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Thread: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

  1. #111
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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    Quote Originally Posted by Gardener View Post
    My wife and I have a family friend from Iran. She was lucky enough to be able to emigrate to America in 1979, and in talking to her, it seems she both knew and didn't now the Islamist revolution was coming. The fact she emigrated when she did showed that the worried part won out over the part of her that said "It will continue to be the way it is", but she realized that the Islamism was a populist movement rather than something more artificial, and being a populist movement was much more dangerous.

    I fear for Turkey, myself. I realize what you say about the military is true, but I also fear Turkey could go the way of Iran. The Iran of the 1960s was very western compared to today, no doubt due to the Shah's being propped up by the west, but also in much of the prevailing orientation of its educated populace. It's educated populace is STILL quite modern as the green movement has shown, but they do not have political power as it is in the hands of the Islamists. What will happen in Turkey when the Islamists gain such traction that even the military cannot hold them back? Is the only alternative a strong man leader, and if so, what will that mean for Turkey in the long run?
    I wish i could tell the future. But the state structure is very different to that of Iran, but i see your concerns.
    Like it or not, Erdogan IS a moderate Islamist. Despite his flaws, he HAS given Turkey more democracy than under ANY Kemalist. We are FAR more fortunate than any Iranian ever was. We are unfortunate in the fact he is our leader, but fortunate in the sense that things could be much, much worse. We wont be like Iran under Erdogan, no chance. His prime ministry, however, could open the path for many more extreme Islamists - i will give you that much. But the military will just need to be a bit more secretive about there plans to unseat government in that scenario.

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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    Turkey is just the latest Arab nation to have someone in power that is using the Palestinians and Israeli situation for their own political gain. Like most people (I believe we have fully covered the 'most' part) here, Turks dont give a **** about the Palestinians. Ah...but to be able to whip their people in a frenzy by using Jew hatred...now THATS a tried and true method no real Jew hater can pass up.

    Look...there are some basic FACTS. Israel is CURRENTLY governed by Jewish people and has been since the late 40s. Palestinains have engaged in terrorist actions since that time and are committed to the death of Israel (not peace...not peaceful coexistence). Palestinans have also waged terror campaigns againts the Lebanese, Jordanian, and Egyptian people...so much so that NO ONE wants them. And as long as Palestinians remain commited to the destruction of Israel there will NEVER...NEVER be peace. You cant peacefully coexist with someone that is commited to your destruction.

    Hell Im not even saying I dont understand the Palestinian frustration. But the facts remain the facts. Therefore the path to peace is simple. Israel will either defend itself or die. Israel being strong FORCED positive relations with Egypt and Jordan.

  3. #113
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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Turkey is just the latest Arab nation to have someone in power that is using the Palestinians and Israeli situation for their own political gain. Like most people (I believe we have fully covered the 'most' part) here, Turks dont give a **** about the Palestinians. Ah...but to be able to whip their people in a frenzy by using Jew hatred...now THATS a tried and true method no real Jew hater can pass up.

    Look...there are some basic FACTS. Israel is CURRENTLY governed by Jewish people and has been since the late 40s. Palestinains have engaged in terrorist actions since that time and are committed to the death of Israel (not peace...not peaceful coexistence). Palestinans have also waged terror campaigns againts the Lebanese, Jordanian, and Egyptian people...so much so that NO ONE wants them. And as long as Palestinians remain commited to the destruction of Israel there will NEVER...NEVER be peace. You cant peacefully coexist with someone that is commited to your destruction.

    Hell Im not even saying I dont understand the Palestinian frustration. But the facts remain the facts. Therefore the path to peace is simple. Israel will either defend itself or die. Israel being strong FORCED positive relations with Egypt and Jordan.
    Please dont report this but are all Americans this ignorant?

    TURKS AREN'T ARABS DAMMIT!



    I love you guys really.

  4. #114
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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Turkey is just the latest Arab nation to have someone in power that is using the Palestinians and Israeli situation for their own political gain. Like most people (I believe we have fully covered the 'most' part) here, Turks dont give a **** about the Palestinians. Ah...but to be able to whip their people in a frenzy by using Jew hatred...now THATS a tried and true method no real Jew hater can pass up.
    Erdogan is a Jew hater, not Turks. I certainly am NOT one. My friends certainly are NOT. We cannot forget the days of our great friendship. This is a bumpy road in our history, it will pass with time. We've had much worse.

    By the way, did you know the word dog in Turkish also means Arab?
    Thats a deliberate connotation.
    When they betrayed us during the Ottoman days, we became even more anti-Arab than any Jewish nationalist. So your comment about Palestinians ring true.
    This is erdogan trying to gain more votes, nothing more. I for one couldn't care less about the plight of Palestinians.
    My concern is - will Israel ever live in peace? Will Arabs ever live in peace with Israel? When will strong leadership from both sides bring them to the negotiation table? And what can be done to settle at least SOME of the realistic concerns of Palestinians?

    Look...there are some basic FACTS. Israel is CURRENTLY governed by Jewish people and has been since the late 40s. Palestinains have engaged in terrorist actions since that time and are committed to the death of Israel (not peace...not peaceful coexistence). Palestinans have also waged terror campaigns againts the Lebanese, Jordanian, and Egyptian people...so much so that NO ONE wants them. And as long as Palestinians remain commited to the destruction of Israel there will NEVER...NEVER be peace. You cant peacefully coexist with someone that is commited to your destruction.
    So very true.

    Hell Im not even saying I dont understand the Palestinian frustration. But the facts remain the facts. Therefore the path to peace is simple. Israel will either defend itself or die. Israel being strong FORCED positive relations with Egypt and Jordan.
    Egypt has a blockade on Gaza too. Thats sayin' something.
    Last edited by kaya'08; 06-06-10 at 10:18 AM.

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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    Quote Originally Posted by kaya'08 View Post
    Erdogan is a Jew hater, not Turks. I certainly am NOT one..
    I would be happy to corborate that.

    and truth be told, I do have at least some tendency to hold people's views to the light in this regard.
    "you're better off on Stormfront discussing how evil brown men are taking innocent white flowers." Infinite Chaos

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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    Quote Originally Posted by kaya'08 View Post
    Please dont report this but are all Americans this ignorant?

    TURKS AREN'T ARABS DAMMIT!



    I love you guys really.
    Perhaps I should have said MUSLIMS...not ARABS...its early.

    Edit-and for the record not ALL muslims. MOST couldnt care less about the Palestinians and Israelis. It is the extremists...the fundamentalists...that use them for their own gain.
    Last edited by VanceMack; 06-06-10 at 10:40 AM.

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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Perhaps I should have said MUSLIMS...not ARABS...its early.
    Thats like calling us Greeks cause we look the same. Its insulting ;p

    No but seriously, you are spot on. Its a desperate attempt to gain votes. War gains votes in a similar fashion; by victimizing your country, you just cant go wrong as a political leader.

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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    Quote Originally Posted by kaya'08 View Post
    Erdogan is a Jew hater, not Turks. I certainly am NOT one. My friends certainly are NOT. We cannot forget the days of our great friendship. This is a bumpy road in our history, it will pass with time. We've had much worse.

    By the way, did you know the word dog in Turkish also means Arab?
    Thats a deliberate connotation.
    When they betrayed us during the Ottoman days, we became even more anti-Arab than any Jewish nationalist. So your comment about Palestinians ring true.
    This is erdogan trying to gain more votes, nothing more. I for one couldn't care less about the plight of Palestinians.
    My concern is - will Israel ever live in peace? Will Arabs ever live in peace with Israel? When will strong leadership from both sides bring them to the negotiation table? And what can be done to settle at least SOME of the realistic concerns of Palestinians?



    So very true.



    Egypt has a blockade on Gaza too. Thats sayin' something.
    Admittedly...I typed the wrong word. I have lived in Turkey for just short of two years. I get their heritage. Point is still the same...and at the moment in Turkey there is a tendency toward radical Muslim leadership. I HOPE its a hase and passing trend Turkey HAS been a good ally.

  9. #119
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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    Quote Originally Posted by MetalGear View Post
    Thats like calling us Greeks cause we look the same. Its insulting ;p

    No but seriously, you are spot on. Its a desperate attempt to gain votes. War gains votes in a similar fashion; by victimizing your country, you just cant go wrong as a political leader.
    Well hopefully the use of the word of 'nation' vs 'country' would indicate my intent. "muslim nation"..."turkish country"...its an identity thing. I typed the worng word in in haste. The post remains valid. There will NEVER be peace in Israel until one side or the other is exterminated. I dont relish the thought. I am not advocating a side...just pointing out the facts. They COULD peacefully coexist if they wanted to. But thats simply NOT going to happen.

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    Re: Hamas not a terrorist group, says Turkey's PM Recep Tayyip Erdogan

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Well hopefully the use of the word of 'nation' vs 'country' would indicate my intent. "muslim nation"..."turkish country"...its an identity thing. I typed the worng word in in haste. The post remains valid. There will NEVER be peace in Israel until one side or the other is exterminated. I dont relish the thought. I am not advocating a side...just pointing out the facts. They COULD peacefully coexist if they wanted to. But thats simply NOT going to happen.
    Im only kidding with you dont worry.
    Yes that is an unfortunate thought. But what do you think would happen if, hypothetically speaking, Israel where to return to there pre-1967 boarders and remove the blockade? Would the Arabs still be demanding, or would it just be the Palestinians?

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