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Thread: Remembering Katyn, 70 years later

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    Remembering Katyn, 70 years later

    [html][/html]BBC News - Remembering Katyn, 70 years later
    Remembering Katyn, 70 years later

    For 50 years, the Russians blamed the murder of more than 20,000 officers of the Polish army on Nazis and mythical Nazi "coloaborators.

    Mikhail Gorbachev admitted "Soviet responsibility" but failed to aplogize. KGB SLUG Putin invited the Polish prime minister to attenda ceremony in Russia marking the 70th anniversary of the Katyn massacre of Poles but failed to apologize for Russian barbarism.

    Some of you wonder whysome of us have no sympathy for Russians in the fight with the patriotic Chechens well read about Katyn and remember that Katyn is just a drop in the lake of muderous behavior and deeds committed by the Russian savages just in the last century.

    Please read these few sentences and get the piture of some of us have known since age 7[html]Stalin then gave the order to murder the prisoners.

    They were shot in the back of the head, their bodies dumped in mass graves in Katyn and at other sites.

    The names of 21,857 Polish citizens are listed among the victims on Soviet documents.
    [/html]
    Last edited by F107HyperSabr; 04-07-10 at 09:32 PM.
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    Re: Remembering Katyn, 70 years later

    Quote Originally Posted by F107HyperSabr View Post
    BBC News - Remembering Katyn, 70 years later
    Remembering Katyn, 70 years later

    For 50 years, the Russians blamed the murder of more than 20,000 officers of the Polish army on Nazis and mythical Nazi "coloaborators.

    Mikhail Gorbachev admitted "Soviet responsibility" but failed to aplogize. KGB SLUG Putin invited the Polish prime minister to attenda ceremony in Russia marking the 70th anniversary of the Katyn massacre of Poles but failed to apologize for Russian barbarism.

    Some of you wonder whysome of us have no sympathy for Russians in the fight with the patriotic Chechens well read about Katyn and remember that Katyn is just a drop in the lake of muderous behavior and deeds committed by the Russian savages just in the last century.
    Methinks you should change your name to "107%HyperPartisan".

    Although I agree that, as far as my historical knowledge of that incident goes, it was a horrific atrocity...blaming all of Russia and all Russians for it is unreasonable.
    Education.

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    Re: Remembering Katyn, 70 years later

    I think somewhere in Putins mind stalins attrocities are not attributed to him or the Russian Federation.

    But rather to the past Soviet Union. and I'm gonna go ahead and assume you dont think all Russian people are barbarians. Cause they are not. But it is true historically the Russian and Soviet Security forces in particular have been incredibly brutal not only in this case but in Chechnya and other places.

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    Re: Remembering Katyn, 70 years later

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    Methinks you should change your name to "107%HyperPartisan".

    Although I agree that, as far as my historical knowledge of that incident goes, it was a horrific atrocity...blaming all of Russia and all Russians for it is unreasonable.
    Bringing out the truth for the world to see has nothing to do with "partisanship". Partisanship involves political parties and one's adherence to the propogation of partisan political positions and the defense of a political party.

    Exactly which political party did I prop up ? None you say! Well I guess that I am not a partisan at all am I!!
    I do not recall the Viet Cong asking me if I was a natural born or Naturalized American before they shot at me, they just shot at all of us f107HyperSabr

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    Re: Remembering Katyn, 70 years later

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    I think somewhere in Putins mind stalins attrocities are not attributed to him or the Russian Federation.

    But rather to the past Soviet Union. and I'm gonna go ahead and assume you dont think all Russian people are barbarians. Cause they are not. But it is true historically the Russian and Soviet Security forces in particular have been incredibly brutal not only in this case but in Chechnya and other places.
    Well I see that you are an intelligent person and do see that I am not calling "all Russians" barbarians at all. Just as I am sure you nor I would call all Germans during the Nazi era "barbarians". The reason that I do at times use tough words when discussing the history and behavior of Russia, it's child - the USSR, and curently the Russian Federation is that few people know about he history of Russian/Soviet -Russian crimes against humanity.

    You are also correct that Russian and Soviet 'Security ' forces "have been incredibly brutal not only in this case but in Chechnya and other places". I have to point out "events" such as Katyn because many people also do not know about "events" such as the Russian designed and contrived famine in Ukraine where they killed 8- 10 million people in the 1930's.

    The sad truth is that just as there were enough Germans to go along with Nazi barbarism there were enough common Russians to fill the ranks of Russian and Soviet Security forces.
    Last edited by F107HyperSabr; 04-07-10 at 09:57 PM.
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    Re: Remembering Katyn, 70 years later

    Quote Originally Posted by F107HyperSabr View Post
    Well I see that you are an intelligent person and do see that I am not calling "all Russians" barbarians at all. Just as I am sure you nor I would call all Germans during the Nazi era "barbarians". The reason that I do at times use tough words when discussing the history and behavior of Russia, it's child - the USSR, and curently the Russian Federation is that few people know about he history of Russian/Soviet -Russian crimes against humanity.

    You are also correct that Russian and Soviet 'Security ' forces "have been incredibly brutal not only in this case but in Chechnya and other places". I have to point out "events" such as Katyn because many people also do not know about "events" such as the Russian designed and contrived famine in Ukraine where they killed 8- 10 million people in the 1030's.

    The sad truth is that just as there were enough Germans to go along with Nazi barbarism there were enough common Russians to fill the ranks of Russian and Soviet Security forces.
    This is all very true. When one adds not only the Soviet Unions Foreign crimes against humanity but their domestic ones, in such as the Famine in Ukraine or the Forced Relocations of Minorities and the great purges under Stalin, not even considering the incredible crimes commited in the Soviet Satellite states after world war two.

    I think there is a denial of the past so as to seperate the Russian Federation from the Soviet Union. And besides it's not as if Russia has ever claimed to be the bastion of Human Rights.

    It's a sad ass fact. But I guess it is fact.

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    Re: Remembering Katyn, 70 years later

    Love this line "it's not as if Russia has ever claimed to be the bastion of Human Rights. "

    Sadly that can be said for too many countries but when that is the case for a country the size of the current Russian Federation or china or Indonesia or the many other Muslim states we need to worry for humanity.
    I do not recall the Viet Cong asking me if I was a natural born or Naturalized American before they shot at me, they just shot at all of us f107HyperSabr

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    Re: Remembering Katyn, 70 years later

    Quote Originally Posted by F107HyperSabr View Post
    Bringing out the truth for the world to see has nothing to do with "partisanship". Partisanship involves political parties and one's adherence to the propogation of partisan political positions and the defense of a political party.

    Exactly which political party did I prop up ? None you say! Well I guess that I am not a partisan at all am I!!
    Not limited to political parties.

    Partisan - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary

    1 : a firm adherent to a party, faction, cause, or person; especially : one exhibiting blind, prejudiced, and unreasoning allegiance
    If you notice something good in yourself, give credit to God, not to yourself, but be certain the evil you commit is always your own and yours to acknowledge.

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    Re: Remembering Katyn, 70 years later

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    Not limited to political parties.

    Partisan - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary

    1 : a firm adherent to a party, faction, cause, or person; especially : one exhibiting blind, prejudiced, and unreasoning allegiance
    Well since my point of view is based upon open minded views, non prejudicial, and very reasonable since my views are rooted deeply and soundly in facts and history I am not parisan in the least bit.

    Futhermore most of us free thinking people march to our own drummer and we do that very well.
    I do not recall the Viet Cong asking me if I was a natural born or Naturalized American before they shot at me, they just shot at all of us f107HyperSabr

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    Re: Remembering Katyn, 70 years later

    Why in hell would any sane person expect Gorbachev to apologize for something he had nothing what ever to do with.

    I am always curious why idiots expect people to apologize for things they had nothing to do with.

    It's a meaningless idiotic gesture like apologizing for slavery today. Am I sorry it happened? Sure but I didn't have one damn thing to do with it. Neither did any of my poor ancestors and I can't apologize for what they did anyway.

    It's been pretty much been an open secret that this massacre was carried out but the Russians from the start I believe.

    Stalin managed to kill over 20 million of his own people and this was merely a blip on the radar of time.

    It serves no real purpose other than setting the history books straight and maybe make one or two very old people feel better for a few minutes, but it changes nothing.

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