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Thread: Australia begins whaling legal action

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    Re: Australia begins whaling legal action

    Quote Originally Posted by zimmer View Post
    Not.

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    Re: Australia begins whaling legal action

    Quote Originally Posted by zimmer View Post
    Not.

    In India cows are sacred. How about they start imposing their culture on our choices?

    No burgers, BBQ steaks, Philly Cheese Steak Sandwiches...

    .
    A huge number of people in India don't abstain from eating beef.

    Cows are not endangered.

    There is no practical reason to hunt whales in the numbers Japan is showing because there are plenty of other viable sea foods to choose from. It's industry that wants profits which is fueling the craze. Whale meat is considered low grade in Japan, but the seafood market has been infected with lies. Products that are sold as other kinds of fish actually contain whale; and as was already said, the government is trying to put whale meat into all primary school lunch programs, programs which are mandatory for all those in attendance.

    There is clearly an industry bias at work. It has nothing to do with cultural heritage.
    Last edited by Orion; 06-02-10 at 05:20 PM.

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    Re: Australia begins whaling legal action

    Quote Originally Posted by Gina View Post
    Japanese pro-whaling bureaucrats are arguing it's their heritage (which is untrue), not me. There is also almost no market for whale meat, so they are looking to dump it into the school lunch system (a potential health risk for their children). And if you examine those reasons alone, their continuing insistence that they need to cull for "research" purposes is a total lie, so they are acting illegally.
    Don't forget that a huge portion of the whaling industry is fueled by dolphinariums around the world, like Sea World, which are cohorts in a huge trafficking market of wild whale species. Japan can take a lot of blame but not all of it.

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    Re: Australia begins whaling legal action

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    I'm not addressing your arguments re: the true reasons behind their desire to whale, but what I'm having a hard time understanding is how you're moving from "they're not being forthright about the historical reasons why they want to whale" to "that means that it's illegal for them to whale."
    Practically all countries in the International Whaling Commission have voted to ban whaling in order to preserve many delicate species. Japan has provided nothing but unsubstantiated excuses for why it refuses to adhere to the guidelines set by the rest of the world. Even other countries in Asia are siding against Japan. One of its most common arguments is that whaling is part of its cultural heritage, but that's not true.

    The point isn't about legality, but the credibility of Japan's arguments. They are basically lying through their teeth to everyone in order to save face, instead of just coming out and saying, "No, we are going to whale if we want to."

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    Re: Australia begins whaling legal action

    Quote Originally Posted by Orion View Post
    Practically all countries in the International Whaling Commission have voted to ban whaling in order to preserve many delicate species. Japan has provided nothing but unsubstantiated excuses for why it refuses to adhere to the guidelines set by the rest of the world. Even other countries in Asia are siding against Japan. One of its most common arguments is that whaling is part of its cultural heritage, but that's not true.

    The point isn't about legality, but the credibility of Japan's arguments. They are basically lying through their teeth to everyone in order to save face, instead of just coming out and saying, "No, we are going to whale if we want to."
    If you're talking morally, that's fine, but how is it really different from the way in which every country on the planet engages in international relations? I can't remember the last time that a country didn't label its economic desires as "cultural heritage" or "interest in peace and democracy."
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    Re: Australia begins whaling legal action

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    If you're talking morally, that's fine, but how is it really different from the way in which every country on the planet engages in international relations? I can't remember the last time that a country didn't label its economic desires as "cultural heritage" or "interest in peace and democracy."
    I agree with you about international relations. It's often not very cut and dry. But if basically every country is against whaling except for Japan and there has been bountiful evidence put forward on extinction projections, then I don't see why Japan should get to make that decision.

    I believe whales are a species worth saving. They are sentient in the kingdom of mammals and there is a lot about them we still don't know. One country should not get to decide the fate of a species just because they want to make money. Meanwhile the rest of us get to watch several key species go instinct within a single lifetime.

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    Re: Australia begins whaling legal action

    Quote Originally Posted by Orion View Post
    I agree with you about international relations. It's often not very cut and dry. But if basically every country is against whaling except for Japan and there has been bountiful evidence put forward on extinction projections, then I don't see why Japan should get to make that decision.

    I believe whales are a species worth saving. They are sentient in the kingdom of mammals and there is a lot about them we still don't know. One country should not get to decide the fate of a species just because they want to make money. Meanwhile the rest of us get to watch several key species go instinct within a single lifetime.
    I agree with you in theory, but that's why international law is garbage. Unless the people/countries opposed to whaling want to go after Japan using other diplomatic methods, there's not really much they can do.

    FWIW, (and I'm in no way an expert on this), I very much doubt that Japan would let them go extinct. Someone above here noted that the whales they hunt have come off of the endangered species list, and I doubt they'd be eager to put them back on it.
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    Re: Australia begins whaling legal action

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    I agree with you in theory, but that's why international law is garbage. Unless the people/countries opposed to whaling want to go after Japan using other diplomatic methods, there's not really much they can do.

    FWIW, (and I'm in no way an expert on this), I very much doubt that Japan would let them go extinct. Someone above here noted that the whales they hunt have come off of the endangered species list, and I doubt they'd be eager to put them back on it.
    I was with you until the bolded part. I am much more skeptical. Seems that whenever there is money to be made, conservation takes a back seat, even though the species is their livelihood. Fact is, something HAD to be done before the near extinction of most whales, and it wasn't the fisherman who spurred the ban on.
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    Re: Australia begins whaling legal action

    The simple reason they won't fish them to extinction is because it is in their best interest.

    We don't hunt whales for their oil any longer... they're not endangered, so have at it I say.

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    Re: Australia begins whaling legal action

    Quote Originally Posted by zimmer View Post
    The simple reason they won't fish them to extinction is because it is in their best interest.

    We don't hunt whales for their oil any longer... they're not endangered, so have at it I say.

    .
    Zimmer... the ocean waters near Japan are practically depleted as they are now forced to import 40% of their seafood. Blue Fin tuna is well on it's way to saying buh-bye to this world. Yet they are still fished. Like I said, wherever there is money to be made, with little to no regulation, many will take advantage. Capitalism is great in many ways, but it has one major flaw. It cannot control greed.


    In Tokyo's Tsukiji market - the world's largest - they trade more than 400 different types of seafood, from wriggling eels to 300kg tuna.
    Before World War II, the vast majority of Japan's fish came from local waters. But now, because of depleted stocks, 40% of this fish is actually imported.
    BBC News - Can eco-friendly fish be big in Japan?
    “No men are anywhere, and I’m allowed to go in, because I’m the owner of the pageant and therefore I’m inspecting it,” Trump said... “‘Is everyone OK’? You know, they’re standing there with no clothes. ‘Is everybody OK?’ And you see these incredible looking women, and so I sort of get away with things like that.”

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