Obama won´t do it and probably future Presidents won´t do it....So, what the **** are we doing there?..and whats worse is our military will lose the will of to even fight it.
Its time to get the hell out
Last edited by ric27; 06-25-10 at 11:47 AM.
I'm a cons republican, and I would cut the military significantly - but I'd still cut/eliminate tons of other programs as well.
It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
"Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911
And what did we gain in regards to Afghanistan? At least Iraq has oil. On the simplest level, the only difference Afghanistan offerred was a source for our revenge. However, on a more analytical level (where I try to swim) , the entire Middle East is a mess. And the more unhealthy it gets, the more dangerous it is for Americans. Our troops are going to fight in the Middle East as long as religious terror is being bred. This means that the region's dictators, theologies, lack of education, poverty, and tribal friction is our problem. It is a historical fact that America's security has always relied upon the health of regions abroad. The longer we ignore it and pretend that it "isn't our problem" the more blood American military personel will have to be shed to eventually deal with it. We have allies in the region and they deserve our protection as much as a blood soaked European nation does.
We pretended that the health of a Soviet free Afghanistan was not our problem. We pretended that the Tali-Ban would never be our problem. We pretended that chasing Saddam Hussein back to behind his borders was a victory. We pretended that bombing his cities for a decade would be the extent of our burden. And how much do we pretend that Saudi Arabia isn't the demon behind the monsters? Or that Iran is one step away from turning its back on nuclear power and being our friends?
The bumber sticker rally to deny Iraq's importance and our responsiblities in regards to Hussein is a pointless venture and never really had any valid argument. Hate the politicians who couldn't be straight with you. hate the irresponsible manner in which they managed it. Hate the unnecesary exxagerated economical grossness of it. But eventually, Iraq was going to happen because Saddam Hussein was our responsibility and it was one country among many in this region that needed a kick in the ass. Oh, and hate that Iraq is still a whole country. That was a tactical mistake for which many more will die for. Arabs have proven that they cannot build a healthy state where tribes are equally treated.
But let's run with your ideas. Tell me exactly how you would cut social spending and what your remedy for its consequences will be. I am tired of this conservative polyanna view of the world. They have quick, but rarely very well thought out answers. I would much rather be a conservative as things are simple to them.
1) What would you cut? and how much?
2) What are the consequences of those cuts? (ie, if you eliminate social security and/or medicare, what happens to our elder population that has 65% of its retirement funding from social security, and what happens to the baby boomers that have no savings..... or do we just have 60% of the population over 65 homeless)
3) What are the remedies for those consequences (how do you deal with that type of social turmoil)?
It is very, very difficult to balance a budget in a recession, as by definition tax revenues are very low, so you are cutting the government below standard operating levels. That kind of drastic cut during a recession also tends to compound the problem, and is generally thought to be the wrong thing to do in recession. I am all for balancing a budget, but it needs to be balanced consistent with a normal run-rate.
I am tired of conservative criticism without a conservative solutions (real solutions, not high-level fantasy).... get off your high horse and get to work. You can start here:
Budget of the United States Government: Browse
Or, for a simple version:
United States federal budget - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Last edited by upsideguy; 06-26-10 at 10:57 AM.
The military has never lost the will to fight. It's civilians that have done this and ruined every outcome since WWII. In this war, we weren't satisfied with just chasing the dictator's army back to his borders to contain him. We finished it so that it wouldn't linger into a political mess. But this is where we stopped finishing things. Korea was merely split in half and we deal with a nuclear rogue North Korea today. Vietnam was vacated only to usher in genocide. The Gulf War was half assed and merely put on hold for a later date. We vacated Somalia only to have to deal with Somali piracy in international waters later. Bosnia has been made safe for human trafficers and gun runners and merely awaits to commence round 2.
The greatest problem plaguing the Middle East and African nations is bad borders and corruption. As long as they remain, we will have to be involved. As long as the Kurds are split between 4 nations who encourage rebellion and uprising, we will have to be involved. As long as Saudi stability matters, we will have to be involved. As long as Israel remains, we will have to be involved. As long as Iran seeks nuclear power, we will have to be involved. And best believe that as soon as the tribes of the Middle East begin their nuclear "Cold War," the entire world will want us to be involved.
Everybody thinks in the now as if tomorrow will fix itself. It's like looking at your check engine light for months and waiting until the engine won't start to pull out the check book. In the end, its the military that pays in blood.