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Thread: Robert Byrd, longest-serving member of Congress, dead at 92

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    Re: Robert Byrd, longest-serving member of Congress, dead at 92

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    You infer "political expediency" from his actions. It's easy to infer that he was a man who actually let education and experience change his worldview. You consider that a shortcoming, I find it the exact opposite.
    Incorrect. I infer "political expediency" not from his actions but from the timing of his actions. Had he dropped out of the KKK and gone on to become a crusader for civil rights then it'd be a whole different thing. But we're talking an Dixiecrat who said whatever needed to be said at the time to maintain his Senate seat, nothing more.

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    And, as I've stated, I couldn't ****ing care less what his personal views were. Irrelevant. As long as his policies reflected the views of his electorate, that's all that matters.
    That's pretty cynical of you, but I appreciate your honesty.

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    Re: Robert Byrd, longest-serving member of Congress, dead at 92

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post
    Incorrect. I infer "political expediency" not from his actions but from the timing of his actions. Had he dropped out of the KKK and gone on to become a crusader for civil rights then it'd be a whole different thing.
    LOL He was still a racist when he dropped out of the KKK.

    But we're talking an Dixiecrat who said whatever needed to be said at the time to maintain his Senate seat, nothing more.
    As long as his actions followed suit, that's all that matters.


    That's pretty cynical of you, but I appreciate your honesty.
    How is it cynical? I simply don't care what an elected official's personal beliefs are. I only care about their policies.

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    Re: Robert Byrd, longest-serving member of Congress, dead at 92

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    LOL He was still a racist when he dropped out of the KKK.
    Sarcasm? I'm not sure I understand you. He was still a racist after he dropped out of the KKK, and more importantly pursued racist policies for the next two decades or so.


    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    How is it cynical? I simply don't care what an elected official's personal beliefs are. I only care about their policies.
    You don't think it's important that politicians honestly believe in what they say? I call that cynical. I mean, that's the very definition of cynical.

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    Re: Robert Byrd, longest-serving member of Congress, dead at 92

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post
    Sarcasm? I'm not sure I understand you. He was still a racist after he dropped out of the KKK, and more importantly pursued racist policies for the next two decades or so.
    Yes, he was. That was my point. You said something about he should have join in with the civil rights movement. I'm telling you that his racial position remained relatively unchanged, however his opinion of the Klan definitely had changed. If he had gone from the Klan to a civil rights leader, that would not only have been remarkable, but completely dishonest since it's doubtful his beliefs would have changed that drastically in only one year's time. His changes came about slowly, honestly. Over the course of decades.


    You don't think it's important that politicians honestly believe in what they say? I call that cynical. I mean, that's the very definition of cynical.
    Depends on what they're saying. For instance, I'd have no issue with Byrd if he says he thinks that jews are inferior, but that he has no inclination to enact legislation discriminating against them. How is that not "honestly believing what they say"? Or someone who says they are personally against abortion and find it abhorrent, but have no desire to enact legislation to enforce that personal belief on the populace. How is that cynical? Cynism is based in distrust. What I'm saying has nothing at all to do with trust.

    Holding a personal belief and having the desire or inclination to enact legislation forcing that personal belief on others are two entirely different things.
    Last edited by rivrrat; 06-28-10 at 06:36 PM.

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    Re: Robert Byrd, longest-serving member of Congress, dead at 92

    As far as Robert Byrd goes, I'm glad he's dead. He's part of the reason most young Americans are so disenchanted with government. It is crowded by too many people who would have been forced to retire in ANY other field of work.

    As far as his race politics go. He was a racist when he was young, but hey, Bush was a heavy drinker in his age and Charlie Wilson was a womanizer. We all make mistakes. It's what you do after them that determines whether or not you've changed. He certainly changed his with actions.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Robert Byrd, longest-serving member of Congress, dead at 92

    Didn't see this previously:

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post
    I know it's been gone over already, like I said I read through the thread. I wish I'd been by when you were making these absurd claims the first time around, but I still am going to take a crack at you over them. I don't care if you're a Democrat or not, when you make excuses for racism you have to answer for it. Personally I don't get a **** about his pork barrel spending or anything like that. Maybe he had a change of heart, but that doesn't matter one bit, he was on the wrong side of civil rights. It wasn't any more acceptable when Thurmond or Lott did it either. Lott even apologized IIRC, and still got booted. The Democrats should be ashamed at their hypocrisy here.
    I'm not making excuses for anything. I'm stating that his views and policies changed over time in accordance to the changing TIMES. He did not hold on like a bulldog to outdated policies, he changed, he grew, he admitted mistakes of his past.

    I'm going to hold you to that. I wonder if you felt the same way about Obama and Rev. Wright?
    I don't recall making any judgement on Obama regarding Wright. I don't recall really caring about it at all. I had legitimate reasons not to want Obama in office.

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    Re: Robert Byrd, longest-serving member of Congress, dead at 92

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post

    As far as his race politics go. He was a racist when he was young, but hey, Bush was a heavy drinker in his age and Charlie Wilson was a womanizer. We all make mistakes. It's what you do after them that determines whether or not you've changed. He certainly changed his with actions.
    This is well said and bears repeating. We all make mistakes when we are younger. Some grow past those mistakes, so do not. Byrd apparently managed to grow past the mistakes of his youth.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    Re: Robert Byrd, longest-serving member of Congress, dead at 92

    Quote Originally Posted by Middleground View Post
    Wow, it only took one post before this got ugly.
    How so? It's the truth, something the Dems can't seem to face.

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    Re: Robert Byrd, longest-serving member of Congress, dead at 92

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Everything in WVa is named after him, so he'll be well remembered.
    Even the toilets?

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    Re: Robert Byrd, longest-serving member of Congress, dead at 92

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    He's well liked in WV because he's one of our own. He was raised in a small coal mining town by coal miners (and btw, he was born in NC), he went to local colleges. He came from humble roots, like just about everyone in WV does, and that was certainly part of his appeal. Yes, he was in the KKK in his younger years, but I applaud his candor about that time. He made a mistake and he came to understand and acknowledge that. Who here hasn't changed their views over the years?



    As for the naming of roads, etc... yeah, there's a lot of **** named after him. And no, the "people" of WV don't do the naming, but our elected officials do. The people CAN recommend names and have.
    Do you think the Democrats would have been so understanding if Byrd had been a Republican?

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