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Thread: US can 'no longer drive global growth'

  1. #51
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    Re: US can 'no longer drive global growth'

    Your obsession with military interventionism is appalling.

    This is the wrong thread to profess your beliefs in the matter; the said topic is exogenous vs endogenous growth expectations.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    Re: US can 'no longer drive global growth'

    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    The reason military spending is an obvious target as it is the most discretionary large cost we have. The social programs have been woven into the very fabric of our society. You might scale them back for future generations, but there really is very little things you can do with meaningful short-term results. Much like if you lose your job, cutting cable is easy, unloading the house is far more complex.
    Ah, but what good does it do to cut the military down only to spend more money beefing them back up when you need them? Or worse, spending more on mercenaries to balance the lack of numbers and calling it Blackwater. Cutting Defense Industry costs doesn't mean cutting military costs. Unfortunately, the first thing politicians and civilians think of is cutting military costs. This is exactly why the military was in bad shape on 9/11 and why so much had to be spent to get it fixed. In the end, cutting the military to save money cost more.

    What strikes me odd, is how people continue to insist that cutting military spending will give them their prize. I believe its because its simple and doesn't require any thinking to develop a good economical plan.

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    Re: US can 'no longer drive global growth'

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    Your obsession with military interventionism is appalling.

    This is the wrong thread to profess your beliefs in the matter; the said topic is exogenous vs endogenous growth expectations.
    Well, the thread took a turn by others. I merely jumped in and followed the discusion. As you can see from the thread, nobody's really giving the thread topic any real substance.

    Your obsession to pretend that military intervention has not been the only true fix to foriegn problems over the last couple hundred years is pathetic. I guess bombing out Iraq for a decade under Clinton wasn't military intervention? We were already intervening. Might as well do it right. I'm a student of history. Only those who are blind to its truths believe that peace and security comes with a well thought out hand shake and a treaty.

    The question here, is why are you so threatened by my posts?
    Last edited by MSgt; 06-26-10 at 01:28 PM.

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    Re: US can 'no longer drive global growth'

    Quote Originally Posted by cholla View Post
    I think we can expunge in less time than that, I for one, do not want to hand this country to my kids in the current liberal give me give me condition.
    So you'd rather give it to your children the way that Bush left it? I for one don't want to give GW the total blame, because Obama has done nothing to fix it by doling out billions to fix stuff. But, I don't think that this is all caused by liberals, as the right wants to portray. It is caused by the last several administrations to Carter, for deregulatizing Wall Street. This assumption that those that make money will not lie, steal, and cheat is a crock of crap.

    I also don't see things getting fixed with the petty partisan bull s*** that is happening everyday. I love this country, I will die for this country, but this country is in trouble, and what's sad we have no leaders Right, Left, Dem, GOP, etc., to get us on track.
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    Re: US can 'no longer drive global growth'

    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    The reason military spending is an obvious target as it is the most discretionary large cost we have. The social programs have been woven into the very fabric of our society. You might scale them back for future generations, but there really is very little things you can do with meaningful short-term results. Much like if you lose your job, cutting cable is easy, unloading the house is far more complex.

    But let's run with your ideas. Tell me exactly how you would cut social spending and what your remedy for its consequences will be. I am tired of this conservative polyanna view of the world. They have quick, but rarely very well thought out answers. I would much rather be a conservative as things are simple to them.

    1) What would you cut? and how much?
    2) What are the consequences of those cuts? (ie, if you eliminate social security and/or medicare, what happens to our elder population that has 65% of its retirement funding from social security, and what happens to the baby boomers that have no savings..... or do we just have 60% of the population over 65 homeless)
    3) What are the remedies for those consequences (how do you deal with that type of social turmoil)?

    It is very, very difficult to balance a budget in a recession, as by definition tax revenues are very low, so you are cutting the government below standard operating levels. That kind of drastic cut during a recession also tends to compound the problem, and is generally thought to be the wrong thing to do in recession. I am all for balancing a budget, but it needs to be balanced consistent with a normal run-rate.

    I am tired of conservative criticism without a conservative solutions (real solutions, not high-level fantasy).... get off your high horse and get to work. You can start here:

    Budget of the United States Government: Browse

    Or, for a simple version:

    United States federal budget - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    post of the year!
    that should be required reading
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
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  6. #56
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    Re: US can 'no longer drive global growth'

    Quote Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
    We can't get the hell out and future Presidents don't have a choice. Reagan denied our responsibilities and left them for Bush. Bush denied our responsibilities and left them for Clinton. Clinton looked for ways to depose of Hussein and wound up merely bombing him 4 times. And when 9/11 happened, people were actually shocked that our lack of responsibility came back to haunt us. What shall we deny today that will only kill more Americans later? From one president to the next, all they did was cater to the civilian's sense of "peace" by pretending that problems will fix themselves.

    The military has never lost the will to fight. It's civilians that have done this and ruined every outcome since WWII. In this war, we weren't satisfied with just chasing the dictator's army back to his borders to contain him. We finished it so that it wouldn't linger into a political mess. But this is where we stopped finishing things. Korea was merely split in half and we deal with a nuclear rogue North Korea today. Vietnam was vacated only to usher in genocide. The Gulf War was half assed and merely put on hold for a later date. We vacated Somalia only to have to deal with Somali piracy in international waters later. Bosnia has been made safe for human trafficers and gun runners and merely awaits to commence round 2.

    The greatest problem plaguing the Middle East and African nations is bad borders and corruption. As long as they remain, we will have to be involved. As long as the Kurds are split between 4 nations who encourage rebellion and uprising, we will have to be involved. As long as Saudi stability matters, we will have to be involved. As long as Israel remains, we will have to be involved. As long as Iran seeks nuclear power, we will have to be involved. And best believe that as soon as the tribes of the Middle East begin their nuclear "Cold War," the entire world will want us to be involved.

    Everybody thinks in the now as if tomorrow will fix itself. It's like looking at your check engine light for months and waiting until the engine won't start to pull out the check book. In the end, its the military that pays in blood.
    Agreed on all points...with Iraq. Afterall Iraq is the heart of the caliphate but Astan, is a different animal. To continue killing 1sies and 2sies with multimillion dollar machines because, the Taliban had bad house guests a couple of years ago will not any difference. AQ has left there a long time ago plus B Laden is dead.

    Why continue this obsession of nation building in places like Astan where it won't do any good because nothing is going to be settled.

    Seriously, anybody that thinks we are going to make a core or even seam state out of A-stan needs to re-think that idea. A high percentage of Americans don't give 2 ****s who governs A-stan just like AQ doesnt think either. Astan is not even a spec on the map of this war.

    So, why are we still there?

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    Re: US can 'no longer drive global growth'

    Quote Originally Posted by ric27 View Post
    Oh, and before you get teary-eyed on me. Call me cold hearted, but if I am to choose between a carrier battle group and helping fight AIDS in Africa...I'll take the carrier. Screw Africa
    Says the person who thinks America should fuel world growth.
    Quote Originally Posted by President Barack Hussein Obama's Inaugural Address
    Today I say to you that the challenges we face are real. They are serious and they are many. They will not be met easily or in a short span of time. But know this, America they will be met.
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    Re: US can 'no longer drive global growth'

    Quote Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
    Well, the thread took a turn by others. I merely jumped in and followed the discusion. As you can see from the thread, nobody's really giving the thread topic any real substance.
    You replied to a military expenditure comment with multiple reasons "we" should be thankful of the US armed forces. I find it odd that's all

    Your obsession to pretend that military intervention has not been the only true fix to foriegn problems over the last couple hundred years is pathetic.
    Again, not my argument and not the appropriate thread.

    I guess bombing out Iraq for a decade under Clinton wasn't military intervention?
    When in this thread do you see me defending Clinton foreign policy, or labeling it as non interventionist?

    We were already intervening. Might as well do it right. I'm a student of history. Only those who are blind to its truths believe that peace and security comes with a well thought out hand shake and a treaty.
    Ok, so you are calling for armed invasions of both Iran and North Korea as well. Good to know, however highly off topic.

    The question here, is why are you so threatened by my posts?
    Threatened? I felt it was odd that's all.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    Re: US can 'no longer drive global growth'

    Quote Originally Posted by Democrat4life View Post
    Says the person who thinks America should fuel world growth.
    I have no idea what that last bit has to do with anything. You're starting to sound like a lib.

    Im just sayin, we have no business setting up enormous bases and flooding thousands of troops in anywhere and quit, the notion of nation building in places where it won't do any good. It's counter-productive.

    Thats all

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    Re: US can 'no longer drive global growth'

    Quote Originally Posted by ric27 View Post
    Seriously, anybody that thinks we are going to make a core or even seam state out of A-stan needs to re-think that idea. A high percentage of Americans don't give 2 ****s who governs A-stan just like AQ doesnt think either. Astan is not even a spec on the map of this war.

    So, why are we still there?
    Beacuse a corrupt government that denies Al-Queda and the Tali-Ban is better than a corrupt government that doesn't. Culture is fate. This region breeds corruption and it is largely due to the bad borders and tribal divides. This is there problem. Our problem is denying our enemies a home. Al-Queda is wrecked. All of their accounts are frozen. No Arab nation will entertain them. Other terrorist organizations won't go near them. And Iran could care less about the welfare of the Sunni organization. All they have is a handful of converts or outsider Muslims in Europe or America that ignorantly choose to occassionally use their broken image to prove loyalty to Islam. But the Tali-Ban's ability to persevere is a threat. No matter how corrupt or screwed up Afghanistan's government is, it can't be allowed to give them back power.

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