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Thread: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    Quote Originally Posted by Khayembii Communique View Post
    I know that she had to be there and I know the abuse wasn't stopped, but that's not relevant to the fact that she is responsible for allowing her emotions to be damaged and ultimately for killing herself. It's her fault.
    No, it's not, necessarily. It is quite clear that for this girl to commit suicide, even under the severe circumstances that she was subjected to, that there was some sort of psychological disorder going on. And, just like someone with a fragile bone structure, that is NOT her fault.
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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    I'm gonna have to disagree here. Bullying typically takes a pattern and it doesn't just start and stop randomly. Here's an update from Slate and I find it interesting what some of the students that weren't involved had to say:



    Exactly what I have been saying. It was bad, but it wasn't anything unique. I still think that Phoebe Prince's reaction was what was out of the ordinary here and if it weren't for her dramatic answer to a normal problem every kid goes through, then these other kids wouldn't be having their permanent records and lives damaged...all to make a community feel better about the selfish act of a disturbed young lady.
    Has anyone mentioned that there is a legal doctrine called the eggshell skull rule that can be applied in criminal cases? What this doctrine addresses is that the defendant takes the plaintiff as he/she finds them. For example, if a defendant hits someone over the head who has, say, a plate in their head that causes the plaintiff to die, the defendant would be charged with the plaintiff's death, even though death was not truly foreseeable in the average person. I'm not sympathetic to these defendants.

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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    Holy crap, seriously? Kids being *charged* with bullying? This happens day in and day out, across the country, for decades. Centuries! It's just a fact of life.

    Yes, it's too bad that this girl had a serious over reaction, but it is NOT the fault of the bullies. She made the choice to do what she did. SHE did. HER. Alone.

    Were the kids mean? Yup. Were they assholes? Yup. Did they cause her death? Nope.

    If she had an underlying mental/emotional disorder that led to her being unable to handle negativity, that's not their fault either.

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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    Holy crap, seriously? Kids being *charged* with bullying? This happens day in and day out, across the country, for decades. Centuries! It's just a fact of life.

    Yes, it's too bad that this girl had a serious over reaction, but it is NOT the fault of the bullies. She made the choice to do what she did. SHE did. HER. Alone.

    Were the kids mean? Yup. Were they assholes? Yup. Did they cause her death? Nope.

    If she had an underlying mental/emotional disorder that led to her being unable to handle negativity, that's not their fault either.
    Please see my post above yours.

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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    Quote Originally Posted by aps View Post
    Please see my post above yours.
    Physically bashing someone over the head isn't really the same as hurting their feelings.

    So let me get this straight... if an emotionally unbalanced person gets dumped by their girlfriend, or cheated on by them, and decides to kill themselves, you think it would be appropriate to charge the girlfriend with murder since she caused them emotional pain sufficient to make them CHOOSE to off themselves due to some underlying mental/emotional unbalance?

    Because that's pretty much what you're saying.

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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    Physically bashing someone over the head isn't really the same as hurting their feelings.

    So let me get this straight... if an emotionally unbalanced person gets dumped by their girlfriend, or cheated on by them, and decides to kill themselves, you think it would be appropriate to charge the girlfriend with murder since she caused them emotional pain sufficient to make them CHOOSE to off themselves due to some underlying mental/emotional unbalance?

    Because that's pretty much what you're saying.
    Yeah, rivrrat, that's what I am saying. Give me a break.

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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    Quote Originally Posted by aps View Post
    Yeah, rivrrat, that's what I am saying. Give me a break.
    Ahhh So you're not saying that if someone does something that hurts someone elses feelings and the person whose feelings gets hurt has an emotional/mental disorder and offs themselves, that the person who hurt their feelings is somehow responsible? Because that seemed like what you were saying. And that's exactly what's happening now with these kids.

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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    Holy crap, seriously? Kids being *charged* with bullying? This happens day in and day out, across the country, for decades. Centuries! It's just a fact of life.

    Yes, it's too bad that this girl had a serious over reaction, but it is NOT the fault of the bullies. She made the choice to do what she did. SHE did. HER. Alone.

    Were the kids mean? Yup. Were they assholes? Yup. Did they cause her death? Nope.

    If she had an underlying mental/emotional disorder that led to her being unable to handle negativity, that's not their fault either.
    They're not getting charged with her murder or anything else actually directly connected to her suicide, from all the accounts that I have seen. What they are getting charged with are crimes that they were committing against her.

    statutory rape - technically, at least one of the boys, according to the reports, does deserve this charge (personally, I'm not sure I agree with this charge being applied to students in the same school who sleep with each other voluntarily, but I can see the intimidation or corruption issue when talking about such an age difference)

    assault - many schools have charged students with assault routinely for just being a single fight, from the accounts in multiple stories, she wasn't actually in fights, but was being physically assaulted, the details should unfold as the trial(s) begin

    violation of civil rights resulting in injury - they pretty much brought this one on themselves, if, as from the information we have, they wouldn't have specifically insulted her with "Irish slut", there would have been very little chance of this being a charge

    criminal harassment - they obviously were harassing her, even to the point where they were going out of their way to do so, off school property, and it continued on for 4-5 months before she killed herself, putting stuff up about her on various websites, calling her cell phone to harass her, even all the things they were doing to her at school, this is not normal teenage bullying, this is obsessive behavior, meant to get a reaction did they know that she would commit suicide over it-probably not, but they were going for something

    disturbance of a school assembly - I have no idea what this charge relates to, I assume it will come up during the trial(s)

    stalking - if they were following her home to yell at her and throw things at her and/or just showing up in her neighborhood to do the same, then it is stalking I have no idea if they live near her or not, but maybe the DA knows more than we do

    Think of it like this, if these were adults doing the same thing to another adult, would you and/or others be complaining about the charges, whether the adult being "bullied" committed suicide or not? (Now obviously the statutory rape and school assembly disturbance charge wouldn't apply in my scenario.)
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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    Ahhh So you're not saying that if someone does something that hurts someone elses feelings and the person whose feelings gets hurt has an emotional/mental disorder and offs themselves, that the person who hurt their feelings is somehow responsible? Because that seemed like what you were saying. And that's exactly what's happening now with these kids.
    Really? Physically assaulting someone is a crime, but maybe you don't know that.

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    Re: Nine Charged in Bullying of Massachusetts Teen Who Killed Herself

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    They're not getting charged with her murder or anything else actually directly connected to her suicide, from all the accounts that I have seen. What they are getting charged with are crimes that they were committing against her.

    statutory rape - technically, at least one of the boys, according to the reports, does deserve this charge (personally, I'm not sure I agree with this charge being applied to students in the same school who sleep with each other voluntarily, but I can see the intimidation or corruption issue when talking about such an age difference)

    assault - many schools have charged students with assault routinely for just being a single fight, from the accounts in multiple stories, she wasn't actually in fights, but was being physically assaulted, the details should unfold as the trial(s) begin

    violation of civil rights resulting in injury - they pretty much brought this one on themselves, if, as from the information we have, they wouldn't have specifically insulted her with "Irish slut", there would have been very little chance of this being a charge

    criminal harassment - they obviously were harassing her, even to the point where they were going out of their way to do so, off school property, and it continued on for 4-5 months before she killed herself, putting stuff up about her on various websites, calling her cell phone to harass her, even all the things they were doing to her at school, this is not normal teenage bullying, this is obsessive behavior, meant to get a reaction did they know that she would commit suicide over it-probably not, but they were going for something

    disturbance of a school assembly - I have no idea what this charge relates to, I assume it will come up during the trial(s)

    stalking - if they were following her home to yell at her and throw things at her and/or just showing up in her neighborhood to do the same, then it is stalking I have no idea if they live near her or not, but maybe the DA knows more than we do

    Think of it like this, if these were adults doing the same thing to another adult, would you and/or others be complaining about the charges, whether the adult being "bullied" committed suicide or not? (Now obviously the statutory rape and school assembly disturbance charge wouldn't apply in my scenario.)
    It's a real shame they weren't charged with any of this before she killed herself. It may very likely have saved her life. Her mother had twice asked the school to do something about her daughter's situation. Nothing was done. Maybe her death won't be in vain and other schools will now start paying attention at the first signs of trouble and nip it in the bud.
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