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Thread: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    What you are witnessing is called a paradigm shift. When a tipping point is reached, the general perception of a situation switches, almost overnight, from one position to another, with no perceptible gentle drifting but a wholesale change from one view to another. This is a concept well described in the work of Thomas Kuhn.

    The Economist is a centre-right, economically liberal, socially conservative magazine whose allegiances have little to do with religion, ethnicity or tradition and have everything to do with promoting the interests of global capital, because of (or despite) being part-owned by the Rothschild family. What they are reflecting is a watershed in the attitude of western capitalism towards the Israeli-American concensus on Middle Eastern affairs.

    The IDF action in International waters on Tuesday morning may have a significance greater than it merits by having triggered the shift that makes western liberal capital flee from associations that damage the perception of its values across the World. I don't say this with any certainty, but when a publication such as The Economist begins to eschew that Israeli-American axis, you can be sure that a significant stream of global capital is thinking similarly.
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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    Nice selective quoting technique there, keep it up. We can all have a go. Here's the same quote in its context:

    "I can’t comfortably talk about this [Gaza] with [Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin] Netanyahu, but I can comfortably talk with Omar Bashir and tell him to his face that ‘what you’re doing is wrong.’ A Muslim cannot commit genocide. If there is such a thing, it’s impossible not to identify it. We can comfortably talk about that as well. We say: ‘You cannot do such a thing. You don’t have the right’,"

    “Turkey at least has the confidence. I also conveyed my comfort on this issue to UN Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon. I told him that we are ready if there is any duty that falls to us." [source TRT]

    See? So, in context, your quote demonstrates exactly the opposite of what you are trying to claim. Erdoğan the genocıde denier becomes Erdoğan, the man prepared to confront the war criminal. Turkey is also prepared to step up to UN duties in Darfur.

    Your attempt to demonise Turkey and its PM...big FAIL.

    No, you're attempt to spin it fails.

    Where is your SOURCE for said quote?

    Turkey has been facing heavy criticism for agreeing to host al-Bashir at a summit of the Organization for Islamic Conference (OIC) scheduled to take place in Istanbul on Monday.
    “It’s not possible for a Muslim to commit genocide,” he said. “That’s why we are comfortable [with the visit of al-Bashir].”
    Erdogan on Sunday was responding to the worldwide criticism over the controversial visit by the Sudanese leader, defending his government’s support for Al-Bashir.
    If there was such a thing [genocide], we could talk about it face to face with President Bashir,” said Erdogan, whose government itself denies the genocide of Armenian committed by Ottoman Turkey in 1915-1923.
    “Those world leaders who criticize us, have they ever visited Darfur? Their information is solely based on what the rapporteurs are reporting. These kinds of moves will not contribute to world peace,” Erdogan said Sunday in an address to members of his party.
    “We are aware of the fact that there are those who want to corner Turkey through al-Bashir’s visit. These people should know well our sensitivities about human rights violations,” Erdogan said. “I went to Darfur myself. I want to ask: How many of these worlds leaders paid a visit to Sudan, to Darfur?”
    “I went there to see it with my own eyes,” he reiterated, stressing that he did not observe that genocide was being committed during his visit.
    Erdogan went on to suggest that the Jews of Israel are the only genocidal group in the Middle East.
    Erdogan Defends al-Bashir, Says Muslims Incapable of Genocide | Asbarez Armenian News

    Come back when you can site a source not just make claims with nothing to back it up.
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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    This news is not entirely suprising. Unfortunately, I suspect that the Turkish government's steady weakening of that country's previously strong bilateral ties with Israel is a strategic choice based on its Islamist orientation. Sharp criticism and spurts of downgraded relations as happened during Operation Cast Lead and the most recent incident concerning the flotilla are probably less the result of Turkey's dissatisfaction with Israel/Israeli policy/Israeli actions, and more the result that the events offered convenient cover under which the Turkish government could continue to recalibrate its policy orientation. After all, under the guise of blaming Israeli policy, it can try to maintain a moderate image and sustain its hopes of eventually joining the EU.

    Even as Turkey denies that the Hamas terrorist group, an entity that rejects negotiations and Israel's right to exist, is a terrorist organization, Turkey takes a different approach toward the PKK. Moreover, even as Turkey complained loudly about Israel's Cast Lead operation in Gaza, Turkey has maintained its own operational freedom to conduct cross-border raids in Iraq against Kurdish terrorists. In fact, just a few years ago, Turkey was concerned that Israel wasn't lending it strong enough support when it was carrying out such raids. The reality is, both the PKK and Hamas are terrorist organizations. Turkey's new approach amounts to a double standard.

    In the meantime, Israel's policy makers should recognize the larger policy picture and understand that the Islamist government is not committed to forging and sustaining an alliance with Israel, as had been the case under former secular governments in Turkey. Hence, Israel should not rush to offer the Turkish government concessions in the hope that the status quo ante would be restored. It won't. Turkey's choice is strategic. Moreover, its strategic repositioning likely extends beyond Israel. For example, should the UN Security Council consider strengthening sanctions against Iran, there is no assurance that Turkey would support such a move. It might abstain and there is a real chance that it could vote against the measure.

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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    This news is not entirely suprising. Unfortunately, I suspect that the Turkish government's steady weakening of that country's previously strong bilateral ties with Israel is a strategic choice based on its Islamist orientation. Sharp criticism and spurts of downgraded relations as happened during Operation Cast Lead and the most recent incident concerning the flotilla are probably less the result of Turkey's dissatisfaction with Israel/Israeli policy/Israeli actions, and more the result that the events offered convenient cover under which the Turkish government could continue to recalibrate its policy orientation. After all, under the guise of blaming Israeli policy, it can try to maintain a moderate image and sustain its hopes of eventually joining the EU.
    So does Turkey criticizes Israel to get closer to Arab states/Iran or is it a move to get closer to the EU?

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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    Quote Originally Posted by bub View Post
    So does Turkey criticizes Israel to get closer to Arab states/Iran or is it a move to get closer to the EU?
    I thought those two weren't mutually exclusive.








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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    Quote Originally Posted by bub View Post
    So does Turkey criticizes Israel to get closer to Arab states/Iran or is it a move to get closer to the EU?
    Both of course..
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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Hamas has declared war upon Israel. Israel has every right to defend herself, however she sees fit. If the Palestinians really wanted peace, there would be peace. But, the election of Hamas proves that the Palestinians aren't interested in peace, only the destruction of Israel.
    So why didn't the Palestinians have peace prior to the election of Hamas in 2007 ?

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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    Quote Originally Posted by gunner View Post
    So why didn't the Palestinians have peace prior to the election of Hamas in 2007 ?

    Paul
    Why would they have?
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    No, you're attempt to spin it fails.

    Where is your SOURCE for said quote?




    Erdogan Defends al-Bashir, Says Muslims Incapable of Genocide | Asbarez Armenian News

    Come back when you can site a source not just make claims with nothing to back it up.
    Was it the word SOURCE that threw you? I quoted the source, TRT, the Turkish national broadcaster which screened the interview. You can read a report on the interview in English, with quotes, at Prime Minister Erdo

    Your 'source' has no agenda for spinning the interview to show Erdogan in the worst possible light, does it?
    Last edited by Andalublue; 06-05-10 at 09:12 AM.
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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    Quote Originally Posted by bub View Post
    So does Turkey criticizes Israel to get closer to Arab states/Iran or is it a move to get closer to the EU?
    To get closer to the Arab states/Iran without weakening ties with the EU. Turkey's biggest downgrades in its relationship with Israel come at times when Israel is under criticism from many in the international community. Hence, its substantive policy shifts don't stand out. If Turkey were to do so during relatively quiet periods, they would, and that outcome would raise questions about Turkey's reliability. Turkey very much wants to join the EU.

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