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Thread: Gen Stanley McChrystal to retire from US Army

  1. #51
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    Re: Gen Stanley McChrystal to retire from US Army

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Not a superior, not a violation of anything, its two fellow soldiers joshing each other. Bad judgement, sure. Wrong, no. Anything to do with what I asked you to present? Absolutely not.

    But I must say, you did an excellent job of destroying the strawman that what McChrystal did was intelligent or that his team said some ridiculous and potentially over the line things. Its just too bad that I never made that claim, and I never asked you to verify that claim. What I asked you for was proof of McChrystal himself directly making "comments about BO", of which you've provided nothing.
    Youve GOT to be either deliberately obtuse or the stupidest person Ive ever met. and I dont think you are the stupidest person i have met so this HAS to be deliberate.

    Just what the **** are you looking for anyway? When news of the story broke MCCHRYSTAL immediately apologized. He KNEW he ****ed up. he KNEW it would have dire consequences. he KNEW that before he even met w/ BO he was done for which is why he tendered his resignation. HE knew it. everyone else can see it. But YOU cling to HIS defense (a defense that HE isnt stupid enough to make) with this amazing dogged tenacity.

    I NEVER SAID that ANYTHING McCHRYSTAL said directly about BO was a court martial offense. In the post cited I said with the actual quatoes what Ive said all along.

    So again...I ask...what the **** are you looking for? I never said HE verbally assaulted the president. I never suggested his actions were a court martial worthy offense. I broke down the article and sequence of events that GUARANTEED that he would be replaced...and you say "HAH...see...Im right!"

    General McChrystal is guilty of being stupid. It cost him his job. Apparently EVERYONE including HIM is smart enough to see it...except you.

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    Re: Gen Stanley McChrystal to retire from US Army

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    That he exercised bad judgment in what resulted in the Rolling Stone piece and failed to establish strong working relationships with key members of the team responsible for Afghanistan does not in any way take away from his considerable accomplishments during his lengthy career in the Army. One should not lose sight of what he did achieve nor the sacrifices he made on behalf of his country.
    I totally agree. I'm looking forward to seeing the next chapter of his public life.

  3. #53
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    Re: Gen Stanley McChrystal to retire from US Army

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Youve GOT to be either deliberately obtuse or the stupidest person Ive ever met. and I dont think you are the stupidest person i have met so this HAS to be deliberate.
    Well, thank you for the wonderful insult.

    No, not obtuse. You have continually said the following:


    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    the preponderance of comments made about BO
    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    ...his comments about BO
    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    what he said about BO
    I've asked you to provide me any direct quote of McChrystal showing him saying something negative about President Barack Obama.

    You've provided absolutely zero, yet continue to insult ME as if I don't understand what you're saying. And while you do it you make an argument about how he "****ed up" as if that counters me when I've said throughout this that he messed up.


    Just what the **** are you looking for anyway?
    For you to stop saying part of the way he ****ed up was making comments about Barack Obama that were quoted in the article, because there were no direct quotes of him in the article.

    When news of the story broke MCCHRYSTAL immediately apologized. He KNEW he ****ed up. he KNEW it would have dire consequences. he KNEW that before he even met w/ BO he was done for which is why he tendered his resignation. HE knew it. everyone else can see it. But YOU cling to HIS defense (a defense that HE isnt stupid enough to make) with this amazing dogged tenacity.
    Umm....wtf have you been reading?

    I've said he ****ed up, in simply nicer words. I've said in other threads he deserved consequences. I've said there was no question what was going to happen in regards to Obama's reaction. What the **** are you arguing against, cause it sure as hell isn't anything I said. I've made no "defense" of him SAVE for the fact that he never was quoted in that article of saying ANYTHING about Barack Obama, something you've continually stated but continually been unable to back up.

    I NEVER SAID that ANYTHING McCHRYSTAL said directly about BO was a court martial offense. In the post cited I said with the actual quatoes what Ive said all along.
    No, but you've said he's said things in that article about BO.

    And you've provided zero direct quotes of McChrystal from that article speaking to BO.

    So again...I ask...what the **** are you looking for? I never said HE verbally assaulted the president. I never suggested his actions were a court martial worthy offense. I broke down the article and sequence of events that GUARANTEED that he would be replaced...and you say "HAH...see...Im right!"
    I'm asking you to stop suggesting he made statements in the article about Barack Obama, because he did no such things.

    General McChrystal is guilty of being stupid. It cost him his job. Apparently EVERYONE including HIM is smart enough to see it...except you.
    I'm going to highly suggest at this point that you stop slinging around the insults. Especially uninformed ones that are frankly dealing with imaginary things in your mind, because I've never said he wasn't guilty of being stupid, nor that his job shouldn't have been cost him. The ONLY thing I've said is that the notion that he made comments in that article about Barack Obama is absolutely, positively, fraudulent and false.

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    Re: Gen Stanley McChrystal to retire from US Army

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Show me where he didn't?
    The absence of statements that a reprimand did occur shows that it probably didn't happen. Because if it never happened there wouldn't be any statements about it, like how it is now, and the converse is that if it happened, there would be some evidence or trail of it occurring from other people or the general himself and there wouldn't just be an absence of evidence.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Um, yes it is in the case of every single solitary instance where an "Aid" or a "Source" or a "Team Member" told the reporter what McChrystal said. Someone else stating McChyrstals words to the Journalist is third party heresay. If the journalist actually HEARD McChrystal said something, and quoted it as McChrystal saying something, then it wouldn't be. That was not the case in many of the statements and all the statements regarding the President.
    Not the case involving the statement about the Vice President though. You could say that every statement involving the general from another person is a 3rd party statement, which is why it probably wouldn't be admissible under court as criminal evidence against him or in a formal investigation and why the general also is not being courtmartialed. You can say both are heresay if you want, and which is why in court its called heresay and not allowed, I think. These 3rd party statements are not strong enough to be considered as criminal evidence against someone, but you can take them as good enough to form opinion against someone. So if you want, and you think Obama should lose his job over this like McChrystal did, you're welcome not to vote for him in the next election. I haven't read the whole Blagojevich-Harris thing but if I believe whatever said is true, I too will probably hold it against Obama/whoever did the wrongdoing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Firing a PR guy is not an admission of guilt of the accusations. One could easily argue he fired the PR guy because the article came out slanted and obviously as a hit job type piece, presenting information in such a way to give a false impression. Does it show admission that he made an error in judgement of allowing the journalist action? Absolutely! Good thing I never argued he didn't show an error in judgement in doing such a thing.
    If it was so, wouldn't the general or his press staff say it was slanted or a hit job type of piece, put out a statement, say anything or something? They haven't done anything of that. I do believe that his immediate firing of the PR is more so an admission of guilt.

    Again, you haven't answered why the General hasn't refuted any of it or anyone has attacked the credibility of the article.

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    Re: Gen Stanley McChrystal to retire from US Army

    Quote Originally Posted by Opteron View Post
    .
    Dude you LOVE playing fast and lose with the facts. Everyone of those 'BO comments' you attribute to me are falsely applied. I stated "the comments about BO werent horrible"...you cite "the comments about BO". I cite the comments about BO, Biden, and his staff and you cite "the comments about BO".

    And I still cant fathom what you possibly expect to gain from this. But by all means. CLING to yourself.

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    Re: Gen Stanley McChrystal to retire from US Army

    Because whether you felt they were horrible or not is irrelevant, what's relevant is you're making claim that there WERE comments by MCchrystal in the article about BO...which there were none directly quoted from him.

    Whether you felt it was horrible or not would be relevant, if i was making claims that you thought he was being insulting. However that's not what I was arguing at all, so there was no reason to include it.
    Last edited by Zyphlin; 06-29-10 at 11:17 PM.

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    Re: Gen Stanley McChrystal to retire from US Army

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Because whether you felt they were horrible or not is irrelevant, what's relevant is you're making claim that there WERE comments by MCchrystal in the article about BO...which there were none directly quoted from him.

    Whether you felt it was horrible or not would be relevant, if i was making claims that you thought he was being insulting. However that's not what I was arguing at all, so there was no reason to include it.
    Bull****. Try actually READING the comments. And then try a little reality check. I have cited a PREPONDERANCE of the problems. Id say they were pretty much in line with Gen McChrystals acceptance of his comments, his staffs comments, and his decision to bring a RS reporter into the picture. General McChrystal was smart enough to get it. You? I cant figure you out. Done trying.

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    Re: Gen Stanley McChrystal to retire from US Army

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Because whether you felt they were horrible or not is irrelevant, what's relevant is you're making claim that there WERE comments by MCchrystal in the article about BO...which there were none directly quoted from him.

    Whether you felt it was horrible or not would be relevant, if i was making claims that you thought he was being insulting. However that's not what I was arguing at all, so there was no reason to include it.
    Truly finished...you can have the last word after this...I promise...but...just so we have the WHOLE quote...

    "I highly doubt you will find my message inconstent here but if it has been then I misspoke. From the outset I have said it is the preponderance of comments made about BO, Biden and the NSA chief...and most importantly the venue in which they were spoken. I have seen the comments...none from him were specifically damning. The others...sure.

    And from THAT you extrapolate that I am claiming McChrsytal made numerous slanderous comments about BO? Really? Riiiiiiight.

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    Re: Gen Stanley McChrystal to retire from US Army

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Bull****. Try actually READING the comments. And then try a little reality check. I have cited a PREPONDERANCE of the problems. Id say they were pretty much in line with Gen McChrystals acceptance of his comments, his staffs comments, and his decision to bring a RS reporter into the picture. General McChrystal was smart enough to get it. You? I cant figure you out. Done trying.
    Hey, you made your same claim while leaving our the accusation that he made statements about Obama.

    Congratulations, now I don't disagree with you. Amazing how that works, you stop saying the thing that is untrue and you can't back up and suddenly I stop having an argument

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    Re: Gen Stanley McChrystal to retire from US Army

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    And from THAT you extrapolate that I am claiming McChrsytal made numerous slanderous comments about BO? Really? Riiiiiiight.
    Nope, from that I'm extrapolating that you believe McChrystal made comments in the article about Obama, regardless of how "Damning" you feel they were.

    In reality, that didn't happen.

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