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Thread: Justices extend gun owner rights nationwide

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    Re: Justices extend gun owner rights nationwide

    Liberals? Hello?

    *crickets*

    Hmmm, I guess they agree with the opinion.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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    Re: Justices extend gun owner rights nationwide

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Liberals? Hello?

    *crickets*

    Hmmm, I guess they agree with the opinion.
    I am somewhere between agreeing with it and not really caring. Probably mostly leaning towards not caring, honestly.

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    Re: Justices extend gun owner rights nationwide

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    I am somewhere between agreeing with it and not really caring. Probably mostly leaning towards not caring, honestly.
    What would you think of it if it were 5-4 the other way?

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    Re: Justices extend gun owner rights nationwide

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    What would you think of it if it were 5-4 the other way?
    I would disagree, but still mostly not care. I am generally supportive of gun rights, but its a very small issue with me as it has 0 impact on my lifestyle.

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    Re: Justices extend gun owner rights nationwide

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    What would you think of it if it were 5-4 the other way?
    It would be interesting, however I think it would be difficult to for any Supreme Court to rule that it is not an individual right. Legislating from the bench is one thing, overturning 200+ years of interpretation AND the amendment itself, is another.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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    Re: Justices extend gun owner rights nationwide

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    What would you think of it if it were 5-4 the other way?
    It nearly was. Thats why its so scary to even consider liberals on the bench. They don't care what the law says. They want to enact social justice in their own image.
    Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.

    John Adams

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    Re: Justices extend gun owner rights nationwide

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    It would be interesting, however I think it would be difficult to for any Supreme Court to rule that it is not an individual right. Legislating from the bench is one thing, overturning 200+ years of interpretation AND the amendment itself, is another.
    I don't think its as cut and dry as you are making it out to be, but OK.

  8. #38
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    Re: Justices extend gun owner rights nationwide

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    I would disagree, but still mostly not care. I am generally supportive of gun rights, but its a very small issue with me as it has 0 impact on my lifestyle.
    Point to ponder Mega. and one I had to explain in a less tactful way during my college years.

    If you consider the second amendment to be less of a primary right than the first imagine not being able to speak your mind because a fellow citizen doesn't like what you have to say, so he puts a gun in your face telling you to be silent.........while you have the right to speak on paper you most probably wouldn't feel free to exercise that right. Imagine now that this same citizen knows you also may be equally or adequately armed and can fight back, he still does not like what you have to say but doesn't feel as safe in violating your rights so he chooses to let you speak freely out of fear for his own safety.
    Now, let's say no citizen is allowed to own arms but the government is........and they don't like what you have to say.........and have no problem pointing every one they have at you and demanding your immediate and continued silence, at this point your first amendment right exists only on paper as did your second amendment right, and all of the others are now interpretable at the whim of those with the power to silence and control by force.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

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    Re: Justices extend gun owner rights nationwide

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    Point to ponder Mega. and one I had to explain in a less tactful way during my college years.

    If you consider the second amendment to be less of a primary right than the first imagine not being able to speak your mind because a fellow citizen doesn't like what you have to say, so he puts a gun in your face telling you to be silent.........while you have the right to speak on paper you most probably wouldn't feel free to exercise that right. Imagine now that this same citizen knows you also may be equally or adequately armed and can fight back, he still does not like what you have to say but doesn't feel as safe in violating your rights so he chooses to let you speak freely out of fear for his own safety.
    Now, let's say no citizen is allowed to own arms but the government is........and they don't like what you have to say.........and have no problem pointing every one they have at you and demanding your immediate and continued silence, at this point your first amendment right exists only on paper as did your second amendment right, and all of the others are now interpretable at the whim of those with the power to silence and control by force.
    That's actually one of the reasons I am supportive of gun rights. However, and perhaps to my detriment, I have no desire to own one. So the personal practical effect if your scenerio is nil. Also, as a matter of practicality, there are many, many people who are extremely supportive of gun rights and I only have so much time and resources. I prefer to pick my battles and let those guys who care more take up the fight while I focus more on causes that I care more about.

    Also, I do not think our country is doing to become a despotism any time soon, or likely in my son's lifetime. So, I am not too worried about this what-if. To be fair, I think this is because I have a different concept of what rights are than most conservatives do and I don't see most changes in laws as a threat to my person, unless they directly affect me and my every-day life. I tend to be more practical and less theoretical when it comes to rights and that sort of stuff.
    Last edited by tacomancer; 06-28-10 at 01:53 PM.

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    Re: Justices extend gun owner rights nationwide

    "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Proposed Virginia Constitution, 1776

    "Laws that forbid the carrying of arms. . . disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. . . Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man." -- Jefferson's "Commonplace Book," 1774-1776, quoting from On Crimes and Punishment, by criminologist Cesare Beccaria, 1764

    -- Thomas Jefferson

    The Constitution preserves "the advantage of being armed which Americans possess over the people of almost every other nation. . . (where) the governments are afraid to trust the people with arms." -- The Federalist, No. 46

    - James Madison

    "[I]f circumstances should at any time oblige the government to form an army of any magnitude, that army can never be formidable to the liberties of the people while there is a large body of citizens, little if at all inferior to them in discipline and the use of arms, who stand ready to defend their rights and those of their fellow citizens." -- The Federalist, No. 29

    - Alexander Hamilton

    "[A]rms discourage and keep the invader and plunderer in awe, and preserve order in the world as well as property. . . Horrid mischief would ensue were the law-abiding deprived of the use of them." -- Thoughts On Defensive War, 1775

    - Thomas Paine

    "The great object is, that every man be armed."

    - Patrick Henry

    "That the people have a Right to mass and to bear arms; that a well regulated militia composed of the Body of the people, trained to arms, is the proper natural and safe defense of a free State..."

    - George Mason

    "God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion.... And what country can preserve its liberties, if its rulers are not warned from time to time, that this people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms.... The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."

    - Thomas Jefferson, in letter to William S. Smith, 1787
    The Founders obviously and explicitly considered personal arms as a right of each citizen.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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