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Thread: Poll: BP Oil Spill Response Rated Worse than Katrina

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    Poll: BP Oil Spill Response Rated Worse than Katrina

    Poll: BP Oil Spill Response Rated Worse than Katrina

    Poll: BP Oil Spill Rated Worse Than Hurricane Katrina; Most Americans Favor Pursuit of Criminal Charges According to ABC News and Washington Post Poll - ABC News


    By more than a 2-to-1 margin, Americans support the pursuit of criminal charges in the nation's worst oil spill , with increasing numbers calling it a major environmental disaster. Eight in 10 criticize the way BP's handled it – and more people give the federal government's response a negative rating than did the response to Hurricane Katrina.


    Beaches across four Gulf shore states brace for oil onslaught.
    A month and a half after the spill began, 69 percent in a new ABC News/Washington Post poll rate the federal response negatively. That compares with a 62 negative rating for the response to Katrina two weeks after the August 2005 hurricane.


    I am not suprised by this at all. Many of us have been saying this for a while. It seems that we are spinning wheels here with this oil spill. I am particularly disturbed by bubs thread where we could have been a month into building the berms that a ducth company says could be done in 4 months not 9. /facepalm
    Last edited by ReverendHellh0und; 06-07-10 at 11:45 AM.
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    Re: Poll: BP Oil Spill Response Rated Worse than Katrina

    I'll have to admit some surprise here given the amount of hate toward Bush. Public opinion will only continue to sour as we're exposed to images of oil-soaked birds, closed beaches, seafood costs through the roof, etc.

    This is also not going to help the jobs picture.

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    Re: Poll: BP Oil Spill Response Rated Worse than Katrina

    What I think is so interesting about polls and/or threads like this one is that these are the same people (Conservatives) who continue to state the government should stay out of the business of private enterprise. But the moment private enterprise screws up suddenly everyone's calling for the head of "big government" to step up and do something. Really...what do you expect the man or his Administration to do exactly? What more could the White House possibly do in a situation like this?

    1. The last major oil spill of this size that took place in the GOM occured in 1979 by a Mexican oil company. The same containment procedures were used and the spill continued until a relief well was drilled in August of that same year.

    2. People quickly forget that 11 people died in this tragic accident. The sinking of the oil rig was a rescue and recovery event before it became and environmental containment and cleanup incident. People need to remember that.

    3. By all accounts, BP didn't share all the information they had w/the White House initially. It took about a week before the Obama Administration knew the full details of how much oil was spewing from the well, as well as the difficulties it would take to cap it.

    4. Although not the first oil rig to spring a leak in the GOM, it IS the first to happen in such deep water.

    5. Society expects that the government should have all emergency equipment on "standby" for such disasters. Well, where's the responsibility of private enterprise? BP made the mess and by law wasn't it their responsibility to take all necessary safety precautions including ensuring their backup systems worked and that they had enough boom and skimmers under their control to promptly respond to this disaster before any other entity was involved?

    I think anyone who's blaming the President and his Administration for doing nothing or little to nothing are placing blame in the wrong place. It's not the role of government to handle such disasters. This is all on BP w/the federal goverment providing oversight toward capping the well, the cleanup effort and ensuring that those who have legitimate claims against BP to be paid.

    In the mind of some, I guess the government was suppose to set aside emergency equipment and keep it on standby for every private company who dedices to take the risk of drilling in deep water and put the coastal environment in danger such a disaster happen. I'm I reading the pundits correctly?

    The government was suppose to keep hundreds if not thousands of miles of boom onhand in the event of such a disaster; this isn't the job of those private oil companies who have decided to take the risk and drill for oil off-shore.

    The government was suppose to set up berms along coastal/island areas and water inlets in anticipation of such a disaster.

    The government was suppose to have hundreds of skimmers vessels waiting off the Gulf coast for just such a catastrophy.

    The government is suppose to add to this man-made environmental disaster by burning oil off the Gulf coast and further risk tourism along LA, MS, AL, FL beachfront areas.

    The government, NOT BP, has killed jobs along the Gulf coast because it was they and not BP who caused this oil leak?

    This is the exact same government that only a few months ago was saying "stay out of the affairs of private business", right?

    Sidenote: There is still a country to run. The man doesn't need to be their 24/7. That's what delegating responsiblity is all about. He's done that. IMO, the best move he has made was releaving the female Coast Guard officers who was initially overseeing the cleanup effort and coordinating events w/Commodore Allen. This man is getting the job done!!!
    Last edited by Objective Voice; 06-07-10 at 03:53 PM.

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    Re: Poll: BP Oil Spill Response Rated Worse than Katrina

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    What I think is so interesting about polls and/or threads like this one is that these are the same people (Conservatives) who continue to state the government should stay out of the business of private enterprise. But the moment private enterprise screws up suddenly everyone's calling for the head of "big government" to step up and do something. Really...what do you expect the man or his Administration to do exactly? What more could the White House possibly do in a situation like this?


    This is a strawman.


    FAIL






    1. The last major oil spill of this size that took place in the GOM occured in 1979 by a Mexican oil company. The same containment procedures were used and the spill continued until a relief well was drilled in August of that same year.

    wait, we were using containment plans from 1979? what happened to the 1994 plan?



    2. People quickly forget that 11 people died in this tragic accident. The sinking of the oil rig was a rescue and recovery event before it became and environmental containment and cleanup incident. People need to remember that.


    lame




    3. By all accounts, BP didn't share all the information they had w/the White House initially. It took about a week before the Obama Administration knew the full details of how much oil was spewing from the well, as well as the difficulties it would take to cap it.

    link please.




    4. Although not the first oil rig to spring a leak in the GOM, it IS the first to happen in such deep water.

    You can thank environmentalist wackos for sending these rigs out so far.



    5. Society expects that the government should have all emergency equipment on "standby" for such disasters. Well, where's the responsibility of private enterprise? BP made the mess and by law wasn't it their responsibility to take all necessary safety precautions including ensuring their backup systems worked and that they had enough boom and skimmers under their control to promptly respond to this disaster before any other entity was involved?

    Oil spill burn plan in place, but fire booms weren't


    washingtonpost.com







    I think anyone who's blaming the President and his Administration for doing nothing or little to nothing are placing blame in the wrong place. It's not the role of government to handle such disasters. This is all on BP w/the federal goverment providing oversight toward capping the well, the cleanup effort and ensuring that those who have legitimate claims against BP to be paid.

    As i have pointed out with simple links, the government thought it was part of thier role to protect the coast..... that said, i think there is enough blame to go around, including BP and the last 3 administrations for failures at all levels.


    In the mind of some, I guess the government was suppose to set aside emergency equipment and keep it on standby for every private company who dedices to take the risk of drilling in deep water and put the coastal environment in danger such a disaster happen. I'm I reading the pundits correctly?

    yes, that some was bj clinton, and the us coast guard who thought that. the government leased the areas and pushed them further out to sea, not only should they not allow bp or other to drill unless bp can clean and contain a spill, but the government who is responsible for the environment (epa anyone) better damn well have a back up plan that can be implemented.



    The government was suppose to keep hundreds if not thousands of miles of boom onhand in the event of such a disaster; this isn't the job of those private oil companies who have decided to take the risk and drill for oil off-shore.
    yes, according to to thier very own plan.



    The government was suppose to set up berms along coastal/island areas and water inlets in anticipation of such a disaster.

    strawman.




    The government was suppose to have hundreds of skimmers vessels waiting off the Gulf coast for just such a catastrophy.

    if they wanted to push them out that far and lease the area, they better be able to protect the coast from a failure of bp or others. yes.



    The government is suppose to add to this man-made environmental disaster by burning oil off the Gulf coast and further risk tourism along LA, MS, AL, FL beachfront areas.

    you are right, oil slicked beaches have no effect on tourism....



    The government, NOT BP, has killed jobs along the Gulf coast because it was they and not BP who caused this oil leak?
    it was "they" who have shut down all drilling.


    This is the exact same government that only a few months ago was saying "stay out of the affairs of private business", right?

    Sidenote: There is still a country to run. The man doesn't need to be their 24/7. That's what delegating responsiblity is all about. He's done that. IMO, the best move he has made was releaving the female Coast Guard officers who was initially overseeing the cleanup effort and coordinating events w/Commodore Allen. This man is getting the job done!!!
    had Obama had his way, the coast guard would not even have been there.
    كافر
    This new rhetoric to tone down the rhetoric is simply empty rhetoric.

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    Re: Poll: BP Oil Spill Response Rated Worse than Katrina

    Rev,

    Point 1 - As I listen to the news (daily I might add), those inidividuals within political circles who are speaking the loudest in opposition of how the Obama Administration has handled this oil spill are Republicans/Conservatives. Just turn on your TV and watch. I'm by no means saying that others aren't equally upset about it, but the loudest voices are (obviously) Republicans.

    Point 2 - As of July 1, 2006 in accordance with the EPA's National Contingency Plan (Title 40, chap. 1, part 109.5) that covers oil spills, it is the responsibility of state, local and reginal government agencies to ensure the necessary equipment for oil spill containment and cleanup are readily available when called upon. (You can also review the 1994 EPA NCP guidelines here.)

    Point 3 - So, what you're saying is protecting the environment was more important than a search and rescue of human lives? Save the shrimp, but leave bodies floating in the water. (Okay, so I'm being sarcastic, but that's pretty much how I viewed your response to my paragraph #2 above.)

    Point 4 - See times lines linked below:

    Timeline A (Day-to-day tracking of events from April 20 - May 24, 2010; note Obama Administration's direct involvement from April 20 - May 1)

    Timeline B (shorter timeline from 20-30 April from DeepSea News)

    Point 5 - Looks like those environmental wackos were right..to a degree. Granted, an oil spill of this size may have stood a better chance of being capped/shut-off in shallower waters, but as the President said and as the 1994 EPA NCP guidelines state, each oil drilling company is suppose to file a Spill Prevention, Control and Countermeasures (SPCC) certificate w/the federal government that outlines exactly how they would respond to such a disaster. Obviously, BP/Deepwater Horizon were not prepared for a disaster of this magnitude! (Note: I haven't been able to find BP's SPCC to determine what their contingency plans were prior to the spill; if I find it I'll post it here.)

    Point 6 - Obvious reason for not buring the oil can be read here.

    Point 7 - (See point #2)

    Point 8 - Not all off-shore drilling has been shut down; just permits for new deep water drilling, as well as most (if not all) deep water drilling per Pres. Obama's interview on the Today Show (6/8/10; a series of videos can be selected here - first 3 are germaine to the President's frustrations w/the spill, oil companies and government regulations)

    Point 9 - You're over simplifying the proposed drawdown of the Coast Guard's role here. It's no different than the military as a whole conducting base realignments in an effort to streamline resources and maximize their ability to be more affective in performing their duties. Nothing new here, but yeah. I'd be alittle concerned if the drawdown was too narrow and hampered the Coast Guard's effectiveness to respond to national disasters like this.

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    Re: Poll: BP Oil Spill Response Rated Worse than Katrina

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Rev,

    Point 1 - As I listen to the news (daily I might add), those inidividuals within political circles who are speaking the loudest in opposition of how the Obama Administration has handled this oil spill are Republicans/Conservatives. Just turn on your TV and watch. I'm by no means saying that others aren't equally upset about it, but the loudest voices are (obviously) Republicans.

    Really, even that crook rengel is pissed.


    Point 2 - As of July 1, 2006 in accordance with the EPA's National Contingency Plan (Title 40, chap. 1, part 109.5) that covers oil spills, it is the responsibility of state, local and reginal government agencies to ensure the necessary equipment for oil spill containment and cleanup are readily available when called upon. (You can also review the 1994 EPA NCP guidelines here.)


    http://www.debatepolitics.com/genera...overnment.html (EPA and the “National Contingency Plan” The Oil spill, and the failure of Government)



    Incorrect. a spill of this magnitude falls directly in the laps of the federal government, specifically the coast guard and the EPA...






    Point 3 - So, what you're saying is protecting the environment was more important than a search and rescue of human lives? Save the shrimp, but leave bodies floating in the water. (Okay, so I'm being sarcastic, but that's pretty much how I viewed your response to my paragraph #2 above.)


    Hyperbolic. We can multitask.



    Point 4 - See times lines linked below:

    Timeline A (Day-to-day tracking of events from April 20 - May 24, 2010; note Obama Administration's direct involvement from April 20 - May 1)

    Timeline B (shorter timeline from 20-30 April from DeepSea News)

    I've seen these. point?




    Point 5 - Looks like those environmental wackos were right..to a degree. Granted, an oil spill of this size may have stood a better chance of being capped/shut-off in shallower waters, but as the President said and as the 1994 EPA NCP guidelines state, each oil drilling company is suppose to file a Spill Prevention, Control and Countermeasures (SPCC) certificate w/the federal government that outlines exactly how they would respond to such a disaster. Obviously, BP/Deepwater Horizon were not prepared for a disaster of this magnitude! (Note: I haven't been able to find BP's SPCC to determine what their contingency plans were prior to the spill; if I find it I'll post it here.)

    I agree here regarding the plan. Why did the federal government fail to notice BP did not have an adequate plan? Who do you fault for this?

    Obama must have known about this failure of a plan since he suggested we cut the funding to the coast guard for such cleanup.






    Point 6 - Obvious reason for not buring the oil can be read here.


    The only thing obvious I see here, is confirmation of my other point that this falls in the lap of the POTUS, coast guard, and the EPA. Thanks for this.






    Point 7 - (See point #2)

    Point 8 - Not all off-shore drilling has been shut down; just permits for new deep water drilling, as well as most (if not all) deep water drilling per Pres. Obama's interview on the Today Show (6/8/10; a series of videos can be selected here - first 3 are germaine to the President's frustrations w/the spill, oil companies and government regulations)

    very well.




    Point 9 - You're over simplifying the proposed drawdown of the Coast Guard's role here. It's no different than the military as a whole conducting base realignments in an effort to streamline resources and maximize their ability to be more affective in performing their duties. Nothing new here, but yeah. I'd be alittle concerned if the drawdown was too narrow and hampered the Coast Guard's effectiveness to respond to national disasters like this.


    it was a cut in funding suggestion not a drawdown of role. :
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    Re: Poll: BP Oil Spill Response Rated Worse than Katrina

    This is not going to get better. The longer this goes on, and I think the oil will continue to gush out until the fall sometime.... the worse it will get. The political fallout for the White House will be massive and may actually bring down Obama - especially when it comes out that Obama didn't speak to BP's CEO after 50 days... and the excuse is "he'd just tell me what I'd want to hear". An incredulous, ignorant, and naive answer from a guy who can't lead himself out of a wet paper bag.

    This oil spill will, daily be the full story until it's stopped and will envelope all and every other issue that the WH tries to bring up. That could be good or bad --- the Administration can try to slide things under the radar while everyone's mad about the Gulf, but then again, every day it gets worse - ever day more criticism occurs, more wildlife and coastlines are dying and the majority of the oil is not coming up to the surface but traveling in plumes deep under water - where it'll land? Who knows.

    Once the oil impacts are fully realized - and that might not be for another 3-6 months - it will be the worse than Katrina and this will be unrecoverable, no matter the propaganda the White House tries to spin.
    “I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on what’s being proposed here, he’d agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute.” - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago.


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    Re: Poll: BP Oil Spill Response Rated Worse than Katrina

    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend_Hellh0und View Post
    Originally Posted by Objective Voice
    What I think is so interesting about polls and/or threads like this one is that these are the same people (Conservatives) who continue to state the government should stay out of the business of private enterprise. But the moment private enterprise screws up suddenly everyone's calling for the head of "big government" to step up and do something. Really...what do you expect the man or his Administration to do exactly? What more could the White House possibly do in a situation like this?

    This is a strawman.


    FAIL
    BULL****.

    It describes your hyper-partisan obsession with Katrina vs Oil Spill to a friggin' T.

    You scream and cry about BIG GOVERNMENT getting out of way of BIG BUSINESSES...

    However, since the oil spill you've been laughingly hypocritical.... Where's my nanny-state?!! Where's my President?!!

    But it's not about Katrina or the oil spill, it's just about you posting another attack on Obama, finding fault with your President not matter how hypocritical you look... If only the Feds were as transparent as you are.

    OV described you to a T. -- So, the FAIL (epic or otherwise) is all yours, buddy.

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    Re: Poll: BP Oil Spill Response Rated Worse than Katrina

    Quote Originally Posted by hazlnut View Post
    BULL****.

    It describes your hyper-partisan obsession with Katrina vs Oil Spill to a friggin' T.

    You scream and cry about BIG GOVERNMENT getting out of way of BIG BUSINESSES...

    However, since the oil spill you've been laughingly hypocritical.... Where's my nanny-state?!! Where's my President?!!

    But it's not about Katrina or the oil spill, it's just about you posting another attack on Obama, finding fault with your President not matter how hypocritical you look... If only the Feds were as transparent as you are.

    OV described you to a T. -- So, the FAIL (epic or otherwise) is all yours, buddy.


    Nice tantrum. have anything on the topic or are you just turgid once again for the Greatness that is the Good Reverend.


    and by all means, please lets not stoop to lying as you are known for when addressing me and stick to my actual position, not your partisan hack mouth foaming fantasies of what you would like my position to be.,



    The FEDGOV by law is tasked with containment and cleanup in addition to BP according to LAW. As you can see by searching my posts, I blame clinton, bush, AND obama for the failure of the FEDGOVS role in this disaster.


    Obama even admits this failure.

    Obama concedes mistakes in oil spill as he halts drilling | McClatchy


    I applaud him for this. Now, he needs to, as he says "kick ass" and actually do something other than suggest defunding the coast guard for cleanups of such spills...
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    Re: Poll: BP Oil Spill Response Rated Worse than Katrina

    Quote Originally Posted by hazlnut View Post
    BULL****.

    It describes your hyper-partisan obsession with Katrina vs Oil Spill to a friggin' T.

    You scream and cry about BIG GOVERNMENT getting out of way of BIG BUSINESSES...

    However, since the oil spill you've been laughingly hypocritical.... Where's my nanny-state?!! Where's my President?!!

    But it's not about Katrina or the oil spill, it's just about you posting another attack on Obama, finding fault with your President not matter how hypocritical you look... If only the Feds were as transparent as you are.

    OV described you to a T. -- So, the FAIL (epic or otherwise) is all yours, buddy.

    Where are the skimmers, and other assistance that 17 other countries offered, and were turned down by Obama?


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