Page 7 of 9 FirstFirst ... 56789 LastLast
Results 61 to 70 of 81

Thread: Five European states back burka ban

  1. #61
    Sage
    Laila's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Last Seen
    04-28-17 @ 01:48 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    10,095

    Re: Five European states back burka ban

    Quote Originally Posted by texmaster View Post
    Please show us where it is said in the Qur'an that women must wear burkas.
    Quote Originally Posted by texmaster View Post
    The point is there is no religious texts reuqiring burkas be worm by all Muslim women.
    You display a basic primary school level understanding of Islam if you truly think the Qu'ran is the only source of authority in Islam that is followed.

    The Burqa is not in the Qu'ran but that does not mean it is not for some Muslims a religious requirement.
    Praying 5 times a day is not in the Qu'ran yet it is fundamental to Islam ... These are all mentioned in hadiths and other texts that is not in the Qu'ran
    Christians have many traditions which are not specifically in the Bible but are traditions as do many other faiths. That does not detract from its religious importance for individuals.

    I'm surprised there is apparently "enthusiastic backing" in UK for this ban. I thought the British had more sense than that especially seeing such a tiny amount of Muslim women actually wear it.
    Last edited by Laila; 03-03-10 at 06:16 PM.


  2. #62
    Outer space potato man

    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:19 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    51,709

    Re: Five European states back burka ban

    I know, in the US we can create a Bureau of Approved Clothing to regulate what we wear and prevent these terrorists from... wearing... things.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

  3. #63
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Last Seen
    12-26-10 @ 06:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    8,083

    Re: Five European states back burka ban

    The hatred in this legislation is alarming, as is the content of the OP. How can you be in favor of human rights and yet support the ban to wear what you want?

    I expected more from Europe, but honestly the U.S. is not far behind, given some extremist attitudes. Many would love to see the middle east be made a "sheet of glass" by the military. It's sickening. You're all sick.

  4. #64
    Girthless
    RightinNYC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    New York, NY
    Last Seen
    01-23-11 @ 11:56 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    25,894

    Re: Five European states back burka ban

    Quote Originally Posted by texmaster View Post
    It doesn't but nothing you mentioned is ever worn all the time so once again you fail at yet another comparison.
    What on earth are you talking about? How many times have you seen a nun in a bikini or an orthodox Jewish woman in a miniskirt? The only difference between those outfits and a burqa is the niqab.

    The point is there is no religious texts reuqiring burkas be worm by all Muslim women.
    And there is no religious text requiring those clothes to be worn either. What's so hard to understand about this?

    Your laughable comparison to outfits worn by people who work for the church is a pathetic attempt at comparison.
    All orthodox women work for "the church?" Interesting.

    It would certainly help the argument claiming it is part of a religion yeah
    And this is the problem - you just don't understand what you're talking about. There are literally innumerable religious practices that are not explicitly mandated by any primary religious text. They're no less religious for that. The bible doesn't say anything about exactly how a church service should be organized, so does that mean that the government could ban various types of church services?

    If it interferes with basic security you bet it does.
    And how does a woman walking down the street with a niqab on "interfere with basic security"?

    No it isn't. It goes to the heart of the matter.

    Then you don't have a clue what you are arguing since many Muslims demand women's faces be covered at all times.

    It would really help if you actually knew what you are trying to defend before someone on the other side has to point it out to you.
    Oy. There are many who believe that Muslim women should wear the burqa at all times as part of their religious observance. This is a protected religious right. This obviously conflicts with some compelling government interests, such as in situations where visual identification is needed. As a result, an intrusion onto that religious right is warranted in those limited situations. Such a compelling government interest does not exist when the woman is merely walking down the street or sitting on her porch. Accordingly, the government may not intrude on that right in those scenarios.

    I honestly don't know what to say to your claim that I don't know what I'm defending, given that you very clearly don't seem to understand the issues of religion or law involved here.

    No, I don't. If it was explicit to covering the entire body including the face.
    I'm sorry, you're just wrong.

    Again it is not a requirement of the religion so that argument is completely unfounded. How many different ways does this need to be said before you get it?
    Repeating a falsehood does not transform it into a truth.

    How do you know this? What are you citing as evidence this is true?
    WTF? Have you read a single article about this topic? The stated reason for the ban is that the burqa supposedly violates the woman's freedom and dignity. This is really not disputable.

    You can throw out all the "what if" arguments you want
    "And I won't answer them because I can't explain why they're different"

    it still wont change the fact that a burka that covers the entire body is a security problem.
    I'm just amazed at how scared people are over this. Again, you're telling me that the fact that some women choose to cover their face while walking down the street creates a security problem? We better ban halloween while we're at it, cause those ****ers wear masks and that **** is DANGEROUS.

    Quote Originally Posted by NoJingoLingo View Post
    I think I'll just let you ignore Aunt Spikers post as my rebuttal.
    I didn't feel the need to respond because it wasn't really on point. You're arguing that christianity "oppresses" women because some denominations that women voluntarily choose to adhere to do not allow women to fill some particular roles in church. That seemed too silly to even bother refuting.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

  5. #65
    Hippie Hater
    texmaster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Dallas TEXAS
    Last Seen
    08-20-15 @ 01:17 AM
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    3,969

    Re: Five European states back burka ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    So you're in favor of government deciding what people can wear.
    Not what I said but then the truth hardly seems to matter to you.
    Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.

    John Adams

  6. #66
    Hippie Hater
    texmaster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Dallas TEXAS
    Last Seen
    08-20-15 @ 01:17 AM
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    3,969

    Re: Five European states back burka ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    I think it's quite obviously anti-Muslim.
    Opinion is not evidence.

    I doubt someone will get a ticket for wearing a ski mask or something like that. I doubt people on Halloween will find themselves in the back of a patrol car. If you're being honest, then you see this for what it is. It's clearly made against Muslims. And it's no surprise that it comes from Europe, as several countries there (like those with these bans) are very xenophobic and have strong....dislikes....for Muslim.
    Once again, opinion is not evidence. Please look up the definition of the two words and get back to us.

    In the end, it's not even going to do anything but remove women in burka's from the street so people don't have to be reminded of the Muslim population living in their city.
    sigh. You just love to pretend opinion is fact don't you?
    Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.

    John Adams

  7. #67
    Hippie Hater
    texmaster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Dallas TEXAS
    Last Seen
    08-20-15 @ 01:17 AM
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    3,969

    Re: Five European states back burka ban

    Quote Originally Posted by NoJingoLingo View Post
    It's not surprising that you fail to understand the analogy. You're a fundamentalist Christian right?
    Wrong but that isn't the first time I'm sure someone has told you that.

    Nice try
    Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.

    John Adams

  8. #68
    Hippie Hater
    texmaster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Dallas TEXAS
    Last Seen
    08-20-15 @ 01:17 AM
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    3,969

    Re: Five European states back burka ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    I'm not going to spend more time line-by-line quoting and responding when you and I won't be changing each others minds on this.

    You support the ban for a variety of reason, you feel all these reasons are legitimate.

    I don't support it for a variety of reason and I feel the ban is illegitimate regardless of what reason someone might side with on it.

    I'd go on with this further if it were being considered in the United States, but it's not - and I can't help but apply our country's standards, Constitution and respect for religious practices while considering this issue.
    No you infer the reasons people have for being against it then pretend its fact.

    That is your fallacy and it isn't becoming.
    Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.

    John Adams

  9. #69
    Hippie Hater
    texmaster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Dallas TEXAS
    Last Seen
    08-20-15 @ 01:17 AM
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    3,969

    Re: Five European states back burka ban

    Quote Originally Posted by Laila View Post
    You display a basic primary school level understanding of Islam if you truly think the Qu'ran is the only source of authority in Islam that is followed.
    Never said it was the only thing all Muslims follow but then again I'm dealing in facts. You are dealing in conjecture. Please read what I said not what you infer it to say.

    And please spare me your petty insults. You don't want to go toe to toe with me on Islam I promise

    The Burqa is not in the Qu'ran but that does not mean it is not for some Muslims a religious requirement.Praying 5 times a day is not in the Qu'ran yet it is fundamental to Islam ... These are all mentioned in hadiths and other texts that is not in the Qu'ran

    So what? It is NOT a tenant of Islam that all Muslims follow. There could be Christians out there who claim bags on their heads is part of their religion but it certainly isn't universal.

    Yes I am well aware of the Hadiths. You do realize there are more than one interpretation of the Qur'an correct? Does that mean we have to accept all interpretations in the pursuance of universal tolerance? Are you that demented?

    And since you claim to be so well versed, please show us the universal Hadith that requires all women wear the Burka.

    Go right ahead, dazzle us with your knowledge of Islam

    Christians have many traditions which are not specifically in the Bible but are traditions as do many other faiths. That does not detract from its religious importance for individuals.
    Name one that requires Christians cover the entire body because I will be 100% against it.

    But of course there isn't any just another defelection from someone who is loosing the argument.

    I'm surprised there is apparently "enthusiastic backing" in UK for this ban. I thought the British had more sense than that especially seeing such a tiny amount of Muslim women actually wear it.
    Then you don't have a clue on the history of Islam in the U.K if that surprises you.

    Clearly you need to do far more research on the subject.
    Last edited by texmaster; 03-03-10 at 10:53 PM.
    Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.

    John Adams

  10. #70
    Hippie Hater
    texmaster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Dallas TEXAS
    Last Seen
    08-20-15 @ 01:17 AM
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    3,969

    Re: Five European states back burka ban

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    What on earth are you talking about? How many times have you seen a nun in a bikini or an orthodox Jewish woman in a miniskirt? The only difference between those outfits and a burqa is the niqab.
    My God you are clueless.

    Nuns are NOT required to wear their full traditional garb everywhere they go nor is there ANY law in Judism forbidding mini skirts. Would you please stop grasping at straws before you embarrass yourself any further.

    And there is no religious text requiring those clothes to be worn either. What's so hard to understand about this?
    LOL What does that have to do with this argument in any way?

    All orthodox women work for "the church?" Interesting.
    Never said that either. Please do not lie about what I have stated.

    And this is the problem - you just don't understand what you're talking about. There are literally innumerable religious practices that are not explicitly mandated by any primary religious text. They're no less religious for that. The bible doesn't say anything about exactly how a church service should be organized, so does that mean that the government could ban various types of church services?
    Actually it is you who don't have clue what the argument is about. You claim the Burka is a religious symbol as your reasoning for not banning the outfit yet you admit there are "innumerable religious practices that are not explicitly mandated by any primary religious text"

    So....exactly how can you keep claiming you can't ban it because its religious?

    Please make up your mind which argument you are going to use and get back to us

    And how does a woman walking down the street with a niqab on "interfere with basic security"?
    If they walk into a bank, get a driver's license, enter any high security area and are completely covered including the face? Exactly how hard is this for you to understand? I even gave you links to stories about it and you still don't get it.

    Oy. There are many who believe that Muslim women should wear the burqa at all times as part of their religious observance. This is a protected religious right.


    No, it is not. You keep pretending all interpretations of Islam are all protected under freedom of religion but fail to understand that security is also an issue that conflicts with this setup.

    This obviously conflicts with some compelling government interests, such as in situations where visual identification is needed. As a result, an intrusion onto that religious right is warranted in those limited situations. Such a compelling government interest does not exist when the woman is merely walking down the street or sitting on her porch. Accordingly, the government may not intrude on that right in those scenarios.
    So thats the only place? How about a bank? How about a workplace? How about a high security area? Are you just completely oblivious to the hundreds of situations where this would be a problem or is this a special day for you?

    I honestly don't know what to say to your claim that I don't know what I'm defending, given that you very clearly don't seem to understand the issues of religion or law involved here.
    And I honestly don't know how to explain to you that this is an interpretation of Islam not a universal belief. How hard is that to understand?

    I'm sorry, you're just wrong.
    Well gee, with all the facts in that statement I must be!

    Repeating a falsehood does not transform it into a truth.
    Nice dodge but if you don't want to understand that not all Muslims follow this practice just say so.

    WTF? Have you read a single article about this topic? The stated reason for the ban is that the burqa supposedly violates the woman's freedom and dignity. This is really not disputable.
    Yes I have and I'm waiting for you to back up your claim that the garmet being any female is the majoirty argument used against the burka.

    Did you really think you can pull that from your backside and think it will just be accepted because you say so?

    "And I won't answer them because I can't explain why they're different"
    There is nothing to answer. You throw theoretical arguments to answer a debate question and think its evidence? Next time try using unicorns in your "what if" arguments. At least it will be more amusing

    I'm just amazed at how scared people are over this.
    Who said they are scared? Are you mind reading again?

    Again, you're telling me that the fact that some women choose to cover their face while walking down the street creates a security problem? We better ban halloween while we're at it, cause those ****ers wear masks and that **** is DANGEROUS.
    Newsflash. Halloween isn't every single day my little friend.



    Your argument would be more amusing if it wasn't so sad. In your mind, society should accept ALL interpretations of Islam including all traditional garments to be worn and to hell with any security problems that would arise.

    It is a sad and child-like appeal to the politically correct world and it truely is sad you are going so far out to defend something that isn't even practiced by all Muslims.


    I can wait to see you jump on board when the pagans want to sacrifice live animals in the public square and defend their right to religious freedom.
    Last edited by texmaster; 03-03-10 at 11:13 PM.
    Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.

    John Adams

Page 7 of 9 FirstFirst ... 56789 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •