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Thread: Democrats propose further tax hike on offshore oil

  1. #61
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    Re: Democrats propose further tax hike on offshore oil

    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend_Hellh0und View Post
    You know what. Life is not fair. If it costs me a cent or two more at the pump to keep these spills from devastating my beloved country. so be it. We are taxed for so many retarded things right now, I'd be happy to see at least a penny of my money go to something that actually might help my country.
    No, no, no.
    No New Taxes. Don't get suckered into the belief taxes will make one iota of difference. It won't.
    We pay too damn much, and the money never ends up where it should.

    What need be done to stop such potential devastation is to drill where it makes sense.
    We need to step on the necks of enviromaniac leftists, and kick their enablers, the Democrats and RINO's , not in the ass, but lower.

    We have easy to access oil, and should a problem like this occur, they could access it with divers, not robots. And of course, working on land is easier.

    Interview: http://www.csnews.com/csn/news/artic..._id=1004093482

    Why We Hate the Oil Companies: Straight Talk From an Energy Insider - Newsweek

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    Last edited by zimmer; 06-10-10 at 05:51 AM.
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  2. #62
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    Re: Democrats propose further tax hike on offshore oil

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Yes. Good corporate lawyers, the difficulty of proving monetary damages indirectly linked to the oil spill, and laws that cap the amount of liability oil companies can face for incidental damage. BP may or may not be on the hook for the full cost of the immediate cleanup...but they're never going to fully compensate all of the businesses and individuals who have indirectly suffered from this.
    They are still on the hook for the clean up costs.
    I don't see why they wouldn't have to pay it.

    As for the liability cap for personal and business damages, wouldn't you call that to much regulation?
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  3. #63
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    Re: Democrats propose further tax hike on offshore oil

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    They are still on the hook for the clean up costs.
    I don't see why they wouldn't have to pay it.
    Their lawyers will hem and haw about how much the government spent on each line item of the cleanup expense, eventually settling for an amount that's less than the total cost of the cleanup.

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla
    As for the liability cap for personal and business damages, wouldn't you call that to much regulation?
    Certainly.
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  4. #64
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    Re: Democrats propose further tax hike on offshore oil

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Their lawyers will hem and haw about how much the government spent on each line item of the cleanup expense, eventually settling for an amount that's less than the total cost of the cleanup.
    That's certainly something to look into, however, the clean up should be managed cost effectively.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Certainly.
    At least we know that there is a stopping point.
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    Re: Democrats propose further tax hike on offshore oil

    Quote Originally Posted by Crunch View Post
    You are dodging the question...... how are we the consumer "not blameless in this energy situation"?
    Because the conservative mantra is "personal responsibility" and anti socialism. Why should the people pay for corporate welfare?

  6. #66
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    Re: Democrats propose further tax hike on offshore oil

    Quote Originally Posted by zimmer View Post
    No, no, no.
    No New Taxes. Don't get suckered into the belief taxes will make one iota of difference. It won't.
    We pay too damn much, and the money never ends up where it should.

    What need be done to stop such potential devastation is to drill where it makes sense.
    We need to step on the necks of enviromaniac leftists, and kick their enablers, the Democrats and RINO's , not in the ass, but lower.

    We have easy to access oil, and should a problem like this occur, they could access it with divers, not robots. And of course, working on land is easier.

    Interview: Former Shell CEO Explains Why Oil Cos. Are Hated

    Why We Hate the Oil Companies: Straight Talk From an Energy Insider - Newsweek

    .



    Read what I wrote, this would have to be ONLY for oil mitigation and cleanup, period. if it was to be used in the general fund, no dice.


    That said, I think they should cut the MMS all together (why can't the EPA handle this), and lower our taxes in that aspect to cover the increase here.
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  7. #67
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    Re: Democrats propose further tax hike on offshore oil

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    BP has already pledged to cover the cost of the current clean up.

    Why do we need a special tax, when the revenue from it will be spent immediately?
    Sounds like another excuse to tax, not to mention that it is an especially regressive tax on low income people, who are already suffering because of the recession.
    I find it curious that you are willing to trust a company on its word. My guess is that I can find posts where you doubt the word of our elected leaders (I don't know... maybe you are just a trusting guy), but I can assure you that BP officials are not of greater character nor anymore trustworthy than our elected leaders or your neighbor. Even if their intentions are genuine and not just good PR, they may (probably) lack the money. This could be a high 11 figure settlement (maybe 12 figure). That could be two, four, maybe five times their annual cash flow. It could be like any of us having to shell out five years salary. They do not have it. Fortunately there are at least 4 substantive companies that will be allocated blame and thus share the expense.

    Early evidence suggests their statements of willingness to pay 100% are mostly PR. The advances they have made to local fisherman thus far have been paltry and insulting, and apparently come with much red tape. This behavior just isn't all that consistent with remorse, nor is their consistent understatement of the problem from the get-go. They have consistently postured. I must admit, however, I am furthering rumor here. This is not something I have yet to personally verify.

    As to teachers and firefighters with pension money in BP stock, I am not sure of your point. BP is either going to pay the damage, which is going to drastically reduce enterprise value (and thus the value of all shareholders) or they are going to bankrupt the company, likely wiping out all equity. BP's market cap is off at least 50% already, reflecting current estimates of the hit to the company. The only reason the stock hasn't dropped to worthless is because there isn't real visibility on the magnitude of the damage and BP is just so big many believe it can weather the storm. People invested in BP are, and likely will be SOL.

    BTW, were you equally concerned about shareholders of Chrysler / GM in early 2009? I assume you advocated on their behalf with similar passion rather than suggesting a bankruptcy, which would wipe them out.
    Last edited by upsideguy; 06-10-10 at 12:58 PM.

  8. #68
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    Re: Democrats propose further tax hike on offshore oil

    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    I find it curious that you are willing to trust a company on its word. My guess is that I can find posts where you doubt the word of our elected leaders (I don't know... maybe you are just a trusting guy), but I can assure you that BP officials are not of greater character nor anymore trustworthy than our elected leaders or your neighbor. Even if their intentions are genuine and not just good PR, they may (probably) lack the money. This could be a high 11 figure settlement (maybe 12 figure). That could be two, four, maybe five times their annual cash flow. It could be like any of us having to shell out five years salary. They do not have it. Fortunately there are at least 4 substantive companies that will be allocated blame and thus share the expense.

    Early evidence suggests their statements of willingness to pay 100% are mostly PR. The advances they have made to local fisherman thus far have been paltry and insulting, and apparently come with much red tape. This behavior just isn't all that consistent with remorse, nor is their consistent understatement of the problem from the get-go. They have consistently postured. I must admit, however, I am furthering rumor here. This is not something I have yet to personally verify.
    There is no evidence that they won't pay and if they don't sue them in federal court.
    It's pretty simple because they are legally obligated.

    Elected leaders, on the other hand, have a history of being lying scum bags.

    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    As to teachers and firefighters with pension money in BP stock, I am not sure of your point. BP is either going to pay the damage, which is going to drastically reduce enterprise value (and thus the value of all shareholders) or they are going to bankrupt the company, likely wiping out all equity. BP's market cap is off at least 50% already, reflecting current estimates of the hit to the company. The only reason the stock hasn't dropped to worthless is because there isn't real visibility on the magnitude of the damage and BP is just so big many believe it can weather the storm. People invested in BP are, and likely will be SOL.
    BP is a multi billion dollar company, over the long term this won't affect their bottom line much.
    I'm not worried in the least.

    Share value /= real value.
    Investors are spooked because of bad news, this happens all the time.


    Quote Originally Posted by upsideguy View Post
    BTW, were you equally concerned about shareholders of Chrysler / GM in early 2009? I assume you advocated on their behalf with similar passion rather than suggesting a bankruptcy, which would wipe them out.
    GM made it's own bed to lay in, the same as BP.
    I don't want BP bailed out, just like I didn't want GM bailed out but to jump on the "I hate BP bandwagon" so early, when things haven't settled down, is just reactionary nonsense.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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  9. #69
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    Re: Democrats propose further tax hike on offshore oil

    Yes, they ought to use at least a majority of those taxes to fund clean-ups or better yet, prevent spills. AND they should open up more offshore drilling (bringing in more tax revenue) because it will help the economy and reduce our dependence on foreign oil. Win, win, win. As for the environment, I'm sure the Dems would trust their oversight and regulation committees to use those tax funds responsibly.
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    Re: Democrats propose further tax hike on offshore oil

    As the Obama Administration has now halted all Gulf offshore production, it would seem that to say your going to Tax something that will not be produced is yet another example of Obama idiocy.

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