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Thread: Ariz. governor signs immigration enforcement bill

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    Re: Ariz. governor signs immigration enforcement bill

    I read the Arizona SENATE BILL 1070 but I do not see that is actually says that all "immigrants” need to produce an ID to prove that they are not illegal. I thought that it said aliens. The way I see it not all immigrant aliens as not all aliens are illegal. An immigrant is an alien up to the time he becomes naturalized and at that point becomes a citizen hence an immigrant yes but no longer an alien.


    From the first two readings of that thing I cannot tell if I will be harassed as an alien in Arizona or not.
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    Re: Ariz. governor signs immigration enforcement bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Chappy View Post
    I doubt illegal immigrants are going to stand out so conveniently for the governor's sake. But, that was really the point, Hispanics ‘look’ illegal wherever they were born to some Arizonans. This legislation is really the “Driving or walking or spitting or ****ing breathing while Hispanic law.”
    Do you realize that some cities in the Phoenix metro area do not allow their LE officers to check a persons status even after being arrested for other crimes?

    Again, show me where in the Law that LE is going around just checking. IMO, and prove me wrong that LE will check after they have stopped someone for doing something else wrong (traffic violation, etc). This racial profile spin is just that spin.
    Why are so may protecting the "illegals". I would be happy to have them all shipped to CA. Would SF accept them?
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    Re: Ariz. governor signs immigration enforcement bill

    I.C.E. enforces immigration laws, not local police. If local law enforcement officers spend their time checking the papers of everyone they suspect of being an illegal immigrant as the law requires, do you think that community cooperation with them will be severely impacted? I do. This law has created a whole new criminal class and is about to reap that whirlwind.
    “Real environmentalists live in cities, and they visit what's left of the wilderness as gently and respectfully as possible.” — Donna Moulton, letter to the editor, Tucson Weekly, published on August 23, 2001

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    Re: Ariz. governor signs immigration enforcement bill

    Quote Originally Posted by F107HyperSabr View Post
    I read the Arizona SENATE BILL 1070 but I do not see that is actually says that all "immigrants” need to produce an ID to prove that they are not illegal.

    I thought that it said aliens. The way I see it not all immigrant aliens as not all aliens are illegal.
    If you are not naturalized you are already required to carry your immigration documents.

    An immigrant is an alien up to the time he becomes naturalized and at that point becomes a citizen hence an immigrant yes but no longer an alien.
    Are there actually any legal distinctions between an alien and a immigrant?
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

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    Re: Ariz. governor signs immigration enforcement bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Chappy View Post
    I.C.E. enforces immigration laws, not local police. If local law enforcement officers spend their time checking the papers of everyone they suspect of being an illegal immigrant as the law requires, do you think that community cooperation with them will be severely impacted? I do. This law has created a whole new criminal class and is about to reap that whirlwind.
    You missed my point, in some cities LE would not even bother to call ICE, even after the person was in custody.

    What new class. It is not legal by Federal Law to be in the US without permission.

    So why should Az continue to tolerate almost 1/2 million illegals in its State.
    Do you feel the Feds are doing an adequate job? I don't.
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    Re: Ariz. governor signs immigration enforcement bill

    Quote Originally Posted by mike2810 View Post
    You missed my point, in some cities LE would not even bother to call ICE, even after the person was in custody.

    What new class. It is not legal by Federal Law to be in the US without permission.

    So why should Az continue to tolerate almost 1/2 million illegals in its State.
    Do you feel the Feds are doing an adequate job? I don't.
    In San Francisco they ignore federal laws and purposefully provide cover for people in this country illegally. The very liberal group-think city is a "sanctuary city" for illegals.

    It has caused the city problems, for example:
    San Francisco: Sanctuary City Gone Awry - SFGate

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    Re: Ariz. governor signs immigration enforcement bill

    Quote Originally Posted by mike2810 View Post
    You missed my point, in some cities LE would not even bother to call ICE, even after the person was in custody.

    What new class. It is not legal by Federal Law to be in the US without permission.

    So why should Az continue to tolerate almost 1/2 million illegals in its State.
    Do you feel the Feds are doing an adequate job? I don't.
    And you missed my point that far from being a crime fighting law, this will create zones in each Arizonan community where local law enforcement can expect zero cooperation.

    But, no the federal government has not kept up in its enforcement responsibilities and it's a bipartisan failing no doubt. The major parties are split, both of them, there is no national consensus.

    The solution is not for states to get into the act as Arizona has. And Arizona is about to find out why. I have already alluded to the crime fighting myth but more important is the fact that we can never secure our own liberty by limiting that to a minority of our population. That's what this bill does.
    “Real environmentalists live in cities, and they visit what's left of the wilderness as gently and respectfully as possible.” — Donna Moulton, letter to the editor, Tucson Weekly, published on August 23, 2001

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    Re: Ariz. governor signs immigration enforcement bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Chappy View Post
    And you missed my point that far from being a crime fighting law, this will create zones in each Arizonan community where local law enforcement can expect zero cooperation.

    But, no the federal government has not kept up in its enforcement responsibilities and it's a bipartisan failing no doubt. The major parties are split, both of them, there is no national consensus.

    The solution is not for states to get into the act as Arizona has. And Arizona is about to find out why. I have already alluded to the crime fighting myth but more important is the fact that we can never secure our own liberty by limiting that to a minority of our population. That's what this bill does.
    I disagree. The law does not limit the "hispanic" population in AZ. Time will tell. First the law has to be enacted and that won't happen till summer. Second, it most likely will have to survive the courts.

    I don't feel "illegals", no matter where they come from have a right to be here or stay. They came in the wrong way. I support legal immigration. I do not support those that can't follow the law.

    IMO, Az on the right track. Sharpton doesn't like it.
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    Re: Ariz. governor signs immigration enforcement bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    The probable cause is the issue.

    Just what is going to be probable cause?


    Looking Mexican? Speaking Spanish?

    If just once an American citizen or legal immigrant is stopped for either of those two reasons I hope that PD and the state is sued and for millions of dollars.

    If you had any experience with the situation here in AZ, you would know that it is fairly easy to tell the illegals from the one who have been through the process of obtaining legal papers.
    Of course, there are no absolutes, although I am sure that Police officers, who deal with lawbreakers every day, will have even more experience than the average Joe.

    You know that federal law already requires legal immigrants to carry ID anyway, don't you?

    Not any real change happening here except that now the local law enforcment have another tool to use.

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    Re: Ariz. governor signs immigration enforcement bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    A few citizens of a specific ethnicity will be inconvenienced. Not all citizens. As such it is discriminatory.

    And the state will be force to pay punitive damages which tend to be rather large in the US.

    If Arizona wants to do this they should put up check points and check the citizenship of each and every person they stop, be they caucasian, hispanic, asian or african. Lets see how many Arizona residents woudl then support this law
    There are already checkpoints that do this very thing on the main thoroughfares coming up from Mexico. They ask me if I am a US citizen every time I drive through.

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