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Thread: Napolitano: ‘You’re Never Going to Totally Seal That Border’

  1. #121
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    Re: Napolitano: ‘You’re Never Going to Totally Seal That Border’

    Quote Originally Posted by somepeoplesay View Post
    Well, considering people die trying to cross the border all the time and STILL try and come, I don't think that would be much of a deterrent. I love how conservatives are so quick to have big government come in when it suits their purposes, then claim to have principled opposition when it doesn't. Also, to say these people are "invaders" is straight hyperbole, and yes it would a waste of money and resources to send troops down there. When armed Mexican militias are trying to annex parts of the U.S., then sure, lets go down and kick some ass. This is a civil dispute.
    You obviously misunderstand the position of mainstream conservatives. Conservatives by in large wish to reserve Constitutional powers for the federal government, and protecting the border is one of those powers. What Conservatives DO NOT WANT is for the federal government to intrude on matters that are reserved for state and local governments...
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    Re: Napolitano: ‘You’re Never Going to Totally Seal That Border’

    Quote Originally Posted by pro-bipartisan View Post
    Exactly. We need to fix the immigration system as a whole and not just try to stop illegal immigration.
    I agree with you... a process that is now many YEARS too late to start on. Effectively because this minor issue was neglected for so long, we're seeing epidemic levels of illegals rushing the border.

    Now, as those drug / human smugglers gain more of a foothold they will start increasing what they are bringing off the border, UNTILL, as I've repeated, the area roughly between Texas and California have been ceded back to Mexico.

    So, as I've said earlier, that we're willing to bomb countries half way around the world based on 'suspicions' that they 'may' threaten us some time in the future, pre-emptively, illegally, YET when a situation arises with an ACTUAL JUST war going on, nobody cares about this country enough to stop it...

    Absolutely disgusting. People calling themselves patriots that are sitting and trying to justify a LEGITIMATE invasion of the country going on.... I tell you, I'm not even american and I want to sign up. (which is a tremendous statement if you look at my previous positions on the wars) That's what WAR is about, it's about protecting your TRIBE FROM FOREIGN INVADERS who aim to kill the men, enslave the children, rape the women, and steal the resources.

    You know that feeling when your team wins the game... that's a bastardization of the feeling of watching an army run away defeated, knowing that your skull won't get bashed in, that your family is saved.

    Ok, so ultimately, this invasion is a DIRECT threat to anyone that lives in the greater area that was originally mexico... not all, but those most virulantly racist mexicans believe that americans should 'go home' (as in back to europe)... and they will openly call for it... a few choice youtube searches and if your jaw doesn't drop, well... I wouldn't know what to say.

    I'm not going to mince words on this : They might not be soldiers coming over the border, but they are most definately enemies of the US and her interests and should be treated as such. If you're going to aid them through your inaction and allowing these assaults and territory grabs, as Obama has been doing (and will likely continue to do), then simply put YOU ARE A TRAITOR TO THE US! Allright?

    Edit : All that said : if a person comes to the country legally, black, brown, red, blue, whatever... if they come legally and respect the laws of the land then they are my friends and I welcome them.

    How bad does it have to get before YOU get up and want to do something about it??? as I've said, it's not even my fight and this is already blatant enough to sound an alarm. I care about the US because if your country falls to a tyranny then Canada will follow behind not long after.
    Last edited by BmanMcfly; 07-03-10 at 03:27 AM. Reason: clarification

  3. #123
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    Re: Napolitano: ‘You’re Never Going to Totally Seal That Border’

    Quote Originally Posted by somepeoplesay View Post
    Well, considering people die trying to cross the border all the time and STILL try and come, I don't think that would be much of a deterrent.
    I seriously doubt that crossing a few stretches of desert in which people put up water and food stops is as scary as crossing a mine field and going up against heavily armed troops with shoot on site authorization.

    I love how conservatives are so quick to have big government come in when it suits their purposes, then claim to have principled opposition when it doesn't.
    A) If there is a legitimate roll for the state it is to provide for the protection and defense of the security of the people.

    B) This problem can be solved without state intervention, however, not only has the state not lived up to its constitutional obligations to defend and protect the security of the people but if the people were to invoke their natural right to collective self defense of property the state would go after them. The Federal Government will not aid in shutting down the borders with the use of lethal force but I guarantee if militias were organized at the local level the Feds would be there the next day to stop them.

    Also, to say these people are "invaders" is straight hyperbole, and yes it would a waste of money and resources to send troops down there. When armed Mexican militias are trying to annex parts of the U.S., then sure, lets go down and kick some ass. This is a civil dispute.
    Los Zetas has already taken over nearly the entirety of North America and have conquered large swaths of the South West United States making them no go zones for U.S. citizens. This is not some common street gang or drug cartel we're talking about here we're talking about a highly disciplined organization with a military command structure which was founded and is still controlled by a special forces unit of trained assassins armed to the teeth with unlimited funds and resources which is willing to kill anyone (and I mean anyone) who gets in their way, there is no way to secure the border other than to resort to a war footing and that means a no man's land along the border with anti-personel mines and shoot on site authorization for our border guards.

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    Re: Napolitano: ‘You’re Never Going to Totally Seal That Border’

    Quote Originally Posted by pro-bipartisan View Post
    You should be blaming yourself and please think before you ask why.
    Thought about it and still have to ask why? And no this is not a government of, by, and for the people it is a government of, by, and for the state capitalists.

  5. #125
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    Re: Napolitano: ‘You’re Never Going to Totally Seal That Border’

    Quote Originally Posted by BmanMcfly View Post
    Pardon my ignorance on this one, but is the I-9 a federal law??

    If so, then it's already been shown that the feds are NOT interested (regardless of the color / stripe of the president) in stopping illegal immigration...

    This was all outlined in the SPP documents... the government intends to let it get SO BAD that the people give up and accept what Obama says.

    This may be a stretch, but with the BP spill now threatening most all gulf states, and I've heard talk of a potential need for mass evacuations, but should that occur, can you imagine how many illegals would swoop in knowing that there was nobody around to stop them??

    So, while I agree with your intention, the government has shown no interest in actually diong that though.
    Every employer is required by FEDERAL LAW (passed in the 1986) to ascertain and document the working status of all employees. This includes documenting citizenship or working status by the employer personally reviewing social security card, passport, driver's license, birth certificate and working papers. The employer then attestst to this via the I-9 form. The employer is subject to fines of up to $10,000 each undocumented worker.

    From the USCIS website:

    Purpose of Form :
    All U.S. employers must complete and retain a Form I-9 for each individual they hire for employment in the United States. This includes citizens and noncitizens. On the form, the employer must examine the employment eligibility and identity document(s) an employee presents to determine whether the document(s) reasonably appear to be genuine and relate to the individual and record the document information on the Form I-9. The list of acceptable documents can be found on the last page of the form.

    About Form I-9 and E-Verify

    The Immigration Reform and Control Act of 1986 (IRCA) seeks to control illegal immigration by eliminating employment opportunity as an incentive for unauthorized persons to come to the United States, by prohibiting the hiring or continued employment of aliens whom employers know are unauthorized to work in the United States. To comply with the law, all U.S. employers must verify the employment eligibility and identity of all employees hired to work in the United States after November 6, 1986 by completing Employment Eligibility Verification forms (Forms I-9) for all employees, including U.S. citizens. Employers who hire or continue to employ individuals knowing that they are not authorized to be employed in the United States may face civil and criminal penalties.



    My point is not about making a new law as a good law is already on the books. Its about enforcing what already exists. If the feds started raiding home builders, landscape companies, meat packing plants, fast food restaurants and asserting this fines, the illegal worker issue would end rather quickly and much cheaper than building walls and racially profiling. Neither Republican nor Democrat really has the political will to do what is right and proper here. The outrage of the citizenry should be bi-partisan outrage. If you think one part is at fault and the other party the good guy, then you are only showing your ignorance on the issue.
    Last edited by upsideguy; 07-03-10 at 01:28 PM.

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    Re: Napolitano: ‘You’re Never Going to Totally Seal That Border’

    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    My point is not about making a new law as a good law is already on the books. Its about enforcing what already exists. If the feds started raiding home builders, landscape companies, meat packing plants, fast food restaurants and asserting this fines, the illegal worker issue would end rather quickly and much cheaper than building walls and racially profiling. Neither Republican nor Democrat really has the political will to do what is right and proper here. The outrage of the citizenry should be bi-partisan outrage. If you think one part is at fault and the other party the good guy, then you are only showing your ignorance on the issue.
    Oh no, they are BOTH bad guys.... Bush SIGNED the SPP 'treaties', along with the Mexican and Canadian leaders.

    Judicial Watch

    contains a library of information about the SPP, what is going to be done to make this a reality, etc... This will tell you WHY this situation is being allowed to get worse at the federal level.

    This is why, myself, as a canadian, am so utterly distraught by those developments... I try to do what I can on my end, but it's all for nothing if the americans don't do their part as well... I would add on to this, but it would probably get tossed to 'conspiracy theory' zone, since not enough people are ready to accept it as fact.

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    Re: Napolitano: ‘You’re Never Going to Totally Seal That Border’

    Los Zetas has already taken over nearly the entirety of North America and have conquered large swaths of the South West United States making them no go zones for U.S. citizens. This is not some common street gang or drug cartel we're talking about here we're talking about a highly disciplined organization with a military command structure which was founded and is still controlled by a special forces unit of trained assassins armed to the teeth with unlimited funds and resources which is willing to kill anyone (and I mean anyone) who gets in their way, there is no way to secure the border other than to resort to a war footing and that means a no man's land along the border with anti-personel mines and shoot on site authorization for our border guards.
    Sooo, what parts of the United States are "off limits" because of them? Los Zetas is a dangerous drug cartel, but to equate them to all illegal immigrants with one large stroke is ridiculous. It's like saying no one should go to the middle east because all middle easterners are terrorists.

    The Mexican Drug war is pretty terrifying, but we are already assisting Mexico through the merida initiative, and this won't be the first time in history that a very organized, heavily armed South American drug cartel is taken down. Anyone remember Pablo Escobar? That guy was the 7th richest man in the world, and he still got a bullet in the head. I think we can take care of these thugs.

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    Re: Napolitano: ‘You’re Never Going to Totally Seal That Border’

    Quote Originally Posted by somepeoplesay View Post
    Sooo, what parts of the United States are "off limits" because of them? Los Zetas is a dangerous drug cartel, but to equate them to all illegal immigrants with one large stroke is ridiculous. It's like saying no one should go to the middle east because all middle easterners are terrorists.

    The Mexican Drug war is pretty terrifying, but we are already assisting Mexico through the merida initiative, and this won't be the first time in history that a very organized, heavily armed South American drug cartel is taken down. Anyone remember Pablo Escobar? That guy was the 7th richest man in the world, and he still got a bullet in the head. I think we can take care of these thugs.
    Of course they can be taken care of.... however, the feds have ZERO interest in doing that, if anything the feds are interested in exacerbating the situation so that people accept 'blanket amnesty' as the 'solution'.

    Problem : Illegal immigration
    Reaction : OMG FEDS take care of this for us.
    Solution : Legalize illegals.

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    Re: Napolitano: ‘You’re Never Going to Totally Seal That Border’

    BmanMcfly - The money earned by illegal immigrants is an actual illegal gain, right or not?

    If, so, what should we do about it?

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    Re: Napolitano: ‘You’re Never Going to Totally Seal That Border’

    What Napolitano really meant to say was, "We are never going to seal the border. Just another misspeak by an Obama party member.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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