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Thread: Arizona gov. signs bill targeting ethnic studies

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    Re: Arizona gov. signs bill targeting ethnic studies

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    I wouldn't support teaching a separate class on the Civil War. But, I agree...it should be taught in a much more nuanced and historically accurate way versus "The South Was Evil so The North Kicked Its Ass" which seems to be the norm.
    So you wouldn't also support teaching a seperate class on the vietnam war to focus on latino's taking part in it?

    I'm not even saying this as some kind of big advocate for changing how we teach about the south and the civil war in this country. The victors write the history books and while I do think a little bit more nuance at higher grade classes could be good, I think the more generic explanations are fine for our lower grades.

    I'm saying it because I know that many of those that seemingly have no issue with a history class that focuses more on a latino view of American history rather than an American view of American history but would fight tooth and nail, grabbing every fallacy and every exaggeration possible in the process, to have a similar class teaching a southern view.

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    Re: Arizona gov. signs bill targeting ethnic studies

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    Did I say that? However, US American history really isn't about a bunch of savages crossing the bering strait.
    I swear to god I haven't been able to do this in such a long time:


    [nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1klLTb1rbE"]YouTube- Savages - Pocahontas[/nomedia]

    Your lack of pride in your heritage is a little disappointing.
    I can wave my flag and pay my taxes until my arm goes sore, but that does not save me from getting shafted by the United States or by a fellow American.



    You don't think this law is a step in that direction?
    I think education and specifically the University system is the last bastion against stringent government regulation. Occasionally the Feds like to poke their nose into courses, because they know that most revolutions and anti-establishment movements start at the University.

    I agree to a certain degree with the ideals of the bill, but I don't think it is Arizona's right to force education in such a way.
    "I do not underestimate the ability of fanatical groups of terrorists to kill and destroy, but they do not threaten the life of the nation. Whether we would survive Hitler hung in the balance, but there is no doubt that we shall survive al-Qa'ida." -- Lord Hoffmann

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    Re: Arizona gov. signs bill targeting ethnic studies

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    No, its teaching a class about a specific culture from the mindset of that culture rather than teaching a standard american history class, just like their teaching a class in the mindset of a specific culture rather than teachin a standard american history class.
    Show us all the class where this is being done. Circular reasoning will not do.

    Want to know the first sign your arguments weak? When you start playing spelling nazi. Yeah, sorry, don't give a **** enough about arguing with you to sit here and run everything through spell check or read read things a dozen times to see if I didn't accidently hit the s key before I hit the e.

    There's nothing "revisionist" about what I typed, its simply a different view point. One contrary to what's typically thought of and viewed by American History classes.

    I'll give you a free be here. You may not want to tell posters to get the **** out, its uncivil and its flaming, figure I'd be kind and say it here since you're doing it to a mod so that another doesn't come from behind and act on it.

    But fine, since you want to nit pick and continue to dance around the question...fine, take my exact same question and remove your questionable "revisionist" part. Have it simply a southern heritage class that focuses on the other reasons, ALONG with Slavery, that the south went to war (or are you seriously claiming slavery was the first, second, and ONLY reason). Have it still study Jackson and Lee. Have it look at the Southern Culture of that time. Have it look at what Southerns have contributed to the country since then.

    Nothing revisionist there, nothing that can even be claimed to be revionist. So again, how about rather than getting on your little soap box because you can't dare to actually admit you're being amazingly biased and hypocritical, grabbing onto one little line and using it as if nothing else within it existed, and now answer the question truthfully and honestly.
    Oh good lord, the mod is going to cry us all a river. If you don't like it and can't take being called out for your intense intellectual dishonesty that's fine - but don't come crying about having your feelings hurt when you're one of the biggest baiters on this forum.

    If the class wants to teach about Southern Poverty? No problem at all. If the class teaches the South was decimated during the Civil War? Fine. If the class teaches the destruction of the South lead to incredible amounts of poverty in the South? Fine. When the class veers into the complete intellectual dishonest you're suggesting then no it's not fine. But that's not what we have here is it?

    We have you declaring that the class is revising history. On what grounds? Have you seen the books being read in the class? What about the events being discussed? Have you actually sat in any of these classes yourself and could provide any kind of information for us to see other than your word?

    No. You're being intellectually dishonest in your comparison. Don't like it? Take your ball home.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Arizona gov. signs bill targeting ethnic studies

    Quote Originally Posted by Arch Enemy View Post
    I swear to god I haven't been able to do this in such a long time:


    YouTube- Savages - Pocahontas
    You probably could have waited a while longer because that really did nothing for me or for you.

    I can wave my flag and pay my taxes until my arm goes sore, but that does not save me from getting shafted by the United States or by a fellow American.
    we are probably at an impasse here if thats all you think pride in your heritage is about waving a flag and paying taxes.

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    Re: Arizona gov. signs bill targeting ethnic studies

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    I'll explain why I say 'Republican Revisionism'. In the last 40 years, the Republican Party and the Democratic Party have switched voting blocks. While this is for various reasons, the Republican Party has now taken up the role of defending the Republican created myth of 'States Rights'. Disenfranchised poor whites in formerly heavy Democrat areas of the South are now States Rights supporting Republicans of the South.
    Which does zero to address the fact that Lincoln was the Republican in the Civil War.

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    Re: Arizona gov. signs bill targeting ethnic studies

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    Which does zero to address the fact that Lincoln was the Republican in the Civil War.
    Actually it does. If MODERN Republicans defended 'states rights' using Lincoln it would be political suicide. The civil war was devastating to the South and many rightfully blamed Lincoln for this. Why would any modern Republican party use that type of damaging information? Why would a modern Republican party which is highly dependent on Southern white men use Lincoln as a spokesperson of any sort? The modern Republican base who is so quick to say that Democrats use to be racist forgets that they weren't always pro-'States rights'. Republican Revisionism indeed.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Arizona gov. signs bill targeting ethnic studies

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Actually it does.
    Actually, it DOESN'T.

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    Re: Arizona gov. signs bill targeting ethnic studies

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    Actually, it DOESN'T.
    Says you pumpkin. :\
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Arizona gov. signs bill targeting ethnic studies

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Says you pumpkin. :\
    Says reality. Lincoln was the Republican. You would like to revise the history of the US and lay every ill at the feet of Republicans without acknowledging the great strides in Civil Rights that Republicans took.

    You don't get to do that. That's exactly what's wrong with "ethnic studies" as it is.

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    Re: Arizona gov. signs bill targeting ethnic studies

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Show us all the class where this is being done. Circular reasoning will not do.



    Oh good lord, the mod is going to cry us all a river. If you don't like it and can't take being called out for your intense intellectual dishonesty that's fine - but don't come crying about having your feelings hurt when you're one of the biggest baiters on this forum.

    If the class wants to teach about Southern Poverty? No problem at all. If the class teaches the South was decimated during the Civil War? Fine. If the class teaches the destruction of the South lead to incredible amounts of poverty in the South? Fine. When the class veers into the complete intellectual dishonest you're suggesting then no it's not fine. But that's not what we have here is it?

    We have you declaring that the class is revising history. On what grounds? Have you seen the books being read in the class? What about the events being discussed? Have you actually sat in any of these classes yourself and could provide any kind of information for us to see other than your word?

    No. You're being intellectually dishonest in your comparison. Don't like it? Take your ball home.
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