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Student convicted of hacking Sarah Palin e-mail account

Zyphlin said:
Far be it for me to agree with ADK, and I'd love to see anyone say he's somehow a favorite of mine, but you're off base.

If he hadn't put "hack" in quotation marks I'd say you're perhaps correct. But he did, signifying to anyone being objective in reading his context, and not just trying to punch the other side every chance possible, that he was meaning the more commonly thought of term of "hacking" when most hear it. The Mitnicks and Poulsens of the world.

Using Password crackers, using worms to get information, using packet sniffers, using keyloggers, etc.

What this kid did was a step below a "script kiddie", let alone a real actual hacker.

Its kind of like saying that someone plays basketball and someone "is a baller". The kid by definition hacked into her account, but the kid in all reality and common use of it is not a legit hacker.

What this guy did was the technology equivalent of finding the house key under the welcome mat. Is it illegal? Yes. Is it wrong? Yes. Should he be punished? Yes. Should he be excused? No. Is he some grand hacker or on par with what most people think of when they hear the word 'hacker"? No. Is he likely any kind of threat if he didn't get 25 years? Unlikely unless he gets lucky with a few other people having very stupid security answers.

Which is in part the point ADK was making....don't put your spare house key under the guest mat, don't make your password and security question something that a monkey with a keyboard and google can determine.
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Who said he was a "grand hacker" or even "legit hacker"? Its not in the article or anywhere in this thread. It simply said he hacked her account which he did. I don't understand why you are assigning terms that were never used by the article or anyone in here.

If you think I attack everyone on a strictly partisan basis you should read the thread where I defended Clinton's actions in the IRA peace talks.

I dont know where you get the idea that putting a word in quotes means you aren't denying the definition of the word in question.

Did you read the definition I provided? It absolutely falls under hacking.

The question wasn't whether or not it met the definition of how a specific group of online users views the word but whether or not he actually did hack which he absolutely did.

There is no point in arguing the nuances of the word itself unless you are trying to downplay the crime itself which is what he was doing no matter what public service announcement he included afterward.
 
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Did you fail to see where I said yes, technically, by definition its hacking. However that the way ADK put it in quotes when he didn't really "hack" it the context seemed clear through the rest of ADK's post that he was implying that the kid didn't hack it in the way most people think of when they hear someone "hacking"...the glamorized, hollywoodized, cyber infiltrator that bypasses the computer systems and breaks in. The kid did the digital equivalent of finding the key under the welcome mat. ADK wasn't excusing what the kid did but was saying if anything it needs to be a learning lesson to people that even a dumbass with little real "hacking" skills can get into your email if you use crappy passwords and googleable security questions...much like after you hear someone got their house "broken into" because someone found a key in a likely place and walks in you don't excuse the person that "broke" in but you probably are telling people "See, this is why its not smart to put a key there".

And much like that non-digital crime...yes, I'm FAR more worried about our justice system putting behind bars a guy whose made it a career and a profession to know how to pick locks, bypass security systems, and slip into any house or location than someone who randomly decides to check for a key under a mat to a house of a person they wouldn't mind just screwing with, finds it, goes in, and messes around with some things but does not giant lasting harm.

Does that mean the latter guy is innocent, or shouldn't be punished? Absolutely not. Does that mean I think one is far more a danger to society? Absolutely.
 
This thread is hilarious. No one is really defending the guy that I can see, but if you read the posts of the right wingers here, you would think "the left" is somehow lockstep in backing this guy. I know none of our right wing friends would even be at all dishonest in their presentation....
 
Would you prefer that right-wingers jump to conclusions about the left defending a felon?

Nobody is defending the guy because what he did was indefensible. This wasn't a parent shooting and killing someone who was hurting their child. This wasn't someone stealing bread to fight off starvation. This was some liberal smartass kid performing a federal offense against a right-winged politician.
 
Gipper said:
Would you prefer that right-wingers jump to conclusions about the left defending a felon?
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Too late, it's already been done

TurtleDude said:
The "end justifies the means" is the mantra of the BDS infected left. Undermining Palin was necessary for the left so anything done in that regards was justified to them.
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Gipper said:
Nobody is defending the guy because what he did was indefensible. This wasn't a parent shooting and killing someone who was hurting their child. This wasn't someone stealing bread to fight off starvation. This was some liberal smartass kid performing a federal offense against a right-winged politician.
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Yeah, he was pretty much exactly that. What he is is a criminal. No one is arguing that point that I can see. What I do see is lots of accusations that the left is defending him, with no evidence. This happens alot. It's like certain people think if they just repeat the lie often enough, people will believe it.
 
I don't think they're defending that this kid is somehow some sort of freedom fighter that's one bullet away from martyrdom. What I do think is happening is that a lot of the left are downplaying what he did in noticeable amounts.

I was the one who said that some people were treating him like some professional hacker when all he did was read "password cracking for dummies" and picked on a rather unintelligent politician who doesn't have the internet protection sense that God gave an Amish person. Having said that, what he did was very wrong. Should he fry? No. Lock him up and throw away the key? No. However, he does need to have some serious reprocussions thrown his way. Maybe 6 months to a year in jail, if for nothing else than to punish stupidity, which is not done enough in today's America. It would also serve to discredit his father, who should also be punished for raising such a stupid little boy.
 
Gipper said:
I don't think they're defending that this kid is somehow some sort of freedom fighter that's one bullet away from martyrdom. What I do think is happening is that a lot of the left are downplaying what he did in noticeable amounts.

I was the one who said that some people were treating him like some professional hacker when all he did was read "password cracking for dummies" and picked on a rather unintelligent politician who doesn't have the internet protection sense that God gave an Amish person. Having said that, what he did was very wrong. Should he fry? No. Lock him up and throw away the key? No. However, he does need to have some serious reprocussions thrown his way. Maybe 6 months to a year in jail, if for nothing else than to punish stupidity, which is not done enough in today's America. It would also serve to discredit his father, who should also be punished for raising such a stupid little boy.
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Except that those of us on the left are saying basically the same thing, but being told we are somehow defending this guy. To put it another way, some of "the rabid far right" are basically lying to try and make a point. It's hilarious how often I am told what I believe by these people, and how it is never, not once, accurate.
 
Zyphlin said:
Did you fail to see where I said yes, technically, by definition its hacking.
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No I got that. What I said was that I don't understand why you are trying to parse the definition of the word or apply phrases no one ever used?

However that the way ADK put it in quotes when he didn't really "hack" it the context seemed clear through the rest of ADK's post that he was implying that the kid didn't hack it in the way most people think of when they hear someone "hacking"?...the glamorized, hollywoodized, cyber infiltrator that bypasses the computer systems and breaks in. The kid did the digital equivalent of finding the key under the welcome mat.
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Most people? You really think Joe Q public really knows the nuances of different forms of hacking? And how does that change the fact that's exactly what he did?

ADK wasn't excusing what the kid
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That isn't what I said. I said he was downplaying it which is absolutely correct.

did but was saying if anything it needs to be a learning lesson to people that even a dumbass with little real "hacking" skills can get into your email if you use crappy passwords and googleable security questions...much like after you hear someone got their house "broken into" because someone found a key in a likely place and walks in you don't excuse the person that "broke" in but you probably are telling people "See, this is why its not smart to put a key there".
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How is that not blaming the victim and not at the very minimum downplaying the crime he committed?

There's a big difference between "let this be a lesson to everyone" message and a "its her fault her security sucked" message.

And much like that non-digital crime...yes, I'm FAR more worried about our justice system putting behind bars a guy whose made it a career and a profession to know how to pick locks, bypass security systems, and slip into any house or location than someone who randomly decides to check for a key under a mat to a house of a person they wouldn't mind just screwing with, finds it, goes in, and messes around with some things but does not giant lasting harm.
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How offtopic are you going to get?

This isn't a comparison of one crime or another, its about this crime and this crime alone.

You sound like the guy who gets pulled over and tells the cop "why aren't you going after murderers instead of me?"

Does that mean the latter guy is innocent, or shouldn't be punished? Absolutely not. Does that mean I think one is far more a danger to society? Absolutely.
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And again, why are you even entertaining the conversation of trying to compare this to another fantasy crime? This case wasn't about how serious this crime was compared to another theoretical crime, it was about this crime and this crime alone.
 
Redress said:
This thread is hilarious. No one is really defending the guy that I can see, but if you read the posts of the right wingers here, you would think "the left" is somehow lockstep in backing this guy. I know none of our right wing friends would even be at all dishonest in their presentation....
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There is a difference between claiming someone is downplaying the crime and claiming someone is defending the crime. Could you point to the posts of the "right wingers" that have said the left is defending the crime committed?
 
Redress said:
Except that those of us on the left are saying basically the same thing, but being told we are somehow defending this guy.
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Again, please point to the quote from a "right winger" in this thread accusing you or anyone else in here of defending the crime he committed

To put it another way, some of "the rabid far right" are basically lying to try and make a point.
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Please provide the evidence for this charge of lying.
 
texmaster said:
There is a difference between claiming someone is downplaying the crime and claiming someone is defending the crime. Could you point to the posts of the "right wingers" that have said the left is defending the crime committed?
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Can you point to the post where I said any one was claiming the left is defending the crime committed? See, I did not say that, what I said is defending the guy who committed the crime, which I can easily show. In fact, I don't have to go past post # 2 to do that.

bicycleman said:
You have to look at the perspective, here. He'll probably get a slap on the wrist. Heck by the Dems viewpoint, he was a freedom fighter for the cause against that NAZI right-winged fanatical Sarah Palin. Now if this had been a conservative hacking into Obama's account, he'd get 30 years at hard labor.
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texmaster said:
Again, please point to the quote from a "right winger" in this thread accusing you or anyone else in here of defending the crime he committed



Please provide the evidence for this charge of lying.
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Don't try and change my words. That is painfully dishonest. Funny that, being dishonest in trying to disprove my charge of dishonesty. Consistent I guess.
 
Redress said:
Can you point to the post where I said any one was claiming the left is defending the crime committed? See, I did not say that, what I said is defending the guy who committed the crime, which I can easily show. In fact, I don't have to go past post # 2 to do that.
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Nothing in that post says he claimed liberals defended the crime itself.

It was an obvious satirical comment not a direct accusation.

But since there are so many, you shouldn't have a problem coming up with a direct accusation right?
 
Redress said:
Don't try and change my words. That is painfully dishonest. Funny that, being dishonest in trying to disprove my charge of dishonesty. Consistent I guess.
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If you wish to choke on your own words, go right ahead.

To put it another way, some of "the rabid far right" are basically lying to try and make a point.
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And you call me dishonest? Who said this if not you Redress?

all I asked you for was a quote of a right winger on here lying and instead of admitting you fabricated yet another accusation, you deny your own words.

Consistent I guess
 
texmaster said:
Nothing in that post says he claimed liberals defended the crime itself.

It was an obvious satirical comment not a direct accusation.

But since there are so many, you shouldn't have a problem coming up with a direct accusation right?
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OK, this is obviously too complex for you, so I will slow it down a lot more for you. Read me words I posted. I talked about hos some on the right are claiming the left is defending the guy, not the crime. See this large, unsubtle difference. I even proved it with a quote. I will give you some time to try and follow through this extremely complex chain of thought.
 
Redress said:
OK, this is obviously too complex for you, so I will slow it down a lot more for you. Read me words I posted. I talked about hos some on the right are claiming the left is defending the guy, not the crime. See this large, unsubtle difference. I even proved it with a quote. I will give you some time to try and follow through this extremely complex chain of thought.
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Actually you didn't. No one used the word defend. What he said was that some on the left would claim he was a freedom fighter, an obviously satirical comment. He never said that they defended the crime itself as you claimed. At best it supported my original statement that some on the left are downplaying the crime. Nice try.

And way to go ducking my last reply exposing yet another false accusation you made that you couldn't defend about right wingers "lying".

Watching you duck it and run away from personal responsibility for your own false accusations was amusing if not predictable.
 
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texmaster said:
Actually you didn't. No one used the word defend. What he said was that some on the left would claim he was a freedom fighter, an obviously satirical comment. He never said that they defended the crime itself as you claimed. At best it supported my original statement that some on the left are downplaying the crime. Nice try.

And way to go ducking my last reply exposing yet another false accusation you made that you couldn't defend about right wingers "lying".

Watching you duck it and run away from personal responsibility for your own false accusations was amusing if not predictable.
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See, this is spin. I did not make up the quote, I simply quoted it. It's words are what they are. He was lying about liberals. Don't like it, well, then talk to him, not me, since he is the one who did it.
 
TurtleDude said:
His theme song is hopefully going to be Rodney Carrington's PRISONER OF LOVE
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Wishing rape upon someone. Wow how civilized of you. You know, the fact people are so coy about prison rape is actually shocking. We do no officially sanction is at as punishment of the state, yet it is essentially allowed.

You sir should be ashamed. Perhaps a child molestor deserves to be raped in prison over and over, but an email hacker... For shame. I don't give a **** what side he's on. I wouldn't wish it on Obama's hacker if it so happened.
 
Redress said:
See, this is spin. I did not make up the quote, I simply quoted it. It's words are what they are.
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You quoted it as an argument to prove your original claim that right wingers claimed Democrats were defending the charges which proved false.

You didn't simply quote it. You claimed it backed your statement that right wingers were claiming Democrats were defending this kid when it said no such thing.

He was lying about liberals. Don't like it, well, then talk to him, not me, since he is the one who did it.
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It was not a statement of fact and you know it.

This constant game you like to play when you get caught making false statements is tiresome. Next time just keep your generalities to yourself and I wont have to embarrass you by asking you to support your accusations.
 
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Gipper said:
"Hack" is such a strong word. He guessed her account questions. Quit hyping him up as the next Swordfish.

If you want to see a real hacker, fly to Moscow and take a look around.
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No, he's a hacker. Now the kind you talk about in Russia are crackers. There's a difference. No matter how he did it, He guessed her password and went in and did damage, something he had no right to do.
 
Meanwhile, that kid who tried to wiretap a politician's office after framing ACORN gets a slap on the wrist and conservatives hail him as a hero.

I think both ACORN-boy and this kid are idiots. They both committed crimes and somehow managed to convince themselves that they were doing the right thing.
 
Jetboogieman said:
Wishing rape upon someone. Wow how civilized of you. You know, the fact people are so coy about prison rape is actually shocking. We do no officially sanction is at as punishment of the state, yet it is essentially allowed.

You sir should be ashamed. Perhaps a child molestor deserves to be raped in prison over and over, but an email hacker... For shame. I don't give a **** what side he's on. I wouldn't wish it on Obama's hacker if it so happened.
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save me your feigned indignaty. This kid was doing his best to derail Palin's campaign. I wouldn't lose any sleep if someone called in a cleaner on him. He is a scum bag and getting some "domestic attention" from Bubba Big Johnson would serve the little twit right
 
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