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Thread: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    You just refuse to see the difference in "hurting someone's feelings" and actually causing emotional damage. Calling someone a name once or twice can hurt their feelings, calling them names for 3 months straight along with putting those names up in several places, stalking someone, and threatening them is not just going to hurt their feelings, it is going to cause emotional damage.

    Emotional damage caused by these teenage bullies is the issue. There is no proof that she had any major emotional problems at all before they started harassing her. What you could endure emotionally as a teenager is not the same as what someone else can endure emotionally as a teenager, with or without any major emotional problems.

    Would you say that a parent who is constantly putting their teenager down is just hurting their kid's feelings, or would they be causing emotional damage? Where is the point when the parent would be considered to be actually doing emotional damage, after one comment, ten, a month's worth, or would it actually take years? In fact, most people consider it abuse when one spouse is doing the things that they did to her, to their spouse.

    Also, we have to look at who can be likely to cause emotional damage, especially to a teenager. Some random person just calling a teenager derogatory names is less likely to actually cause the teenager any emotional distress than her peers would be calling her those names, especially when the girl in question had been in some sort of relationship with two of those "peers". And these bullies weren't just calling her names. According to the reports, they were stalking her and threatening her.
    "Emotional damage" is another bull****, feel-good charge. People can be "emotionally damaged" from all sorts of stupid ****. Causing someone emotional pain isn't against the law and it shouldn't be.

    WTF does "emotional damage" even mean? How is that measured? How is it verified? If walk in and catch my life-partner ****ing someone else and I then have trust issues for the rest of my life, is that "emotional damage"? What if I can never love again? Can I seek criminal action against them for doing something to deliberately cause me pain and "emotional damage"?

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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    You just refuse to see the difference in "hurting someone's feelings" and actually causing emotional damage. Calling someone a name once or twice can hurt their feelings, calling them names for 3 months straight along with putting those names up in several places, stalking someone, and threatening them is not just going to hurt their feelings, it is going to cause emotional damage.
    What kind of emotional damage? I saw kids bullied and was bullied myself in ways that far surpass the description of what happened to this girl. It's a normal part of life. I don't care Captain says this time; he carries the bias of having to show sympathy for the sick girl who killed herself because of his profession. The fact remains, 30% of kids go through the type of "abuse" this girl went through and the vast majority don't kill themselves. These kids wouldn't even be in trouble if the girl hadn't killed herself. They should have been suspended from school; but to trump criminal charges against them because of a disturbed little girl not being able to cope with life is absurd. Now, instead of one ruined life, you are gonna have 9 ruined lives, just so a grieving community can feel better about what happened.

    Emotional damage caused by these teenage bullies is the issue. There is no proof that she had any major emotional problems at all before they started harassing her.
    I think proof of her emotional problems was found hanging by a belt in a closet.

    What you could endure emotionally as a teenager is not the same as what someone else can endure emotionally as a teenager, with or without any major emotional problems.
    Which is relevant, how?

    Would you say that a parent who is constantly putting their teenager down is just hurting their kid's feelings, or would they be causing emotional damage? Where is the point when the parent would be considered to be actually doing emotional damage, after one comment, ten, a month's worth, or would it actually take years?
    Not even comparable since the parent child relationship comes with an inherent power disparity.

    In fact, most people consider it abuse when one spouse is doing the things that they did to her, to their spouse.
    And it would be. But I would have just as little sympathy for the spouse who killed themselves, too. And between spouses, its no longer bullying; it's domestic violence.

    Also, we have to look at who can be likely to cause emotional damage, especially to a teenager. Some random person just calling a teenager derogatory names is less likely to actually cause the teenager any emotional distress than her peers would be calling her those names, especially when the girl in question had been in some sort of relationship with two of those "peers". And these bullies weren't just calling her names. According to the reports, they were stalking her and threatening her.
    Awww. They sent some mean text messages and put some catty crap up on facebook. Forgive me if I don't get all up in arms about teenagers not knowing what boundaries are on the interwebz since we already realize they don't have a firm grasp on boundaries in real life.

  3. #213
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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    Quote Originally Posted by aps View Post
    I have been agreeing with almost all your posts in this thread. I hope the kids in this case suffer tremendously from their disgusting behavior. Karma's a bitch.

    Gosh, roguenuke, I don't like how they were able to convince your mother that nothing could be done. Someone hitting you on the back of the head is battery, and by golly, they (the police) should have done something about it. This BS about you all being teenagers was a bogus piece of BS. I'm sorry your mother didn't think about taking it to this police officer's supervisor. I know I would.
    The thing is though that there are a lot of people who don't know what is and isn't allowed by the law. That is one of the things that I hope will come from this case. I don't think anyone should be charged with her death, she committed suicide. But I don't have a problem with them being charged with things that they actually did do to her before that.

    My biggest hope is that they actually will be found guilty of most, if not all, charges and get some punishment because of what they were doing to her. I have no problem with teenagers having criminal records for doing things like they did. Maybe it will help make them better adults. But whether it does or not, at least justice will be done. And it most likely will have other positive affects. One should be to make parents, teenagers, and even school officials and law officers realize that they can report and see justice for bullying that is physically harmful or is to the point of harassment. And the more the word is out there, the more people can stop the bullying before it reaches the point where a teenager feels that suicide or homicide is the only way to deal with it. Maybe schools will look into more informational awareness to give to their students on bullying. Another good thing might be that some of the other bullies out there might rethink their ways or at least think better about taking it to extremes. And maybe this will also make parents of the bullies actually become concerned if they are hearing that their teen is participating in this behavior. Now, I know the last two are more wishful thinking, rather than what will probably happen, but I figure I can hope.
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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    The thing is though that there are a lot of people who don't know what is and isn't allowed by the law. That is one of the things that I hope will come from this case. I don't think anyone should be charged with her death, she committed suicide. But I don't have a problem with them being charged with things that they actually did do to her before that.

    My biggest hope is that they actually will be found guilty of most, if not all, charges and get some punishment because of what they were doing to her. I have no problem with teenagers having criminal records for doing things like they did. Maybe it will help make them better adults. But whether it does or not, at least justice will be done. And it most likely will have other positive affects. One should be to make parents, teenagers, and even school officials and law officers realize that they can report and see justice for bullying that is physically harmful or is to the point of harassment. And the more the word is out there, the more people can stop the bullying before it reaches the point where a teenager feels that suicide or homicide is the only way to deal with it. Maybe schools will look into more informational awareness to give to their students on bullying. Another good thing might be that some of the other bullies out there might rethink their ways or at least think better about taking it to extremes. And maybe this will also make parents of the bullies actually become concerned if they are hearing that their teen is participating in this behavior. Now, I know the last two are more wishful thinking, rather than what will probably happen, but I figure I can hope.
    That's what many people in law enforcement rely on--the fact that you don't question their authority. This is not meant to insult law enforcement people.

    Look at the law relating to criminal harassment in Massachusetts.
    M.G.L. - Chapter 265, Section 43a

    I'd be surprised if these kids didn't get a conviction on this count, assuming the facts alleged are true.

    I wouldn't waste energy on trying to have a discussion on this with rivrrat. You won't make her say, "Oh, rogenuke, you're right." Move on. You have better things to do with your time.

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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    I am reminded of my days in High School. Bullying is nothing new. Back in the mid 70's, in my Texas high-school, there was no shortage of boot wearin', scoal dippin', rootin-tootin' cowboy wannabes busting the balls of the meaker students. If you didn't have a "Proud to be a KIKK'er" bumper sticker on your Ford truck, you were fair game.

    Their problem with me, a long-haired leaping gnome, who was a rocker from the git-go, is that I was 6'1, 180 lbs, (since the 10th grade) trained fighter that oftened "turned the other cheek" to avoid their immaturity. Too often, that was considered a weakness by these inbred rednecks. However, the few that actually wanted to take it to the limit and try me, only did it once. After laying out a few of these goat-roper assholes, they eventually got a clue that I wasn't one to roll over and I was left alone.

    Although, I am one who generally tries to keep the peace, I was kind of a bully to bullies. I guess I still am. I hate those bastards. Pick on my weaker friends and that's just like picking on me. I usually turn the other cheek when it's directed at me. I got nothing to prove. But when my friends get bullied, I have a tendancy to come unglued.

    But I'm working on it.
    Last edited by Captain America; 04-02-10 at 01:41 PM.

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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain America View Post
    I am reminded of my days in High School. Bullying is nothing new. Back in the mid 70's, in my Texas high-school, there was no shortage of boot wearin', scoal dippin', rootin-tootin' cowboy wannabes busting the balls of the meaker students. If you didn't have a "Proud to be a KIKK'er" bumper sticker on your Ford truck, you were fair game.

    Their problem with me, a long-haired leaping gnome, who was a rocker from the git-go, is that I was 6'1, 180 lbs, trained fighter that oftened "turned the other cheek" to avoid their immaturity. Too often, that was considered a weakness by these inbred rednecks. However, the few that actually wanted to try me, only did it once. After laying out a few of these bully assholes, they eventually got a clue that I wasn't one to roll over and I was left alone.

    Although, I am one who generally tries to keep the peace, I was kind of a bully to bullies. I guess I still am. I hate those bastards. Pick on my weaker friends and that's just like picking on me. I usually turn the other cheek when it's directed at me. I got nothing to prove. But when my friends get bullied, I have a tendancy to come unglued.

    But I'm working on it.
    And that's really where it's at: bullying is really one of those phenomenon that you just have to face down.

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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    And that's really where it's at: bullying is really one of those phenomenon that you just have to face down.
    That's easy to say when you're a nidan from Icochi Budo Kai. But some of my friends weren't so fortunant. (But I had their back. 0

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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain America View Post
    That's easy to say when you're a nidan from Icochi Budo Kai. But some of my friends weren't so fortunant. (But I had their back. 0
    You don't have to be an 80th degree super ninja from Sgt Stinger's dojo to give a bully a good smack in the mouth. And one is usually all it takes for most bullies.

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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    And that's really where it's at: bullying is really one of those phenomenon that you just have to face down.
    That attitude only enables bullying to continue. Being able to face it down is not the prime goal here. Stopping and preventing bullying is. It's not one child's inability to fight back that is the problem. The bullying is. It's adults' responsibility to act to protect kids and to take steps to "correct" bullying. It's not the responsibility of the bullied. If they can, great. But, they should not feel forced to do battle. In most schools, it doesn't matter who started the fight. Both get suspended, if not expelled. The bullied do not have the power to correct the bullies behavior and even if they did fighting back is no guarantee the harassment will stop. Bullying not only has an impact on the bullied. Bullies also suffer, although not immediately, and often without much sympathy.
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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    Quote Originally Posted by ADK_Forever View Post
    That attitude only enables bullying to continue. Being able to face it down is not the prime goal here. Stopping and preventing bullying is. It's not one child's inability to fight back that is the problem. The bullying is. It's adults' responsibility to act to protect kids and to take steps to "correct" bullying. It's not the responsibility of the bullied. If they can, great. But, they should not feel forced to do battle. In most schools, it doesn't matter who started the fight. Both get suspended, if not expelled. The bullied do not have the power to correct the bullies behavior and even if they did fighting back is no guarantee the harassment will stop. Bullying not only has an impact on the bullied. Bullies also suffer, although not immediately, and often without much sympathy.
    You may as well try to 'correct' the behavior of teens having sex. It's just a fact of life. There are mean people in the world. There are assholes. Fact of life. You're not going to stop them in grade school, or high school, or college, or in workplaces. It's not the job of the government to make people be nicer to one another.

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