Page 65 of 147 FirstFirst ... 1555636465666775115 ... LastLast
Results 641 to 650 of 1469

Thread: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

  1. #641
    Baby Eating Monster
    Korimyr the Rat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Laramie, WY
    Last Seen
    11-23-17 @ 02:02 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Left
    Posts
    18,709
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    Quote Originally Posted by bub View Post
    There is still the concept of proportionality, which is not yet understood by the IDF.
    To Hell with proportionality! If someone attacks you, you don't hit back and then stop. You hit them until they beg you to stop, until they can't hit you anymore, or until your arms fall off.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Indeed. However, the fact is that you have mitigated to some level the lives of the people there.
    That's what being "the enemy" is. That's what happens when two peoples go to war against each other.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Who's the real terrorist?
    If terrorism is "using violence or the threat of violence to achieve political goals", then I would argue that all warfare and most diplomacy is terrorism. We're all terrorists-- or freedom fighters, depending on whose side you're on. It isn't a useful distinction, so I don't bother with it. There's us, our allies, our enemies, and then all the poor unfortunate souls who got themselves stuck between us and our enemies.

    Those are useful distinctions.

  2. #642
    Sage
    jamesrage's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    A place where common sense exists
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:25 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    31,073

    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    Quote Originally Posted by bub View Post
    Yeah, if you don't care about details like war crimes or international law...that's how you fight a war, indeed
    Since when are wars fought with proportionality? I do not ever remember hearing about some general who wanted to use more troops but couldnn't because the enemy didn't have that many troops. It is not how you fight a war, if anything you fight a war with disproportionality . So I have to wonder what the hell they tought you school seeing how you prescribe to such idiotic unrealistic nonsense.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  3. #643
    R.I.P. Léo
    bub's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Last Seen
    05-17-12 @ 03:54 PM
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    9,649

    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    Quote Originally Posted by Korimyr the Rat View Post
    To Hell with proportionality! If someone attacks you, you don't hit back and then stop. You hit them until they beg you to stop, until they can't hit you anymore, or until your arms fall off.
    I don't think it is necessary to debate about that. I consider this principle as the most basic one in war, you don't, we just have different values.

  4. #644
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Past the edge of the universe, through the singularity, and out the other side.
    Last Seen
    09-01-10 @ 05:23 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    4,324

    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    Quote Originally Posted by alexa View Post
    Well watching the news. We have at least two Muslim Men missing. I suspect they are missing because they are Muslim. One of them was giving broadcasts throughout the journey, hardly the actions of a terrorist and the other a Scot (they may both have been Scot's) anyway the other managed to send photos while people were being shot. He has now disappeared. He clearly was not involved in any fighting as we could see him. Dad is frightened he will be being tortured just now. They can get no word on him.

    I also listened to a retired American from one of the boats where there was no violence. He said the Israeli's beat some who were sitting down in passive resistance. This was a very old guy, maybe 70. He said his friend is in hospital because of the beating and that they will let no one see him because he is absolutely covered in bruises. The man was very shaken.
    The more I learn about the organization behind this incident the more I understand how this was the fault of pro-Islamist terrorist supporters:

    A report by the Intelligence and Terrorism Information Center (ITIC) states that in addition to its legitimate philanthropic activities, IHH supports radical Islamic networks, including Hamas, and has supported global jihad elements. In fact, IHH’s “orientation is radical-Islamic and anti-American, and it is close to the Muslim Brotherhood, Hamas’ parent movement. IHH supports Hamas and does not hide the connection between them.”

    Radical Islam Behind the Flotilla Organizers - Defense/Middle East - Israel News - Israel National News

  5. #645
    R.I.P. Léo
    bub's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Last Seen
    05-17-12 @ 03:54 PM
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    9,649

    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Since when are wars fought with proportionality? I do not ever remember hearing about some general who wanted to use more troops but couldnn't because the enemy didn't have that many troops. It is not how you fight a war, if anything you fight a war with disproportionality . So I have to wonder what the hell they tought you school seeing how you prescribe to such idiotic unrealistic nonsense.
    law maybe?

    Proportionality (law) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

  6. #646
    Sage
    Arcana XV's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Geneva, Switzerland and Rochester, NY
    Last Seen
    10-22-17 @ 10:25 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    6,412

    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    Quote Originally Posted by alexa View Post
    I also listened to a retired American from one of the boats where there was no violence. He said the Israeli's beat some who were sitting down in passive resistance. This was a very old guy, maybe 70. He said his friend is in hospital because of the beating and that they will let no one see him because he is absolutely covered in bruises. The man was very shaken.
    This account seems to corroborate what is reported in the Guardian article I posted above. If any of this is true, it's very ugly indeed. I can understand soldiers defending themselves when being attacked, but why become unnecessarily violent with people who offer no resistance at all?
    "Yes, but are you a Protestant atheist or a Catholic atheist?".- Northern Irish joke

  7. #647
    DEATH TO ANTARCTICA!!!
    Apocalypse's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Israel
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:30 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    17,211

    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    "Alright folks, that would be 2,345 Japanese soldiers killed, just as much as we've lost in Pearl Harbor. Time to go back to America."

    If only...
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

    Dante Alighieri

  8. #648
    R.I.P. Léo
    bub's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Last Seen
    05-17-12 @ 03:54 PM
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    9,649

    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    "Alright folks, that would be 2,345 Japanese soldiers killed, just as much as we've lost in Pearl Harbor. Time to go back to America."

    If only...
    How can you compare an humanitarian convoy trying to break an illegal blockade with Pearl Harbor?
    Last edited by bub; 06-01-10 at 03:22 PM.

  9. #649
    Guru

    Join Date
    May 2009
    Last Seen
    10-29-17 @ 02:04 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    4,684

    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    Quote Originally Posted by bub View Post
    How can you compare an humanitarian convoy trying to break an illegal blockade to Pearl Harbor?
    If that is the mentality, what happened is not surprising.
    George Monboit "Neoliberalism is inherently incompatible with democracy, as people will always rebel against the austerity and fiscal tyranny it prescribes. Something has to give, and it must be the people. This is the true road to serfdom: disinventing democracy on behalf of the elite."

  10. #650
    DEATH TO ANTARCTICA!!!
    Apocalypse's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Israel
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:30 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    17,211

    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    Quote Originally Posted by bub View Post
    How can you compare an humanitarian convoy trying to break an illegal blockade with Pearl Harbor?
    Obvious strawman.
    You were speaking about proportionality in wars in general, you said so yourself and I have witnesses.
    That's what I was replying to.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

    Dante Alighieri

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •