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Students Wearing American Flag Shirts Sent Home

No, I'm not. I don't agree with your draconian interpretation and you aren't going to convince anyone here that having a flag pattern is a breach of the code.

Ok, let's get one thing straight, it is not my interpretation. What I have posted above is taken directly from United States flag code, verbatim. If you think it is "draconian" then that is your opinion and you entitled to it, but you should be aware that what you think is "draconian" is the official Flag Code as promulgated by Congress, not simply my interpretation of it.
 
Yes, the bulk of things the flag pattern is on tells me Jall is correct.

Why? Flag Code is voluntary. The first amendment permits any desecration of the flag, from burning it to wearing it as apparel. But that doesn't make it respectful, just allowed.
 
Does that help clear things up?
Not really, considering you took that out of context. Did you happen to read the header of said chapter and following sentence?
§3. Use of flag for advertising purposes; mutilation of flag
Any person who, within the District of Columbia, in any manner, for exhibition or display, shall place or cause to be placed any word, figure, mark, picture, design, drawing, or any advertisement of any nature upon any flag, standard, colors, or ensign of the United States of America;
And continues to a point of where a fine of no more than a $100 can be imposed.
Your statement was "I have a problem with somebody wearing a flag as apparel."
It has been pointed out the lad had on a t-shirt with an imprint of the flag. Since there were no writing, advertisement, mutilation or other desecration's, a claim of disrespect is unsustainable.
 
Ok, let's get one thing straight, it is not my interpretation. What I have posted above is taken directly from United States flag code, verbatim.

Yes, with your own interpretive spin on the code.
 
Not really, considering you took that out of context. Did you happen to read the header of said chapter and following sentence?

I am shocked at the level of sophistry to which you guys are willing to descend in order to rationalize the disrespectful action of wearing a US flag as apparel.

Title 4 Chapter 1 Section 3 covers a lot of ground, but the most pertinent to this discussion is the definition of "flag" which I have quoted here repeatedly. The definition applies to the word "flag" as used "herein" meaning within the Flag Code, not simply within the section. It clearly states that the Flag Code applies to "any flag, standard, colors, ensign, or any picture or representation of either, or of any part or parts of either, made of any substance or represented on any substance, of any size evidently purporting to be either of said flag, standard, colors, or ensign of the United States of America or a picture or a representation of either, upon which shall be shown the colors, the stars and the stripes, in any number of either thereof, or of any part or parts of either, by which the average person seeing the same without deliberation may believe the same to represent the flag, colors, standard, or ensign of the United States of America."

Again, this does not apply just to section three but the entirety of the flag code. It boggles my mind how you could, with any intellectual integrity, say that it only applies to "flags flown from a staff" or whatever nonsense you are trying to spin this as. It applies to all flags or pictures of flags, period. This is taken for granted throughout the flag code. Section 8(j) restricts the use of lapel pins and patches, so even without the definition provided in section 3, it is clear that it does not apply only to literal flags meant to be waved from a staff, but to all representations of flags (just like the definition says, funny how that works, huh?).

Taken in conjunction with section 8(d) and 8(j) it is obvious to anyone who cares to ascertain the plain meaning that this is meant to restrict the use of any representation of a flag on apparel, athletic uniforms or costumes. Furthermore, athletic uniforms and other sort of apparel aren't even supposed to have a flag patch on them at all, unless they are the uniform of a patriotic organization.

I did not, repeat, not make this up. This is well known.

See this link for example.

Perhaps I haven't been doing the best job of explaining it, but I have tried in my poor way to get it across to you guys. I feel after three or four pages of this, that it is you guys who are trying your hardest to avoid understanding the full implications of US Flag code. It makes me sad that your desire to rationalize your disrespectful behavior outstrips your desire to properly preserve the dignity of the US Flag, but I guess that's just human nature. Normally I would just stop trying to persuade you by now, but when you insult the flag it is not just me or my personal interpretation of flag code that you are offending, but the millions of men and women who have fought and died to preserve the freedom that the Flag represents. The Flag Code says that the Flag is a living being and that is not just metaphor, it is a fact. Please, please, treat the flag with the dignity it deserves.
 
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I am shocked at the level of sophistry to which you guys are willing to descend in order to rationalize the disrespectful action of wearing a US flag as apparel.

It's not disrespectful. It is an expression of patriotism.
 
Guy Incognito/QUOTE said:
Your quote....
I have a problem with somebody wearing a flag as apparel. It is obscene and disrespectful to the flag.
And by Jove I think you got it.....
but to all representations of flags
Finally, as the code points out, a "representative" of the flag and not the flag per se.
The t-shirt's not a flag, but a representation, facsimile, symbol. The wearing of such apparel is neither obscene nor disrespectful.

Edit: Changed not to nor..........r and t too close together
 
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This Giant red herring of a derailment is irrellevant. THey were not sent home for violating flag code, they were sent home because apparently the American Flag is offensive on a fake mexican holiday.
 
This Giant red herring of a derailment is irrellevant. THey were not sent home for violating flag code, they were sent home because apparently the American Flag is offensive on a fake mexican holiday.

or 'cause they were **** stirring the mexican kids, which one do you reckon is more likely?
 
or 'cause they were **** stirring the mexican kids, which one do you reckon is more likely?





If the chicanos were "stirred" by the flag of this great nation on a fake mexican holiday, created by corona beer, they can go eff themselves right on back to TJ for all I care. :shrug:
 
If the chicanos were "stirred" by the flag of this great nation on a fake mexican holiday, created by corona beer, they can go eff themselves right on back to TJ for all I care. :shrug:

That's a pretty racist thing to say.
 
How so specifically. I want you to detail the fail you are about to expose on your part. :lamo

Sure.

If the chicanos were "stirred" by the flag of this great nation on a fake mexican holiday, created by corona beer,

Mocking an ethnic holiday.

BTW - when I first heard of Cinco De Mayo, Corona beer hadn't hit the states. So you were making stuff up to mock an ethnic holiday. Pretty low.

It's a day that some Mexican-Americans celebrate their heritage. FACT.
What you think of it is irrelevant. But waving a flag in their face, obviously baiting them... come on, Rev, don't play stupid.


they can go eff themselves right on back to TJ for all I care. :shrug:

I already pointed this out to you in another thread -- the old "they should go back to where they came from" is classic KKK, white pride b.s. I never took you for that type, maybe I was wrong.
 
Sure.



Mocking an ethnic holiday.



BTW - when I first heard of Cinco De Mayo, Corona beer hadn't hit the states. So you were making stuff up to mock an ethnic holiday. Pretty low.


The origins of 'Cinco de Mayo' | Spero News




It's a day that some Mexican-Americans celebrate their heritage. FACT.
What you think of it is irrelevant. But waving a flag in their face, obviously baiting them... come on, Rev, don't play stupid.


They are fools for taking a made up holiday and using it as thier st patricks day. Furthermore, on st pats, columbus day, or any other "ethnic" holiday, an American flag, is not considered offensive






I already pointed this out to you in another thread -- the old "they should go back to where they came from" is classic KKK, white pride b.s. I never took you for that type, maybe I was wrong.



They are the ones who have a problem with this country, and if they don't like it, they can leave, whether they are mexican, canadian, tavulan, irish, etc... Nothing to do with race, color of skin, or heritage. the fact you want to make it a racist thing speaks not to my bigotry..... :shrug:
 
@Reverend Hellhound

Perhaps it is irrelevant to this discussion of this nonissue, but it is a much significant problem than the fact that some disruptive kids were sent home from school.

Do you get a headache from trying to bend reality to your moronic interpretations?

The fact is that you are the one who is misinterpreting Flag Code, it is in eminently clear on the matter:2wave:
 
@Reverend Hellhound

Perhaps it is irrelevant to this discussion of this nonissue, but it is a much significant problem than the fact that some disruptive kids were sent home from school.
:




I don't find wearing patriotic colors disruptive especially over a fake mexican holiday. :shrug:
 
It's a day that some Mexican-Americans celebrate their heritage. FACT.
What you think of it is irrelevant. But waving a flag in their face, obviously baiting them...


Ok, so it is like St. Patricks day for the Irish Americans. I don't believe that I have ever heard of any Irish getting bent out of shape at seeing the American flag on March 17th, have you?


j-mac
 
I don't find wearing patriotic colors disruptive especially over a real mexican holiday. :shrug:

Fixed.

Also, it doesn't really matter what you find disruptive, now does it? Are you a school administrator at the school in question? Is it your job to keep fights from breaking out in a high school? Do you even know what happened apart from reading a few news articles about this incident?
 
Fixed.

Also, it doesn't really matter what you find disruptive, now does it? Are you a school administrator at the school in question? Is it your job to keep fights from breaking out in a high school? Do you even know what happened apart from reading a few news articles about this incident?





It's only "real" in the state of Puebla, and there is is a minor holiday. As one who has traveled extensivly throughout non tourist Mexico, and lived in places like New Mexico, I can assure you, it's Corona y limo day for de gringos day.
 
I support the rights of the students who were sent home. However, I dont know what they did or said to merit being sent home.

As for me, if a guy decked from head to toe in Old Glory threatened me or my family, I would most certainley kick his ass, no matter what he was wearing.

The hate and ignorance from some righties on this thread is astounding. Do we need to boycott you too?:2razz:
 
They are fools for taking a made up holiday and using it as thier st patricks day. Furthermore, on st pats, columbus day, or any other "ethnic" holiday, an American flag, is not considered offensive

Again, you're playing stupid and trying to ignore the bigger picture context.

Also -- waving an American Flag does NOT make those doing the waving pure. (see all photos of skinheads and KKK holding flags).

The point it, we know what the boys were up to. YOU know what the boys where up to. Trying to make a statement about being American on a Mexican holiday. Trying to BAIT the other students into a conflict.



They are the ones who have a problem with this country, and if they don't like it, they can leave, whether they are mexican, canadian, tavulan, irish, etc... Nothing to do with race, color of skin, or heritage. the fact you want to make it a racist thing speaks not to my bigotry..... :shrug:

Again with KKK/white pride crap. Where is that coming from? I never figured you for that type.
 
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The fact is that you are the one who is misinterpreting Flag Code, it is in eminently clear on the matter:2wave:

You are correct about one thing: it is clear on the matter. It is clear that wearing a flag pattern is not a breach of the code. :2wave::2wave::2wave:
 
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