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Thread: Orrin Hatch Calls For Drug Testing Welfare Recipients

  1. #31
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    Re: Orrin Hatch Calls For Drug Testing Welfare Recipients

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Utter biased legislation.

    Why only welfare recipients? Do it for everyone and make people take the consequences of that. Higher taxes for abusers, fines and ultimately prison. That would solve a lot of problems in the US. After all a majority of drug users are not on welfare.
    Come on now Pete, even you have to agree that someone using emergency social services shouldn't also be using drugs.
    They are coming to the state saying they don't have enough money to feed/house themselves and then they turn around and buy high priced drugs.
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  2. #32
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    Re: Orrin Hatch Calls For Drug Testing Welfare Recipients

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    No, Pete, this is not what people are discussing. Drug users who are fending for themselves are not of my concern. However, when my tax dollars pay for a drug user's drug. keeping them on welfare, THAT IS my concern.
    Yes and ANY drug user, on welfare or not, is using your tax dollars... that is my point.

    In fact I would claim that drug users not on welfare are costing you far more than the welfare payments to the druggies on welfare.

    You forget that because of their drug use, billions are being used to prop op the Mexican government and other South American governments in their battle against the drug gangs. And domestically you have billions spent on putting people who have been busted for drugs through the system and putting them behind bars. And then there are the billions used on police solely used to fight the drug war. And then you have the medical costs in the long run for those addicts, that ultimately are paid by the US tax payer in one way or another (higher costs on private insurance for example).
    PeteEU

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    Re: Orrin Hatch Calls For Drug Testing Welfare Recipients

    Quote Originally Posted by zimmer View Post
    I agree, it should be a very thin and porous net, not a hammock.
    Agreed.

    Here is a really touchy line, a barrel of worms; Removing children. There are instances it should happen certainly, what they are specifically I can't define legally and won't attempt to. I think it falls into the "I know it when I see it" category, defining it legally is another matter.

    I prefer to see less government, and less intrusion into families by government. In the old days friends and family or churches intervened. That's better than the faceless, morgue-like state. You could even say I'd opt for it takes a village approach, but not as defined by Hillary. For her "village" is a coy term for state.

    .
    This is where you and I probably differ. I want something standardized, systematic, and efficient. Voluntary scenarios don't work like that. They depend on the altruism of others, which is inconsistent. Government has the best chance at creating something like this, and also has the best chance at having the "bite" to follow through with it.

    And I have no problem with children being removed from a situation that is unhealthy for them. One responsibility of government is to promote the positive rearing and growth of children. To me, if someone is using their welfare benefits for drug use, the get their benefits cut. At this point, the children are paying for the mistakes of their parents. This contradicts the government responsibility that I identified, so it behooves the government to remove those children so they are not further harmed.
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    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

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  4. #34
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    Re: Orrin Hatch Calls For Drug Testing Welfare Recipients

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    Come on now Pete, even you have to agree that someone using emergency social services shouldn't also be using drugs.
    They are coming to the state saying they don't have enough money to feed/house themselves and then they turn around and buy high priced drugs.
    Oh I agree, that is not my issue. My issue is it is a targeted politically correct proposal and not one that will solve anything.
    PeteEU

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    Re: Orrin Hatch Calls For Drug Testing Welfare Recipients

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Yes and ANY drug user, on welfare or not, is using your tax dollars... that is my point.
    Irrelevant. We are talking about welfare here. That is the topic.

    In fact I would claim that drug users not on welfare are costing you far more than the welfare payments to the druggies on welfare.
    Different topic, Pete.

    You forget that because of their drug use, billions are being used to prop op the Mexican government and other South American governments in their battle against the drug gangs. And domestically you have billions spent on putting people who have been busted for drugs through the system and putting them behind bars. And then there are the billions used on police solely used to fight the drug war. And then you have the medical costs in the long run for those addicts, that ultimately are paid by the US tax payer in one way or another (higher costs on private insurance for example).
    Different topic, Pete.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

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    Re: Orrin Hatch Calls For Drug Testing Welfare Recipients

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Oh I agree, that is not my issue. My issue is it is a targeted politically correct proposal and not one that will solve anything.
    That is your opinion. Prove it... and focus only on welfare recipients. Tell us how doing this is NOT beneficial.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  7. #37
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    Re: Orrin Hatch Calls For Drug Testing Welfare Recipients

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Irrelevant. We are talking about welfare here. That is the topic.

    Different topic, Pete.

    Different topic, Pete.
    I disagree, but whatever. I guess it is politically correct to target the weak in the US and let the rest off for doing exactly the same.
    PeteEU

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    Re: Orrin Hatch Calls For Drug Testing Welfare Recipients

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    That is your opinion. Prove it... and focus only on welfare recipients. Tell us how doing this is NOT beneficial.
    For one it will increase crime most likely.. cutting them off some income will just force them into more crime to feed their habit. Which will increase the cost for you as a tax payer. go figure.
    PeteEU

  9. #39
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    Re: Orrin Hatch Calls For Drug Testing Welfare Recipients

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Oh I agree, that is not my issue. My issue is it is a targeted politically correct proposal and not one that will solve anything.
    I happen to work with a lot of people who are on food stamps and have their children on free government medical care, when they also drink alcohol heavily(usually during work hours) and smoke weed(again during work hours).
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  10. #40
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    Re: Orrin Hatch Calls For Drug Testing Welfare Recipients

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    I disagree, but whatever. I guess it is politically correct to target the weak in the US and let the rest off for doing exactly the same.
    Disagree all you want. Your "politically correct" comments, also, are nothing but your opinion. If you have to use statements like that because you can't focus on the topic, it just proves that they have no merit.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

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