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Health Care Bill has passed

Well let me ask you this. If one party becomes arrogant during the term of it's president, don't you think that the other party, once in power, will do the same thing.

It takes two to tango, and the Donkeys and Elephants are perfect dancing partners.

I have no doubt that if this isn't repealed, Republicans will manipulate and play with this as much as they can.
That is the very nature of both parties.

Both will cry and clamor that the other is "evil" but they do the same/similar things when in power.

That's pretty much why I'm against it in the first place, that and the cost.
 
Overall, that should keep health costs DOWN. If people went to the doctor more often at the first sign of trouble, "big ticket items" could be minimized, and the overall expense would go down.

Let me give you an anecdotal example from my own practice. One of my specialty areas is treating clients with eating disorders. If you send me someone who has just started their eating disorder within the past month or so, I can usually arrest it and get it under control inside a year or two (YMMV). If, however, I start seeing someone who has had an untreated or poorly treated eating disorder for SIX YEARS, I can pretty much guarantee a 5-7 year recovery time, including at least one hospitalization, if not more. Now, there are lots of reasons for folks to not go see a practicaner, but lack of coverage and/or lack of money are huge reasons. And then they wait and then the problem is bad enough that more money needs to be used... insurance money, tax money, charity money, all of it.

Early intervention beats everything. If this bill helps people see doctors quicker and more often, costs should go down.

Kinda like Dental care, wait too long it takes a basket full of dough. Get regular checkups your good to go until the next checkup in three or six months.
 
Regarding the doctors who are threatening to quit

What are they going to do should they quit?

Flip burgers at Burger King, become engineers (dont have the training) become vetenarians (possible).

Move to another country that doesnt have socialized medicine like Somalia (as every major economy other then the US has it)

It is just hyperboyle by those doctors, a few will quit, the vast majority will not

Having an MD opens up all kinds of options besides practicing medicine. I imagine the research industry will swell its ranks with a lot of disgruntled doctors in the coming months. :shrug:
 
I have no doubt that if this isn't repealed, Republicans will manipulate and play with this as much as they can.
That is the very nature of both parties.

Both will cry and clamor that the other is "evil" but they do the same/similar things when in power.

That's pretty much why I'm against it in the first place, that and the cost.

Bingo - Congratulations, you have found the message!! But, unfortunately, that message got lost in all that screeching about "pull the plug on grandma", "Obama is not a US citizen", and the other silliness.
 
i hate it we will soon be in communism
 
i hate it we will soon be in communism

Please be specific. There are legitimate arguments out there, but screeds like the one you posted is weak debating. Anybody can do that. You can do better. What specifically is the reason you feel that we will soon be in Communism?
 
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obama should go back from where he came kenya
 

Despite what you've heard, lawsuits are an insignificant cost both to health providers. They represent less than 2 percent of by spending health care providers.

Why do Doctors order unnecessary tests and procedures?

Doctors, specifically their billing offices, have become experts in knowing what different policies with pay for without question. And they order non-invasive procedures and tests as a way to make more money...

Cadillac plans will pay for most any thing. Upper GIs on advance Alzheimer's patients... Why?:confused:

A doctor who supports health care reform told me another thing driving up costs is technology and new meds. Not the cost of the technology, but the fact that we can keep people alive much longer... The unintended consequences of really good blood pressure and cholesterol meds.
 
Bingo - Congratulations, you have found the message!! But, unfortunately, that message got lost in all that screeching about "pull the plug on grandma", "Obama is not a US citizen", and the other silliness.

That's my whole thing here. Find a way to pay for it in a struggling economy and I would say give everyone their own personal doctor. But it's not feasible right now. This was the wrong issue to tackle and at the wrong time. Srsly.
 
Bingo - Congratulations, you have found the message!! But, unfortunately, that message got lost in all that screeching about "pull the plug on grandma", "Obama is not a US citizen", and the other silliness.

Because it isn't as entertaining if you can't bring as much craziness to the table as possible when talking about issues. I was super bored and hungover one morning and for three hours I just listened to what people said about the bill. Probably only 3% actually hit on any real issue and wasn't some hyperbole.
 
i hate it we will soon be in communism

A mandate to purchase insurance from private companies is so far away from Communism it isn't even funny. If you can't discuss things in terms of reality you should just be quiet.
 
Hmm, you do realize that Medicare is unsustainable, right?

Private insurance largely subsidizes Medicare.

It may take a while, but we'll find that this is more of the same.


Hmm, you do realize that Private Insurance is subsidizes by the government don't you? So is gas, food prices ......
 
because have you seen obama he will first take over health then dental then soon he will have full control of everything and these people are to retarded to see
 
Yeah I know, and that is what annoys me the most. The thing that would have probably done the most good isn't even in the bloody bill.

As best I can tell, Tort Reform is a bit overrated.

Summit Extras: Medical Malpractice | FactCheck.org

Obama is right that medical malpractice doesn’t have a big impact on health care spending. As Republican Rep. Dave Camp correctly pointed out, the Congressional Budget Office estimated that limiting malpractice liability would "reduce the federal deficit by more than $50 billion." More precisely, that’s $54 billion over 10 years, according to the CBO. But CBO Director Douglas Elmendorf noted the savings would "reduce total U.S. health care spending by about 0.5 percent (about $11 billion in 2009)."

It does not mean it is not worth doing, but the effect would be overall small according to the CBO.
 
Here's my take on social programs. We have them, but they are prone to abuse and waste. Waste is easy, going overbudget means something for once. Currently all one has to do to increase their fiscal budget for the next year is find a way to overspend the current one, well, when you reward overspending of course you will get more overspending. Hold people to a solid budget and punish any intentional malfeasance to the fullest extent of the law. Waste should be reduced. To eliminate abuse, simply up the standards and set a timeline for benefits to expire. Allow for exemptions and temporary extensions for those who are able bodied, and I think those tweaks would work.

I certainly agree with the efficiency angle, but I don't think that overspending is that simple. The entire structure needs to be looked at. In some areas, employment needs to be cut. In others, it needs to be INCREASED.

And I do not agree with timeframes for benefits to expire; to me, a solid set of parameters for them to continue needs to be developed, and then needs to be re-evaluated from time to time by professionals. My brother is on SSD, and they handle his case VERY efficiently.

I think instead of creating more regulatory conditions, we could just enforce fraud laws. Much of the inefficiencies today come from having so many compliance angles, this applies to both my field and the provider field as well. If.....say the HHS was the singular authority, but if you overcharge, double-dip bill, or misrepresent services then I see no reason why state financial regulatory authorities cannot simply have expanded capablities. In other words, I think we get it as far away from the feds as possible.

I agree with this, but it needs to go MUCH further than that. Insurance companies use every loophole imaginable to NOT pay the provider, and to make it more difficult for the patient. These abuses must be addressed, and the fraud laws won't cover them. It's not fraud when the insurance company repeatedly tells you that you are sending the authorization to the wrong fax number... and they have 16 fax numbers. These kinds of abuses need to be regulated right out, with reforms that force the insurance companies to use some sort of standard or centralized system.



I don't know about that Cap. There were quite a few doctors who retired in La. to get insurance licenses around the late '80s and early '90s when the state regulations became too burdensome. There is only so much a professional can take before saying it isn't worth the trouble.

Most doctors I know that have left the field have left because of malpractice insurance costs, or poor or lack of insurance reimbursement. I haven't heard that regulations are the issue at all, these days.

We'll have to play the waiting game I guess, but I think this will be bad.

I don't, but you're right... we'll have to wait.



Insurance companies vary in coverage models and customer models honestly, it's kind of like agents. When one company gets a bad satisfaction rating it makes all the news servers, but when a company gets it right we hear nothing, kind of like doctors, lawyers, and every other professional. Much of the insurance problem in health is twofold, it works similarly to auto insurance being the main problem, and as well, prices are skyrocketing through little fault of the actual service providers but as a direct result of staff shortages, regulatory compliance costs, and CYA medicine due to tort abuse.

Staff shortages I absolutely agree with and I agree with CYA costs. I think regulatory compliance cost are problematic, but because they are not efficient or do not address the real issues. I'd like to see more regulation, but more efficient regulation... which would probably mean some regulations cut.
 
Having an MD opens up all kinds of options besides practicing medicine. I imagine the research industry will swell its ranks with a lot of disgruntled doctors in the coming months. :shrug:

Ahh yes the research industry which will be serving the health care industry that has just been taken over by the government. A rich future I think not


And, I doubt the research industry will be hiring many more doctors in the US, as it is exporting much of that field to India. Nor do I think US doctors will be willing to take such a big pay cut. (as would happen if tens of thousands of US doctors suddenly applied to become researchers.

Given the large investment doctors have put into their education and training, combined with how little they would make in comparision to other proffessions the threat of quiting is just that a threat, not reality. They still will be very very well paid, far better then nearly any other career
 
because have you seen obama he will first take over health then dental then soon he will have full control of everything and these people are to retarded to see. They are blinded. And one day you will realize I was the right one in this discussion.
 
Regarding the doctors who are threatening to quit

What are they going to do should they quit?

Flip burgers at Burger King, become engineers (dont have the training) become vetenarians (possible).

Move to another country that doesnt have socialized medicine like Somalia (as every major economy other then the US has it)

It is just hyperboyle by those doctors, a few will quit, the vast majority will not

Exactly. They have to keep up with each other, more than the Joneses.
Some will have to downsize their lyfestyles and their egoes.
 
I winced whenever Pelosi, et al cited the Declaration of Independence and the Founding Fathers. Firstly, as a student of history, I wince whenever a politician liberally uses history to make a point. Second, I have a hard time believing that many of them could agree with this issue even if we were to magically transport them through a time machine. Third, it is probably not a good idea to use Jefferson's memorable writing to make such a big-government proposition.

"Improve the republic"-yes, use wording like that, but...well, you know where I am going with this. It's brilliant political rhetoric, but lousy historical insight.

It is historic, but this ties both parties to their votes. Republicans on one hand have the 'nay', and the Democrats on the 'yea'. This may well define an era of political ideology.

Frankly, this is one of those things that makes me think one way or another, Obama has his chance to be defined for a legacy tomorrow. If it does alright, he may have (for the short-term, in historical terms, let's say 20+ years) beaten George W. Bush's legacy. If something happens with the economy, execution of this bill, or say, with foreign affairs (which as we all know this past decade, a lot can happen that can dramatically shape a Presidency), then Obama could be severely decimated.
 
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This country is slowly decreasing in power and economy wise, you might not be able to reconize it now but after Obama's term it will take alot to reconstruct it back to what it was.
 
This country is slowly decreasing in power and economy wise, you might not be able to reconize it now but after Obama's term it will take alot to reconstruct it back to what it was.

by,by.:2wave:
 
Ahh yes the research industry

Yes, the research industry. Just for one.

which will be serving the health care industry that has just been taken over by the government. A rich future I think not

Well it's good no one pays you to think, no?

And, I doubt the research industry will be hiring many more doctors in the US, as it is exporting much of that field to India.

That's odd considering the job forecast for clinical research scientists remains strong in the US. :confused:


Nor do I think US doctors will be willing to take such a big pay cut. (as would happen if tens of thousands of US doctors suddenly applied to become researchers.

I wasnt aware that any actual numbers were available as to how many doctors may be making the switch. Perhaps you would like to share these figures and their source with the rest of us?

Given the large investment doctors have put into their education and training, combined with how little they would make in comparision to other proffessions the threat of quiting is just that a threat, not reality. They still will be very very well paid, far better then nearly any other career

You are sadly mistaken. The clinical research industry is filled with doctors who make very comfortable salaries comparable to other doctors in their fields.

And that was but one example. Doctors leave the medical field all the time to pursue other lucrative employment. To say a doctor is stuck practicing medicine is just...stupid.
 
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