Page 39 of 114 FirstFirst ... 2937383940414989 ... LastLast
Results 381 to 390 of 1136

Thread: Health Care Bill has passed

  1. #381
    Goddess of Bacon

    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Charlottesville, VA
    Last Seen
    05-28-12 @ 09:35 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    13,988

    Re: Health Care Bill has passed

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    Oh this is just fun...

    Page 124 of the bill has language written into it that bars judicial review and suit against the federal government by private insurers if they take exception to the fixed prices the "Health Choices Commissioner" sets in place for procedures.

    I forget which page, somewhere near the beginning, it states that if there's not enough money to pay for ****, then the Secretary "shall make such adjustments as are necessary" such as reducing benefits, increasing premiums, and establishing waiting lists.

    WOOT!

  2. #382
    King of Videos
    dirtpoorchris's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    WA
    Last Seen
    Today @ 11:05 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    7,025

    Re: Health Care Bill has passed

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    I forget which page, somewhere near the beginning, it states that if there's not enough money to pay for ****, then the Secretary "shall make such adjustments as are necessary" such as reducing benefits, increasing premiums, and establishing waiting lists.

    WOOT!
    yay for death panels?
    I'm Finding it Harder to be a Gentleman, White Stripes ~ "You think I care about me and only me. When every girl needs help climbing up a tree."

  3. #383
    Goddess of Bacon

    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Charlottesville, VA
    Last Seen
    05-28-12 @ 09:35 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    13,988

    Re: Health Care Bill has passed

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtpoorchris View Post
    yay for death panels?
    Indeed. We're so lucky to have a govt that cares so much for us.

  4. #384
    I'm not-low all the time
    Kushinator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    West Loop
    Last Seen
    Today @ 08:06 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    16,263

    Re: Health Care Bill has passed

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    Well, on the demand argument we have an artificially created demand that has just been created, it would not have to be subsidized if it had not been legislated.
    The demand is entirely (or pretty damn close) organic given the oath doctors take, and the life or death scenario. Dynamic shifts in demand given increased access need to be isolated accordingly. We know that health care after age 70 is pretty much inelastic, while health care at age 25 is less so. Yet.... given the life or death scenario, it is perfectly inelastic given all age groups.

    Demand for health care should tread a certain level if we aspire to have a truly healthy society.

    If someone does not have the money for health care, they will either go into debt (which has a tendency to lead to bankruptcy) or go without it. Either scenario raises the cost.

    This thing is going to cause massive economic damage and further dependence on government services, there have been instances where it's most ardent supporters have pretty much let that slip.
    The only way i see this reform damaging the economy is if we see even greater costs increases (health care inflation).

    Sure. For instance with this situation, you don't have to be insured, or even pay to seek medical assistance in certain instances because of federal law, it puts a strain on hospitals which raises costs. If you pay cash you get a discount, but since many can't pay cash the increases are assessed on insurance payouts, when insurance companies have to pay more then we have to pay more. If the federal government hadn't put that burden on hospitals in the first place, along with very unfriendly tort laws which further not only increases in cost, CYA medicine, and an upward shift of MM. Insurance, we would see savings passed along to us down the entire health chain.
    Agreed. But I am not in the camp of "less available health care" is always better.

    True, and while I agree with you, I can't go as far as to force people to purchase.
    I think it is a silly idea as well, but they did not include a public option. My personal preference would be for a heavily deregulated private sector to compete with an open public option.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

  5. #385
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Last Seen
    02-16-11 @ 08:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    36,915
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Health Care Bill has passed

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    I forget which page, somewhere near the beginning, it states that if there's not enough money to pay for ****, then the Secretary "shall make such adjustments as are necessary" such as reducing benefits, increasing premiums, and establishing waiting lists.

    WOOT!
    That starts about midway down page 29 where it talks about rationing healthcare.

  6. #386
    User
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Last Seen
    03-22-10 @ 02:33 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    3

    Re: Health Care Bill has passed

    Quote Originally Posted by EgoffTib View Post
    This is a great idea. I signed

  7. #387
    Voluntary Resignation

    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Last Seen
    11-30-10 @ 05:20 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    7,059

    Re: Health Care Bill has passed

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    That starts about midway down page 29 where it talks about rationing healthcare.
    What, there's no rationing in this bill! Nancy and Obama said so, and they never lie!

  8. #388
    Goddess of Bacon

    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Charlottesville, VA
    Last Seen
    05-28-12 @ 09:35 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    13,988

    Re: Health Care Bill has passed

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    That starts about midway down page 29 where it talks about rationing healthcare.
    But wait!! There's not going to be any rationing of health care! How dare you speak such vile words. Those are only bloated talking points instigated by the evil right wing to try and make you believe that the govt will...


    Oh wait, nvm. They put it right there in black and white in the bill.

    God this is a sad day for this country. I've never voted a straight ticket in my life and I swore I never would. But I most likely will come Nov. Just to voice my disagreement with the ****tards who voted this atrocity in.

  9. #389
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Last Seen
    02-16-11 @ 08:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    36,915
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Health Care Bill has passed

    Quote Originally Posted by Coronado View Post
    What, there's no rationing in this bill! Nancy and Obama said so, and they never lie!
    Well it's right there in black and white. It goes on till about page 42 and in that time, it sets up the rolls of committees that will decide what health care you get and it defines the role of the Health Choices Commissioner (read: Healthcare Czar) who will adjust those choices based on the current year's budget.

  10. #390
    Klattu Verata Nicto
    LaMidRighter's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Louisiana
    Last Seen
    07-21-17 @ 02:42 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    30,534

    Re: Health Care Bill has passed

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    The demand is entirely (or pretty damn close) organic given the oath doctors take, and the life or death scenario. Dynamic shifts in demand given increased access need to be isolated accordingly. We know that health care after age 70 is pretty much inelastic, while health care at age 25 is less so. Yet.... given the life or death scenario, it is perfectly inelastic given all age groups.
    The rub is that the hypocratic oath is non-binding, so unless a state law requires medical providers to give access during an emergency it really is an unquantifiable factor, as it would depend solely on the providers will to give healthcare at a loss. Don't know which way this factor would swing to be honest.

    Demand for health care should tread a certain level if we aspire to have a truly healthy society.
    I see this as potentially abused more than any other entitlement, if anything demand will exceed supply. For instance my mother works in the charity system here, she sees people who will not take generics and are constant "customers" because they aren't paying, these people will be on the public option eventually when the scum in Washington makes adjustments, so Louisiana's problem is about to become a national one.

    If someone does not have the money for health care, they will either go into debt (which has a tendency to lead to bankruptcy) or go without it. Either scenario raises the cost.
    Not necessarily, again, risk is so skewed right now to actually get the situation right would require around 3-4 decades of slowly peeling back the internal problems. Such as eliminating national medical school caps on enrollment, tort reform, etc.



    The only way i see this reform damaging the economy is if we see even greater costs increases (health care inflation).
    If anything we are going to see those healthcare inflation costs escalate in about two years, as well, let's not forget that this bill is a setup to eliminate private insurance companies, if they go down everyone does.



    Agreed. But I am not in the camp of "less available health care" is always better.
    Not always better, usually not in fact, but this bill is not the way to go.



    I think it is a silly idea as well, but they did not include a public option. My personal preference would be for a heavily deregulated private sector to compete with an open public option.
    If the heavy regulations are appropriate I agree, however many of the regulations on my industry are not only a band-aid on a bullet wound, they miss the wound itself.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

Page 39 of 114 FirstFirst ... 2937383940414989 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •