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Thread: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

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    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    So what we have here is two sides who cannot agree on legality, on appropriateness of action and reaction. We have several injured people one one side, several dead on the other, which people of both side just see as counters in the continuing fight and not as the tragedy it is. No one is willing to give an inch or see the possibility that their side acted less than appropriately.

    Just another day in the ME. Makes me sad.
    I agree, to a point..... what would you suggest when a people decide you have no right to exist and are doing everything in their power to make it so?
    There is no such thing as a “Natural Born Dual-Citizen“.

    Originally Posted by PogueMoran
    I didnt have to read the article to tell you that you cant read.

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    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    Quote Originally Posted by Crunch View Post
    You left out one little detail there.... Israel does not occupy Gaza, they just control access to it. Big difference in law.
    I think that is why by law it is occupied.
    George Monboit "Neoliberalism is inherently incompatible with democracy, as people will always rebel against the austerity and fiscal tyranny it prescribes. Something has to give, and it must be the people. This is the true road to serfdom: disinventing democracy on behalf of the elite."

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    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    Based on what appears to have happened, I have a very hard time mustering up any sympathy for these people. The kind of person that gets involved in this **** and then tries to fight with soldiers does so with the express goal of provoking conflict so that they can make a huge deal out of it. They got exactly what they bargained for.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    Quote Originally Posted by Degreez View Post
    You're the one who seems to have trouble grasping international law. Forcefully boarding any ship in international waters is piracy.
    So boarding go-fast boat in international waters is piracy?


    forcefully boarding a humanitarian ship is even worse.
    That ship had intent to run their blockade. They were smugglers not a humanitarian ship.


    Israel's defense is that the ship had intent to break its blockade around Gaza. There are many things wrong with this defense, because:
    - the blockade is illegal.
    What's illegal about it?

    Israel refuses to play the part of Occupying Power despite it's effective control on everything that goes in and out of Gaza.
    The provisions of the GC apply to occupied state territory. Which states territory is Israel occupying?

    - the ship was not a merchant vessel, which is the only type of vessel that can be boarded if its intent is to break a legal blockade.
    No according to the San Remo Memorandum a humanitarian ship would fall into the category of merchant vessel which is defined as:

    Definitions


    (i) merchant vessel means a vessel, other than a warship, an auxiliary vessel, or a State vessel such as a customs or police vessel, that is engaged in commercial or private service;

    Only vessels which are conducting humanitarian missions agreed upon by both conflicting parties are exempt.

    Classes of Vessels Exempt From Attack

    (c) vessels granted safe conduct by agreement between the belligerent parties including:

    (i) cartel vessels, e.g., vessels designated for and engaged in the transport of prisoners of war;
    (ii) vessels engaged in humanitarian missions, including vessels carrying supplies indispensable to the survival of the civilian population, and vessels engaged in relief actions and rescue operations;

    San Remo Manual on International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea

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    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    Quote Originally Posted by Crunch View Post
    I agree, to a point..... what would you suggest when a people decide you have no right to exist and are doing everything in their power to make it so?
    My opinion is that there is no side I would call "the good guys" over there. When you look at the overall conflict, it's my opinion that both sides seem to have a preference for a continued conflict, not finding some peace.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    Oh nice trump card Crunch... Don't actually refute what he says but call him a hater of Israel, even if they did something wrong... wow. What an argument.
    I, and many more besides me have proven time after time that what Israel did was fully within international law. He/she/it refuses to accept that and keeps dragging that crap that if they didn't sign on to said law they can't use it or enforce it. That is just plain bull**** and anyone with two brain cells to rub together knows it. Thanx showing your own ignorance of the conversation.... par for the course.
    There is no such thing as a “Natural Born Dual-Citizen“.

    Originally Posted by PogueMoran
    I didnt have to read the article to tell you that you cant read.

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    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    Quote Originally Posted by alexa View Post
    The UN considers Gaza still occupied. It is put quite well here


    Is Gaza 'occupied' territory? - CNN.com
    Has the UNSC stated that Gaza is occupied? Because the UNGA is a joke and their sentiments do not have the force of law. Furthermore; whose territory are they occupying? Which state is claiming that Israel is occupying their territory?

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    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    Quote Originally Posted by Crunch View Post
    I agree, to a point..... what would you suggest when a people decide you have no right to exist and are doing everything in their power to make it so?
    Mark Thomsen says this was a direct response to the Likud Party saying in 1977
    Unquestionably however, the Hamas document is a response to the Likud Party Platform of 1977 that reflected similar thoughts of many Israelis, particularly West Bank settlers, when it rejected any two-state solution to the Palestinian-Israeli crisis:
    "The right of the Jewish people to the land of Israel is eternal and indisputable and
    is linked with the right to security and peace; therefore Judea and Samaria will
    not be handed to any foreign administration; between the Sea and the Jordan
    there will only be Israeli sovereignty." D4
    http://www.christianzionism.org/Article/Thomsen01.pdf
    George Monboit "Neoliberalism is inherently incompatible with democracy, as people will always rebel against the austerity and fiscal tyranny it prescribes. Something has to give, and it must be the people. This is the true road to serfdom: disinventing democracy on behalf of the elite."

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    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    The point is you get the power to do certain things when you sign the document, which binds you to behaving in a certain manner.

    If you don't sign the document, then your authority in international waters and that of the Somalian pirates is exactly the same.


    Israel is stealing ships and taking the crews hostage with the intention of ransoming them back? LINK?
    There is no such thing as a “Natural Born Dual-Citizen“.

    Originally Posted by PogueMoran
    I didnt have to read the article to tell you that you cant read.

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    Re: Israel intercepts Gaza flotilla, says Hamas

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    So what we have here is two sides who cannot agree on legality, on appropriateness of action and reaction. We have several injured people one one side, several dead on the other, which people of both side just see as counters in the continuing fight and not as the tragedy it is. No one is willing to give an inch or see the possibility that their side acted less than appropriately.

    Just another day in the ME. Makes me sad.
    Sometimes, for a little while, there is a lull in the violence...then everything returns to normal (snafu).
    Do not write in this space!

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