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Thread: 2 Generals Wary About Repealing Gay Policy

  1. #471
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    Re: 2 Generals Wary About Repealing Gay Policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    So tell me please, what difference is there between a flamboyant gay joining for benefits, and a macho strait guy? Why is it ok for one to do so, but not the other? The problem with your comments is that it assumes that somehow flamboyant gays are somehow corrupt and taking advantage, while the strait is not.

    Oh, by the way, I am a vet, I do have some experience with what I am talking about.
    Like I said...you refuse to get it. You CANT be that stupid.

    Its UNDERSTANDABLE they might weant to join for the benefits. I WAS the one that brought it up. But if you dont think that type of personality and characteristic would be in conflict in a military environment...

    nah...you arent that stupid. So its deliberate.

    Werent you the vet that joined and then got out in basic?

    Look...I KNOW there are homosexuals that serve with honor. I have no problem with that. And I have no problem with homosexuals in general. I also have a good understanding of the military. I dont believe the two are compatible. And rather than give you some namby pamby dance about it...I unlike many others will simply tell you straight up WHY. I personally couldnt giuve a damn whether you agree or not. This is a discussion forum. Im not stupid enough to believe you or I or anyone here will be influencing policy. Ive given you my opinion. Its based on a lifetime of military experience. You on the other hand want it to be so...and so you will ignore the realities and problems. Thats fine too. Im not here to change your mind. I DONT CARE if you change your mind or not.

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    Re: 2 Generals Wary About Repealing Gay Policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    So tell me please, what difference is there between a flamboyant gay joining for benefits, and a macho strait guy? Why is it ok for one to do so, but not the other? The problem with your comments is that it assumes that somehow flamboyant gays are somehow corrupt and taking advantage, while the strait is not.

    Oh, by the way, I am a vet, I do have some experience with what I am talking about.
    I didnt see the response...Im sure I missed it...

    Are homosexuals still currently prohibited from donating blood? STILL? Why is that? And what impact might that have in a combat field environment where people sweat together...bleed together...

    Concerns. Problems. Ignore them...I dont care...it wont change facts.

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    Re: 2 Generals Wary About Repealing Gay Policy

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    I didnt see the response...Im sure I missed it...

    Are homosexuals still currently prohibited from donating blood? STILL? Why is that? And what impact might that have in a combat field environment where people sweat together...bleed together...

    Concerns. Problems. Ignore them...I dont care...it wont change facts.
    Military is tested for HIV/AIDS every year and there are actually people in the military that have HIV/AIDS. They can only be stationed in certain places, but I do know that we had 2 at Pearl Harbor while I was there. We aren't allowed to know who they are, but obviously it's in their medical records.

    Also, since gays are serving in the military anyway under DADT, isn't this a bad argument considering that technically you can't ask them that question. Also, wouldn't it be better for the military to know who is gay so that they can figure out if more frequent testing should be performed on certain servicemembers who prove to be in the higher risk groups so that it is detected faster? And you can't get HIV from sweating or even bleeding on someone, an actual fluid exchange has to happen. So a greater problem would come from if someone needed a blood transfusion who had a rare blood type. Although, if it were a ship that just left Thailand, the person is probably screwed anyway. I would be more worried about the guys that frequent whore houses in every foreign port we go to than the gay ones having HIV/AIDS.
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  4. #474
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    Re: 2 Generals Wary About Repealing Gay Policy

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Military is tested for HIV/AIDS every year and there are actually people in the military that have HIV/AIDS. They can only be stationed in certain places, but I do know that we had 2 at Pearl Harbor while I was there. We aren't allowed to know who they are, but obviously it's in their medical records.

    Also, since gays are serving in the military anyway under DADT, isn't this a bad argument considering that technically you can't ask them that question. Also, wouldn't it be better for the military to know who is gay so that they can figure out if more frequent testing should be performed on certain servicemembers who prove to be in the higher risk groups so that it is detected faster? And you can't get HIV from sweating or even bleeding on someone, an actual fluid exchange has to happen. So a greater problem would come from if someone needed a blood transfusion who had a rare blood type. Although, if it were a ship that just left Thailand, the person is probably screwed anyway. I would be more worried about the guys that frequent whore houses in every foreign port we go to than the gay ones having HIV/AIDS.
    1-Unless things have changed RADICALLY in the last few years, the military is NOT tested for HIV AIDS.

    2-Its a POINT...a PROBLEM. If foer no other reason, there will be many who WILL think twice about providing life saving field first aid.

    I GET that you want to gloss over every problem so that you can get what you want. It doesnt make it not a problem.

    Homosexuals are not allowed to donate blood. WHY???

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    Re: 2 Generals Wary About Repealing Gay Policy

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Like I said...you refuse to get it. You CANT be that stupid.

    Its UNDERSTANDABLE they might weant to join for the benefits. I WAS the one that brought it up. But if you dont think that type of personality and characteristic would be in conflict in a military environment...

    nah...you arent that stupid. So its deliberate.

    Werent you the vet that joined and then got out in basic?

    Look...I KNOW there are homosexuals that serve with honor. I have no problem with that. And I have no problem with homosexuals in general. I also have a good understanding of the military. I dont believe the two are compatible. And rather than give you some namby pamby dance about it...I unlike many others will simply tell you straight up WHY. I personally couldnt giuve a damn whether you agree or not. This is a discussion forum. Im not stupid enough to believe you or I or anyone here will be influencing policy. Ive given you my opinion. Its based on a lifetime of military experience. You on the other hand want it to be so...and so you will ignore the realities and problems. Thats fine too. Im not here to change your mind. I DONT CARE if you change your mind or not.
    You brought up gays and taking advantage of military benefits. You tied the two together so that it somehow wrong for gays to join for the benefits. You have yet to explain why gays joining for the benefits is any different than straits joining for the benefits. You simply resort to ad hominem as if that makes your point.

    You have not shown how gays would disrupt the service(hint: they do not now). You have not shown why those in the service would not be able to handle what the rest of the country, and other militaries handle trivially. You have not, in point of fact, made any point at all beyond you don't like gays. That is your failure.

    You have managed to attempt to suggest that I did not complete my service, which is a flat out lie. I did 6 years and got out honorably at the end of my enlistment. You could easily figure that out since the award is next to every post I make. You will, please, not try and suggest otherwise again.
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    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    Re: 2 Generals Wary About Repealing Gay Policy

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    1-Unless things have changed RADICALLY in the last few years, the military is NOT tested for HIV AIDS.

    2-Its a POINT...a PROBLEM. If foer no other reason, there will be many who WILL think twice about providing life saving field first aid.

    I GET that you want to gloss over every problem so that you can get what you want. It doesnt make it not a problem.

    Homosexuals are not allowed to donate blood. WHY???
    The military has been tested for HIV/AIDS regularly since before I joined in 87. You are factually incorrect.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    Re: 2 Generals Wary About Repealing Gay Policy

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    1-Unless things have changed RADICALLY in the last few years, the military is NOT tested for HIV AIDS.

    2-Its a POINT...a PROBLEM. If foer no other reason, there will be many who WILL think twice about providing life saving field first aid.

    I GET that you want to gloss over every problem so that you can get what you want. It doesnt make it not a problem.

    Homosexuals are not allowed to donate blood. WHY???
    I started Active duty in '98. I was tested for HIV/AIDS then and every year until I got out in '08. Now in the Navy Reserves, the test is only required once every 2 or 3 years and if the member is called up for IA duty to go work with the Army or Marines in the desert they have to get one.

    But it doesn't matter because think about it. There are homosexuals in the military now. I don't know how many times I have to say this. The only thing about now is that you know who fewer of them are especially if they fear that the unit is going to ostracize them for being that way, or worse not perform first aid on them. Of course when DADT is repealed, no one will be required to tell you they're gay, so the risk would still be there. So again, this is full of holes and doesn't work.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

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    Re: 2 Generals Wary About Repealing Gay Policy

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    1-Unless things have changed RADICALLY in the last few years, the military is NOT tested for HIV AIDS.

    2-Its a POINT...a PROBLEM. If foer no other reason, there will be many who WILL think twice about providing life saving field first aid.

    I GET that you want to gloss over every problem so that you can get what you want. It doesnt make it not a problem.

    Homosexuals are not allowed to donate blood. WHY???
    Roguenuke is correct. The military does test for HIV and HIV positive soldiers aren't automatically discharged.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: 2 Generals Wary About Repealing Gay Policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Is this anything like navy beer days? WE seemed to handle them. I bet we could handle being issues whiskey as well. Why do you have such a low opinion of our troops?
    That's the Navy. Not the Army. Two different demographics. I think you would agree that the "class" of person that enlists in the Navy is much different than that that enlists in the Army and branches infantry.

    I've seen first hand what happens when a 19 y/o grunt gets drunk off duty, just like I've seen how stupid a 19 y/o grunt can become, while totally sober, on duty. I've seen them show up to first formation, still drunk from the night before and beligerent as hell. I even had a young man think he was ten-foot-tall-and-bullet-proof enough to whip my ass one morning and got his-self a free ride to the troop medical clinic to close up the cuts he received when he accidentally bumped his head against the butt of my weapon.

    So, yes, whiskey rations in the United States Army will have a much more adverse effect than they do in the British Army.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: 2 Generals Wary About Repealing Gay Policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    You brought up gays and taking advantage of military benefits. You tied the two together so that it somehow wrong for gays to join for the benefits. You have yet to explain why gays joining for the benefits is any different than straits joining for the benefits. You simply resort to ad hominem as if that makes your point.

    You have not shown how gays would disrupt the service(hint: they do not now). You have not shown why those in the service would not be able to handle what the rest of the country, and other militaries handle trivially. You have not, in point of fact, made any point at all beyond you don't like gays. That is your failure.

    You have managed to attempt to suggest that I did not complete my service, which is a flat out lie. I did 6 years and got out honorably at the end of my enlistment. You could easily figure that out since the award is next to every post I make. You will, please, not try and suggest otherwise again.
    Dont be obtuse. In no way did I imply it would be wrong for gays to join to take advantage of the benefits offered. In point of fact I stated it was a legitimate reason for anyone to join. Its a strawman and a VERY weak tactic.

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