished slavery, gave women the right to vote, set the voting age, etc.

    But they know they will fail that route since they've failed at every popular vote to even get a proposition through at the state level despite 31 tries so their only hope is to bastardize a judge's ruling on a totally different subject not related to their cause in any way to circumvent the will of the people.
    A couple random thoughts:

    I wonder how White supremacists feel knowing that their stupidity has empowered the gay marriage movement decades later.

    I point of trivia: SCOTUS agreed that women did not in fact have the right to vote under US law, hence the need for an amendment.

    You're right, marriage is an unspecified right, and as such is left to the state on who to regulate. If you don't like you state's laws on marriage, move. That's a wonderful thing about America, you can choose from a buffet of law combinations and switch to a new rule set at any time.
    Last edited by Jerry; 07-03-10 at 01:57 PM.

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    Re: Chicago approves new handgun restrictions

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    No, marriage has been ruled to be a fundamental right by the SCotUS in at least two different rulings. Marriage is not a privilege, it is a right.
    Explain, then, how a state can legally and constitionally eliminate it in full simply by passing a law that repeals the laws that create it.
    Last edited by Goobieman; 07-03-10 at 02:20 PM.

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    Re: Chicago approves new handgun restrictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Did they actually say "strict scrutiny" in the latest opinion?? If so that is AWESOME!!
    They said it is a "fundamental right" that is, obviously protected directly by the Constitution.
    Thus, stricty scrutiny is the -only- applicable test.

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    Re: Chicago approves new handgun restrictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    They can win, technically, because they didn't ban guns in total.
    The rigght is protected from "infringement", which includes a great many things other than outright bans.

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