Page 4 of 5 FirstFirst ... 2345 LastLast
Results 31 to 40 of 50

Thread: Obama: Bipartisan health deal may not be possible

  1. #31
    Guru
    Morality Games's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Iowa
    Last Seen
    05-24-16 @ 10:00 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    3,733

    Re: Obama: Bipartisan health deal may not be possible

    Quote Originally Posted by Bassman View Post
    What for?? You're the one who wants Conservatives out of the political discourse!
    And you want liberals out of the political discourse. And all opposing ideologies try to minimize the influence of the other ideology.

    You really didn't notice the hypocrisy in complaining about how liberals want to get conservatives out of the political discourse when you declared your desire for a conservative hegemony and for liberalism to longer exist? It's the same thing.
    Last edited by Morality Games; 02-26-10 at 12:42 AM.
    If you notice something good in yourself, give credit to God, not to yourself, but be certain the evil you commit is always your own and yours to acknowledge.

    St. Benedict

  2. #32
    It's Just Boris.
    Bassman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    West end of the Erie Canal (That's Buffalo, NY for those of you in Rio Linda)
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:33 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    1,694

    Re: Obama: Bipartisan health deal may not be possible

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    And you want liberals out of the political discourse. And all opposing ideologies try to minimize the influence of the other ideology.

    You really didn't notice the hypocrisy in complaining about how liberals want to get conservatives out of the political discourse when you declared your desire for a conservative hegemony and for liberalism to longer exist? It's the same thing.
    The major difference is that Liberalism has nothing but lies and emotions whereas Conservatism is grounded in the Truth.


    11/8/16: A day of great relief for America

  3. #33
    Advisor Iron Yank's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Wisconsin
    Last Seen
    12-21-16 @ 09:58 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    317

    Re: Obama: Bipartisan health deal may not be possible

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    Aside from death panels?

    1. You'll have no choice in what health benefits you receive.

    2. No chemo for older Medicare patients.

    3. Illegal immigrants will get free health insurance.

    4. The government will set doctors' wages.

    The Top 5 Lies About Obama's Health Care Reform - Newsweek.com
    Link

    The AP is technically correct in stating that end-of-life counseling is not the same as a death panel. The New York Times is also correct to point out that the health care bill contains no provision setting up such a panel.


    What both outlets fail to point out is that the panel already exists.


    H.R. 1 (more commonly known as the Recovery and Reinvestment Act, even more commonly known as the Stimulus Bill and aptly dubbed the Porkulus Bill) contains a whopping $1.1 billion to fund the Federal Coordinating Council for Comparative Effectiveness Research. The Council is the brain child of former Health and Human Services Secretary Nominee Tom Daschle. Before the Porkulus Bill passed, Betsy McCaughey, former Lieutenant governor of New York, wrote in detail about the Council's purpose.


    Daschle's stated purpose (and therefore President Obama's purpose) for creating the Council is to empower an unelected bureaucracy to make the hard decisions about health care rationing that elected politicians are politically unable to make. The end result is to slow costly medical advancement and consumption. Daschle argues that Americans ought to be more like Europeans who passively accept "hopeless diagnoses."


    McCaughey goes on to explain:

    Daschle says health-care reform "will not be pain free." Seniors should be more accepting of the conditions that come with age instead of treating them.


    More than all other presidents before him combined?
    Link

    After harshly criticizing President Bush for running $3.3 trillion in deficits over eight years, President Obama's budget would run $7.6 trillion in deficits over what would be his eight years in the Oval Office. Moreover, President Obama would run up more debt over his eight years than all other Presidents in American history--from George Washington through George W. Bush--combined. As a result of these deficits, net interest spending would reach $840 billion in 2020
    Link
    Mr. Obama's $3.6 trillion budget blueprint, by his own admission, redefines the role of government in our economy and society. The budget more than doubles the national debt held by the public, adding more to the debt than all previous presidents -- from George Washington to George W. Bush -- combined

  4. #34
    Guru
    Morality Games's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Iowa
    Last Seen
    05-24-16 @ 10:00 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    3,733

    Re: Obama: Bipartisan health deal may not be possible

    Quote Originally Posted by Bassman View Post
    The major difference is that Liberalism has nothing but lies and emotions whereas Conservatism is grounded in the Truth.
    I don't believe you, and you're basically arguing because what you say is true you deserve to be a hypocrite. The content of an experience, whether its true or false or reasoned or emotional, does not alter the nature of hypocrisy. My belief that smoking is unhealthy may be true and reasoned, but it would still be hypocritical of me to say it is wrong for other people should not smoke because it is unhealthy for them if I was smoking myself.

    If being conservative means you are free of all obligation to be virtuous, then it is a good thing I am not conservative.

    Quote:
    More than all other presidents before him combined?
    Link

    Quote:
    After harshly criticizing President Bush for running $3.3 trillion in deficits over eight years, President Obama's budget would run $7.6 trillion in deficits over what would be his eight years in the Oval Office. Moreover, President Obama would run up more debt over his eight years than all other Presidents in American history--from George Washington through George W. Bush--combined. As a result of these deficits, net interest spending would reach $840 billion in 2020
    Link
    Quote:
    Mr. Obama's $3.6 trillion budget blueprint, by his own admission, redefines the role of government in our economy and society. The budget more than doubles the national debt held by the public, adding more to the debt than all previous presidents -- from George Washington to George W. Bush -- combined
    None of that is credible. There is no telling what Obama's deficits will be until his tenure in office is finished. There is furthermore no proof higher and higher deficits is something any president could have avoided; on the contrary, deficits are projected to rise significantly no matter what is done or who is in office.

    Several trillion more or less doesn't make much difference at this point because any policy aiming to reduce our debt will not be encumbered or helped much by the difference, be it high or low.
    Last edited by Morality Games; 02-26-10 at 01:18 AM.
    If you notice something good in yourself, give credit to God, not to yourself, but be certain the evil you commit is always your own and yours to acknowledge.

    St. Benedict

  5. #35
    Banned
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    In your dreams...
    Last Seen
    05-29-12 @ 02:53 PM
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    10,621

    Re: Obama: Bipartisan health deal may not be possible

    Wow Morality and Bass should do this while fencing it would be like a chinese opera!

  6. #36
    Advisor Iron Yank's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Wisconsin
    Last Seen
    12-21-16 @ 09:58 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    317

    Re: Obama: Bipartisan health deal may not be possible

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post

    None of that is credible. There is no telling what Obama's deficits will be until his tenure in office is finished.
    Its credible if he keeps spending at the rate he is, do you see any sign he's going to change that? I dont

    There is furthermore no proof higher and higher deficits is something any president could have avoided; on the contrary, deficits are projected to rise significantly no matter what is done or who is in office.
    Oh really?

    Link -Wash. Post

    The White House's 2011 budget is only the second-most interesting budget proposal released recently. First prize goes to Congressman Paul Ryan, the ranking Republican on the House Budget Committee, who's released a budget proposal that actually erases the massive long-term deficit.

    That's not mere press release braggadocio. CBO agrees (pdf). Under the CBO's likeliest long-term scenario, deficits are at 42 percent of GDP in 2080. Under Ryan's proposal, we're seeing surpluses of 5 percent of GDP by that time.

  7. #37
    Guru
    Morality Games's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Iowa
    Last Seen
    05-24-16 @ 10:00 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    3,733

    Re: Obama: Bipartisan health deal may not be possible

    Oh really?

    Link -Wash. Post
    The Washington Post is not being precise. They forget to qualify that the only deficit that would have been erased would have been in programs pertaining to health care, because that's the only aspect of the deficit the proposal covers.

    It is deeply immoral (it alters the nature of programs the elderly were told to rely on when making their plans for later life), and for that reason is basically wishful thinking because it challenges programs and institutions that have a staked out existence in the hearts and minds of all Americans, politicians and laymen. American consciences may not be the most considerable force in the world, but they still aren't going to make health care harder to afford for their already struggling parents and grandparents.

    It's like a prisoner imagining how easy it would be to escape his cell if only there were no walls closing him inside. Virtually, what Paul Ryan proposed is something most people know could work but nobody (whatever side of the aisle they occupy) is willing to do.

    Its credible if he keeps spending at the rate he is, do you see any sign he's going to change that? I dont
    Obama's strategy assumes there is nothing that can be done to stop the debt from growing exponentially. Since an exponentially growing debt is about the same problem whether it is a few trillion higher or lower, he supposes he might as well spend the few trillion more to have a functioning economy and health care system. Then you only have one huge problem instead of three very large problems.
    Last edited by Morality Games; 02-26-10 at 01:37 AM.
    If you notice something good in yourself, give credit to God, not to yourself, but be certain the evil you commit is always your own and yours to acknowledge.

    St. Benedict

  8. #38
    Sage
    CriticalThought's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:12 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    18,121

    Re: Obama: Bipartisan health deal may not be possible

    I'm torn. I don't like the bills in the House or Senate. I also don't think Obama's bill is much better. But I think the Republican ideas are ludicrous. It would undouctedly cost more to go the step by step approach and they know it. They just want to stall so it falls through. In fact, everything they have done has been a threater show and I'm pretty sick of it. So I'll probably end up supporting a bill pushed through by reconciliation just because I'm sick of the tactics that Republicans have stooped to in order to sway public opinion.

  9. #39
    Sage
    soccerboy22's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    A warm place
    Last Seen
    12-02-17 @ 10:35 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    10,723

    Re: Obama: Bipartisan health deal may not be possible

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    I'm torn. I don't like the bills in the House or Senate. I also don't think Obama's bill is much better. But I think the Republican ideas are ludicrous. It would undouctedly cost more to go the step by step approach and they know it. They just want to stall so it falls through. In fact, everything they have done has been a threater show and I'm pretty sick of it. So I'll probably end up supporting a bill pushed through by reconciliation just because I'm sick of the tactics that Republicans have stooped to in order to sway public opinion.
    One part of the Republican bill that I like it the tort reform. It is far to easy to sue doctors for malpractice.

  10. #40
    pirate lover
    liblady's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    St Thomas, VI
    Last Seen
    03-14-16 @ 03:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    16,165
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Obama: Bipartisan health deal may not be possible

    Quote Originally Posted by soccerboy22 View Post
    One part of the Republican bill that I like it the tort reform. It is far to easy to sue doctors for malpractice.
    states that have enacted tort reform have seen minimal decreases in the cost of malpractice insurance.

    Originally Posted by johnny_rebson:

    These are the same liberals who forgot how Iraq attacked us on 9/11.


Page 4 of 5 FirstFirst ... 2345 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •