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Thread: Obama Limits When U.S. Would Use Nuclear Arms

  1. #71
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    Re: Obama Limits When U.S. Would Use Nuclear Arms

    After WWII Truman entered the U.S. into a series of treaties and conventions which limited American action outside of international agreements and shared policies and thereby allowed us to escape the traditional fate of the world's leading power: fear and loathing of unilateral, arbitrary action.

    The U.S. had more power and influence in the world during the Cold War years precisely because it had agreed to act in concert with its allies; it constrained its power, so then everyone felt comfortable with its power.

    The Nonconservatives rejected the Truman Doctrine, basically saying the U.S. should be free to act as it saw fit without the entangling fetters of allied interests. President George W. Bush broke with the policies of every president since Truman and moved America outside of these long standing treaties and conventions, creating ad hoc alliances based on unilateral American action.

    It was a disaster. The unilateral actions in Iraq left America with sole responsibility for the cost and casualties there. The withdrawal from the Kyoto treaty left America out of the discussion entirely. America's foreign policy initiatives were met with the traditional fear and loathing the world's leading powers in the past centuries had experienced.

    Now, President Obama is restoring the Truman Doctrine to the center of American foreign policy; by acting in concert with allies and committing to comply within internationally accepted standards, America will regain its proper role of influence in the world without the fear and loathing the Bush Doctrine incurred.

    I don't doubt that there are doctorates in international studies being written about this history, but, for this amateur, in a nutshell that's why I think Obama's declaration this week was important and a good thing for our country.
    “Real environmentalists live in cities, and they visit what's left of the wilderness as gently and respectfully as possible.” — Donna Moulton, letter to the editor, Tucson Weekly, published on August 23, 2001

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    Re: Obama Limits When U.S. Would Use Nuclear Arms

    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    Name one example, post one link, where Bush threatened to use nuclear weapons.

    You're an embarassment.
    Administration?s Nuclear Saber Rattling on Iran Threatens Global Security | Union of Concerned Scientists

    [nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjGX2Gdj2Y4"]YouTube- President Bush threatens World War III[/nomedia]

    The Role of U.S. Nuclear Weapons: New Doctrine Falls Short of Bush Pledge | Arms Control Association

    [ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctrine_for_Joint_Nuclear_Operations]Doctrine for Joint Nuclear Operations - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

    Pentagon Revises Nuclear Strike Plan - washingtonpost.com

    Bush did threaten Iran with WWIII. Not an explicit "we will nuke you threat" but pretty close.

    The Washington Post article indicates that our nuclear strategy included the option to launch a preemptive strike using nuclear weapons.

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    Re: Obama Limits When U.S. Would Use Nuclear Arms

    I don't see this strategy presenting a significant threat to America. What still matters more is how an Administration will interpret and use it.

    I'll have to find another issue so I can "attack" the President.

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    Re: Obama Limits When U.S. Would Use Nuclear Arms

    Quote Originally Posted by liblady View Post
    are you assuming that the world believes obama wouldn't defend our country by any means necessary? that's pretty damned funny.

    I'm not assuming anything about what "the world" believes, I am saying that Obama has given up the very real military advantage of potential enemys not knowing what we will do.

    He has said that he won't use any means necessary, nuks are only to be used to retaliate for nuks, not an option for chemical or biological weopons used against us.

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    Re: Obama Limits When U.S. Would Use Nuclear Arms

    Quote Originally Posted by satandog View Post
    Bush did threaten Iran with WWIII. Not an explicit "we will nuke you threat" but pretty close.
    How can you threaten a country with World War III?

    Wouldnt it take an entire world fighting to make it world war III? not just America and Iran?

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    Re: Obama Limits When U.S. Would Use Nuclear Arms

    Quote Originally Posted by satandog View Post

    I followed all 3 links, they are all someone interretation of Bushs policy, all 3 left leaning sites, not one of them is a direct quote of any member of Bushs adminisration.

    I suggest that you are being mislead by someone with an agenda on these sites.

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    Re: Obama Limits When U.S. Would Use Nuclear Arms

    Quote Originally Posted by Chappy View Post
    After WWII Truman entered the U.S. into a series of treaties and conventions which limited American action outside of international agreements and shared policies and thereby allowed us to escape the traditional fate of the world's leading power: fear and loathing of unilateral, arbitrary action.

    The U.S. had more power and influence in the world during the Cold War years precisely because it had agreed to act in concert with its allies; it constrained its power, so then everyone felt comfortable with its power.

    The Nonconservatives rejected the Truman Doctrine, basically saying the U.S. should be free to act as it saw fit without the entangling fetters of allied interests. President George W. Bush broke with the policies of every president since Truman and moved America outside of these long standing treaties and conventions, creating ad hoc alliances based on unilateral American action.

    It was a disaster. The unilateral actions in Iraq left America with sole responsibility for the cost and casualties there. The withdrawal from the Kyoto treaty left America out of the discussion entirely. America's foreign policy initiatives were met with the traditional fear and loathing the world's leading powers in the past centuries had experienced.

    Now, President Obama is restoring the Truman Doctrine to the center of American foreign policy; by acting in concert with allies and committing to comply within internationally accepted standards, America will regain its proper role of influence in the world without the fear and loathing the Bush Doctrine incurred.

    I don't doubt that there are doctorates in international studies being written about this history, but, for this amateur, in a nutshell that's why I think Obama's declaration this week was important and a good thing for our country.
    Acting in concert with allies? He's done nothing but snub them since he stepped into the Oval Office; missile defense, the Falklands, Israel, etc. The only real overtures he's made are towards people that hate the US; Iran and Chavez.

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    Re: Obama Limits When U.S. Would Use Nuclear Arms

    Quote Originally Posted by Chappy View Post
    I support President Obama in his re-establishing American leadership in the world by clarifying our previously ambiguous policy regarding ?first use? of nuclear weapons.
    Politically, he had to say that. He didn't want to give the R W Reps the ammo to call him weak and indecisive. Realistically, he'll never use the Abomb on any country. No sane leader would...

    ricksfolly

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    Re: Obama Limits When U.S. Would Use Nuclear Arms

    Quote Originally Posted by Chappy View Post
    I support President Obama in his re-establishing American leadership in the world by clarifying our previously ambiguous policy regarding “first use” of nuclear weapons.
    I think that the president has made a serious mistake in judgement and has given up an important tool of war that may have to have been used against a miscreant country. I do beleive that acting soft will in any way make us a "leader". It is always better to "speak softly but to carry a big stick but if yoou give up the stick you are screwed !!!
    “I do not recall the Viet Cong asking me if I was a natural born or Naturalized American before they shot at me, they just shot at all of us “ f107HyperSabr

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    Re: Obama Limits When U.S. Would Use Nuclear Arms

    Quote Originally Posted by F107HyperSabr View Post
    I think that the president has made a serious mistake in judgement and has given up an important tool of war that may have to have been used against a miscreant country. I do beleive that acting soft will in any way make us a "leader". It is always better to "speak softly but to carry a big stick but if yoou give up the stick you are screwed !!!
    Nothing has been given up. All these so-called policies on nuclear weapons can be outright ignored at any time by the president.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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