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Thread: Former President George W. Bush: We waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed,

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    Re: Former President George W. Bush: We waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed,

    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend_Hellh0und View Post
    compared to the murderous US troops of course.
    Well yeah!! Of course.
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    Re: Former President George W. Bush: We waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed,

    Quote Originally Posted by ADK_Forever View Post
    Show me what Hussein did to the US to give us a legitimate reason to invade Iraq.




    The Iraq Oil-for-food Scandal


    U.S. Cites 1991 U.N. Cease-Fire Resolution as the Legal Basis for Its Invasion - Los Angeles Times



    as usual, YOU FAIL
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    Re: Former President George W. Bush: We waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed,

    Quote Originally Posted by kaya'08 View Post
    No, torture being an effective method did not get us into Iraq. They made a stupid mistake with Al Libby by not clarifying there source.

    That's right. Torture being an ineffective method did.


    Again, no. You are looking at the time torture did not work because source's where not carefully clarified enough.
    No. I'm looking at all the times it has not worked. I'm looking to the professional experts who do this stuff for a living who say torture doesn't work.

    I can wager it has worked far more than it has failed.
    Prove it.

    I never said torture doesn't produce results. I said it doesn't produce actionable, true information. A person being tortured will certainly reach his breaking point and say something. If he has something on subject to say he may say that. However, if the torture continues and he has nothing else to offer on the subject, or if he never had anything to offer, what will he do then? He will say anything that will get the torture to stop. How do his torturers know what it true and what is not? They don't. So, the torture continues and the lies continue to spew. This is what happened with KSM. He gave them so much bull**** they didn't know what was factual. Is this really so hard for you to understand?

    Do you think you would know about it anyway? Hardly something the CIA sings about. Also, what would have happened if we never waterboarded this guy? How many people would have died because we didn't know anything?
    You say this as if KSM (I assume that's who you're yapping about) gave up intel that saved anyone's life or prevented an attack. Got any proof?

    By the by, your own article makes my point.

    Well, except for one thing. Ask any American POW during the Korean War if touchless torture is no big deal. Because the fact is that touchless torture was successful in doing to American soldiers, including officers, what it succeeded in doing to Khalid Sheik Mohammed. The touchless torture employed by the North Korean communists so messed up the minds of American servicemen that they ended up zombie-like and confessing to all sorts of evil crimes, including waging biological warfare, against the communists.
    Last edited by ADK_Forever; 06-10-10 at 12:17 PM.
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    Re: Former President George W. Bush: We waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed,

    I guess posting links and asking ADK to post links to his false claims made him to avoid me all together. How lucky am I.
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    Re: Former President George W. Bush: We waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed,

    Do you have anything to add to this post besides lamely posting only 2 links? Can you explain how these links validate an act of war?

    I easily could throw your childish “FAIL” back at you but, that would be giving you too much credit. You would have to actually “begin” before you could achieve a “FAIL”.
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    Re: Former President George W. Bush: We waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed,

    Quote Originally Posted by ADK_Forever View Post
    Do you have anything to add to this post besides lamely posting only 2 links? Can you explain how these links validate an act of war?

    I easily could throw your childish “FAIL” back at you but, that would be giving you too much credit. You would have to actually “begin” before you could achieve a “FAIL”.


    My posts clearly show several reasons for the invasion of your precious saddam and iraq.



    BTW, Will you be linking to US courts convicting US Soldiers of torture for waterboarding anytime soon or are you avoiding this lie of yours hoping it will go away?


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    Re: Former President George W. Bush: We waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed,

    Quote Originally Posted by ADK_Forever View Post

    That's right. Torture being an ineffective method did.
    Source?

    No. I'm looking at all the times it has not worked. I'm looking to the professional experts who do this stuff for a living who say torture doesn't work.
    You are taking a handful of accounts it has not worked and using it as the basis of your argument. How many times has normal interrogation failed to reap results? One cannot say "torture works" or "torture does not work". Torture and normal interrogation has a varying degree of success. When somebody is put under immense pain and pressure, the chances of them talking is significantly increased. Your argument that they may say anything to stop the pain is a correct argument, but to then act on that intel without clarifying what has been told is negligence. If he/she is lying, we need to go back to the water boarding room and persist until eventually, and inevitable, they spill the beans.

    Prove it.
    I am merely making a logical assumption. Considering the nature of torture and its world wide use, can you honestly say that torture is not a quicker way of cracking the man? What makes a terrorist any more likely to tell the truth while being interrogated? These are questions YOU need to answer to effectively disprove torture.

    I never said torture doesn't produce results. I said it doesn't produce actionable, true information. A person being tortured will certainly reach his breaking point and say something. If he has something on subject to say he may say that. However, if the torture continues and he has nothing else to offer on the subject, or if he never had anything to offer, what will he do then? He will say anything that will get the torture to stop. How do his torturers know what it true and what is not? They don't. So, the torture continues and the lies continue to spew. This is what happened with KSM. He gave them so much bull**** they didn't know what was factual. Is this really so hard for you to understand?
    Read above.

    You say this as if KSM (I assume that's who you're yapping about) gave up intel that saved anyone's life or prevented an attack. Got any proof?


    Khalid Sheikh Mohammed - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    By the by, your own article makes my point.
    The article proves one point only; that torture should not be overused. A line needs to be drawn.
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    Re: Former President George W. Bush: We waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed,

    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend_Hellh0und View Post
    My posts clearly show several reasons for the invasion of your precious saddam and iraq.
    I certainly don't want to read into what your anemic posting of 2 lone links means. Can you link those 2 links to taking our country to war or not?
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    Re: Former President George W. Bush: We waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed,

    Quote Originally Posted by ADK_Forever View Post
    I certainly don't want to read into what your anemic posting of 2 lone links means. Can you link those 2 links to taking our country to war or not?




    BTW, Will you be linking to US courts convicting US Soldiers of torture for waterboarding anytime soon or are you avoiding this lie of yours hoping it will go away



    4th request, or are you conceding you were lying?
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    Re: Former President George W. Bush: We waterboarded Khalid Sheik Mohammed,

    Quote Originally Posted by kaya'08 View Post
    You are taking a handful of accounts it has not worked and using it as the basis of your argument. How many times has normal interrogation failed to reap results? One cannot say "torture works" or "torture does not work". Torture and normal interrogation has a varying degree of success. When somebody is put under immense pain and pressure, the chances of them talking is significantly increased. Your argument that they may say anything to stop the pain is a correct argument, but to then act on that intel without clarifying what has been told is negligence. If he/she is lying, we need to go back to the water boarding room and persist until eventually, and inevitable, they spill the beans.

    I am merely making a logical assumption. Considering the nature of torture and its world wide use, can you honestly say that torture is not a quicker way of cracking the man? What makes a terrorist any more likely to tell the truth while being interrogated? These are questions YOU need to answer to effectively disprove torture.
    There is nothing logical in your argument but, it is surely an assumption. You obviously know nothing about torture and take the word of only those people who line up with your political leanings.

    I do almost all the work that needs to be done on my property. Some things I may have never done before but, if it's something that I can teach myself I'll research it and do it. i.e. falling trees, running a new circuit to the pool filter, adding a garage, building a 16x24 shed, replacing a roof, replacing a main circuit breaker, etc. However, some things take specialized machines, manpower and experience that I cannot learn or do myself so, I hire experts. I needed a new driveway but, did not have access to the machines or the manpower required so, I hired a reputable local company, who came highly recommended. Same when I needed a foundation dug and poured for the garage.

    I take the same approach to torture. I listen to the professionals, and people who have actually been tortured, who know much more about this than I do. The only intelligent assumption to make on torture is that a person will say anything to stop the pain. Think about it. If I were twisting your arm almost to the point where your arm was about to break with my boot stepping on your throat, you would tell me anything to get me to stop. Our military are trained how to deal longer with torture but, they are also taught that every man has a breaking point and that all they are asked to do is to hold out as long as they can. If they break and give up information after being tortured it will not be held against them and they will not be considered traitors. Why is this? Because they know that anybody will break, sooner or later. There are no Jack Bauers.

    Also, in your argument you assume the tortured has info to give up. What if he doesn't have any and can't convince his captors of this?
    Last edited by ADK_Forever; 06-10-10 at 03:28 PM.
    Thank You Barack Obama for Restoring Honor To The Presidency.
    President Obama will rank as one of our greatest presidents!

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