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Navy will soon let women serve on subs

ADK_Forever said:
The military might protect us very, very well but, as far as being human beings they sometimes leave a lot to be desired.


Military Culture Punishes Rape Victims instead of Rapists | Women's Rights | Change.org

It's conduct like this, by men!, that shines a light on just one major problem with our military. This is from the top on down. And anybody who has ever served knows it.
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The first line pretty much sums up the whole stupid article....

"Feminists are keenly aware that we live in a society that promotes a rape culture."

It's this kind of stupidity that causes people to look like ****ing morons.

#1 it was a joke, not a commentary on anything in the military. Definitely not rape. :roll:
 
Blackdog said:
#1 Because they are not.

#2 Because I was joking hence the ;) at the end.

Get with the Internets man!
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Don't worry. I understood, and set it up to an extent. Cross service rivalry is a good thing.
 
Redress said:
Hearing them fire is a trip. Movies get those noises so wrong. Sounds like the worlds largest chain saw.

edit: whole Navy is cream of the crop. Certain people dismiss the navy in that we don't go fight on the ground, without ever realizing that the stressed involved in 6+ months at sea are, while different, pretty extreme.
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i've done a pump in Iraq, and I did a MEU (Marine Expeditionary Unit), which is also known as a "float" due to the fact that you spend your whole time on a boat. After 6+ months on the Iwo Jima, i can tell you, the stress of being in-country simply isn't comparable. i'd be willing to extend the possibility to the sub guys because i just haven't been there and don't know, but the surface navy? please. i don't recall field trips and port calls being part of the agenda in Fallujah. ;)
 
ADK_Forever said:
It's conduct like this, by men!, that shines a light on just one major problem with our military. This is from the top on down. And anybody who has ever served knows it.
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:shrug: i've served; i've literally never seen this come up as an issue. the study is crap, and people who are too eager to believe and propagate it merely expose themselves.
 
ADK_Forever said:
The military might protect us very, very well but, as far as being human beings they sometimes leave a lot to be desired.


Military Culture Punishes Rape Victims instead of Rapists | Women's Rights | Change.org

It's conduct like this, by men!, that shines a light on just one major problem with our military. This is from the top on down. And anybody who has ever served knows it.
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Having served, and in a very male dominated field, I have to say this report is full of it.

First of all, when was this done? Who were the veterans they surveyed and when did they serve? I know most of the guys I served with were very protective of most of the girls in the division. Heck, I changed in the same area as the guys in one of the places I worked. It wasn't really a big deal. The guys are sometimes overprotective in fact. I was drunk at a party once, and one of the guys was annoying me. The other guys threw him out of the house for grabbing my hand when I told him not to.
Another important point is the report doesn't say that all of the 30% were raped/assaulted by other military members, just that they were victims of rape/assault. It doesn't even say they were all committed by men.
The only time I was ever even close to being "sexually assaulted" during my ten years active was walking down the sidewalk in Waikiki, and the person who did it was a drunk civilian female. She grabbed my boobs while I was trying to hold her up.

Also, restricted reporting makes it more likely for rapes and sexual assaults to be reported, not less. The victim gets the medical attention and support needed without having an investigation started. And a restricted report can be changed to an unrestricted at any time. Restricted reports of sexual assault/rape are still considered being reported, they just aren't investigated. I don't know why anyone would claim this would make them more likely to be unreported.

And no matter what some want to believe, some women do lie about being sexually assaulted or raped. Some do it to get out of being in trouble with either the military or with their significant other. We had a girl get transferred to my ship because of this.
 
bhkad said:
Navy will soon let women serve on subs
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Breakfast, lunch and dinner? Wow now women can serve food anywhere.

WTB "yo-dawg" pic of female sailor holding a sub sandwich while on a sub ;)
 
There are problems every day with men and women serving together aboard a Navy Combatent.......The average age of the typical enlisted person aboard ship in nineteen and that is the age when the juices are flowing.....there are to many places aboard a ship for hanky panky and it goes on.......

Prior to women serving aboard combatants this was never a problem....God knows there were enough problems already and now you add another to it........

Officers and Chiefs are afraid to complain on the record for fear of their careers being ruined... Off the record they will tell you that women on combatants has been a miserable failure..........

I am going to get slammed by the PC people now but if you know anything about the subject in your heart of hearts you know I am right.........
 
Women serving "on" long, hard, objects that go really "deep," and that are populated by semen. Er, I mean, seamen.

This is fantastic material.
 
Areopagitican said:
Women serving "on" long, hard, objects that go really "deep," and that are populated by semen. Er, I mean, seamen.

This is fantastic material.
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You dirty-minded bastard.

:2razz:
 
rivrrat said:
Assigning positions based on skill is one thing. Flat out PROHIBITING an entire ****ing segment of the population is entirely another. I mean, prior to '48, blacks weren't ALLOWED in many positions in the military, and they were segregated. That's okay with you? Since they were allowed in the military, and all, right? Doesn't matter that blacks were just cooks and whatnot because they were deemed too stupid and weak to do anything of real importance? I mean, they were at least allowed to walk through the door, so that makes it all a-ok.

Gimme a ****ing break. Jesus, I may as well be talking to my nephew for all the comprehension you're displaying here.
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That's not true. Where do you get that from? The Navy was integrated before the Civil War. Blacks were serving all manner of positions since the Rev War; infantry, artillery, cavalry, engineers.

Black artillerists during WW2.
US_Army_WWII_field_artillery.jpg


Black cavalrymen of the 10th US Cavalry. AKA, "Buffalo Soldiers". John "Blackjack" Pershing commanded the 10th. He was given the nickname, "Blackjack", because of his service with the 10th during the Span-Am war.

buffalo_soldiers1_arwl.jpg


The 54th Mass. attacking Fort Wagner.
54th-regiment.jpg


Black engineers from the 23rd Engineer Regiment. See the guy in the center rear of the photo that is wearing the cap rather than a campaign hat? Yeah, he's an officer and he's black. I'm not sure of the time period for the photo, but it's definitly prior to 1948.
ColoredSoldiers23rdEngineers-sm.jpg


Why is it that alotta folks are so historically challenged?
 
It's the history books these days. You learn factoids, nothing else. No nuances. Everything must be able to fit onto one line, usually in one sentence.

Consider what would show up on a test....

When were blacks integrated?

A: 1948
B: 1999
C: Yesterday
D: 1917
E: 1776

or...

When were blacks integrated?

A: A description of your post
B: Equally Long Answer
C: Ect
D: Ect
E: Ect

Obviously, only the most advanced classes attempt to take on nuances. Otherwise, nah, history books these days try to keep it simple.
 
I'm not sure if this has been brought up in this thread, I just jumped in and read only a few posts..

Anyways, I used to work around submariners, guarding, loading and shipping nuclear weapons. I was in the Marines, stationed at a sub base.


Here's an interesting fact NCIS told us, and it is one I wonder how will play in to the current situation. Submariners, especially those who deploy on the boomers (deep diving, long duration under water, nuclear armed subs) have BY FAR the highest rates of child pornography charges pressed against them. NCIS didn't go in to any theories as to why it is as prevalent in that community as it is, but I'm sure you guys could think of a couple.

Anyways, women on subs is just as bad as an idea as women serving in the infantry, albeit for mostly different reasons.
 
rivrrat said:
So you think, because you have an antiquated sexist worldview. I disagree. I don't think a penis is required to shoot a gun well.
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And if you get shot and need to be carried to saftey which is 1/2 a click away and all your 190 lbs has to carry it is a 110 lbs female you might feel different.
 
braindrain said:
And if you get shot and need to be carried to saftey which is 1/2 a click away and all your 190 lbs has to carry it is a 110 lbs female you might feel different.
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Hows about the other way around? Your female squad mate gets shot and all YOUR ass has to carry is her 110 pounds...As if a female who could pass the standards for a infantry squad would only weigh 110 pounds...But still, you get my point.

:lol:

Plus, what if you have a potential spine injury...Are your squad mates going to toss you over their shoulder or create a makeshift stretcher? Then two people have to carry you anyway...Of course, depending on the possiblity of further combat developing...
 
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Polynikes said:
I'm not sure if this has been brought up in this thread, I just jumped in and read only a few posts..

Anyways, I used to work around submariners, guarding, loading and shipping nuclear weapons. I was in the Marines, stationed at a sub base.


Here's an interesting fact NCIS told us, and it is one I wonder how will play in to the current situation. Submariners, especially those who deploy on the boomers (deep diving, long duration under water, nuclear armed subs) have BY FAR the highest rates of child pornography charges pressed against them. NCIS didn't go in to any theories as to why it is as prevalent in that community as it is, but I'm sure you guys could think of a couple.

Anyways, women on subs is just as bad as an idea as women serving in the infantry, albeit for mostly different reasons.
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I'm not sure who you talked to or when, but boomers only average about 77 days out to sea. Then they usually come back in for a little over a month for maintenance, and switch crews. They have a blue and a gold crew. That means that out of every six months, a boomer crew is only out to sea for maybe a little over two months on average. This is a big reason why many married guys who have volunteered for subs will go for a boomer. They get to spend more time with their wives.

*As a note, what I posted I found on the net. Just so no one thinks that I am putting out classified info.
 
roguenuke said:
I'm not sure who you talked to or when, but boomers only average about 77 days out to sea. Then they usually come back in for a little over a month for maintenance, and switch crews. They have a blue and a gold crew. That means that out of every six months, a boomer crew is only out to sea for maybe a little over two months on average. This is a big reason why many married guys who have volunteered for subs will go for a boomer. They get to spend more time with their wives.

*As a note, what I posted I found on the net. Just so no one thinks that I am putting out classified info.
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You missed one little detail.....the 77 days they are underway they are submerged......
 
The Mark said:
Hows about the other way around? Your female squad mate gets shot and all YOUR ass has to carry is her 110 pounds...As if a female who could pass the standards for a infantry squad would only weigh 110 pounds...But still, you get my point.

:lol:

Plus, what if you have a potential spine injury...Are your squad mates going to toss you over their shoulder or create a makeshift stretcher? Then two people have to carry you anyway...Of course, depending on the possiblity of further combat developing...
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I don't really get your point. With a guy with me I have a decent chance of being carried to saftey while with the chick I have almost none. I have carried some pretty heavy dudes on the top of my ruck for quite a distance and while not fun it is still worth it to know that if the shoe is on the other foot he will be able to carry me.
If we are still getting shot at it dosent matter if I have a spine injury or not they are going to move me a fast as possible. Every man you put holding that stretcher is one less on security and with a small patrol you don't have enough guns facing out to start with.
 
Navy Pride said:
You missed one little detail.....the 77 days they are underway they are submerged......
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Which is different practically from being surrounded by water how? I can think of a couple things, but none of them has any relevance to the discussion(ease of unreps for example).
 
Simple solution - all-woman subs.
 
roguenuke said:
I'm not sure who you talked to or when, but boomers only average about 77 days out to sea. Then they usually come back in for a little over a month for maintenance, and switch crews. They have a blue and a gold crew. That means that out of every six months, a boomer crew is only out to sea for maybe a little over two months on average. This is a big reason why many married guys who have volunteered for subs will go for a boomer. They get to spend more time with their wives.

*As a note, what I posted I found on the net. Just so no one thinks that I am putting out classified info.
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So the point you wish to refute in my post is the definition of the word long?
 
braindrain said:
I don't really get your point. With a guy with me I have a decent chance of being carried to saftey while with the chick I have almost none. I have carried some pretty heavy dudes on the top of my ruck for quite a distance and while not fun it is still worth it to know that if the shoe is on the other foot he will be able to carry me.
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It was really more of a joking response than an attempt at a point.

Although saying that your squad mate would be a 110 pound female is probably incorrect, they would likely be at least 135-150 if they could handle the job. Or perhaps I am wrong.

braindrain said:
If we are still getting shot at it dosent matter if I have a spine injury or not they are going to move me a fast as possible. Every man you put holding that stretcher is one less on security and with a small patrol you don't have enough guns facing out to start with.
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Good point.

But like I said: "Of course, depending on the possiblity of further combat developing..."

If the situation warrented it, you would obviously have to adjust to match.
 
Tashah said:
That's odd. I served twice in hot combat zones. Gaza/Lebanon.

M-4, Glock sidearm, comm links, and a laptop. Hoofing it with the grunts.

None of the grunts perished due to my presence.

On the contrary, I saved their collective grunt asses numerous times.

I never had a bar-tab. The grunts always took care of that.

You see Blackdog, when you're in the suck and getting your grunt ass kicked, a CAS officer (of either gender) is your very best friend.
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I hope your ass gets smoked by a Palestinian, Zionist scum.
 
Blackdog said:
No one is saying a few could not do it.
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Yes, I think that's exactly what you're saying. If not you, some are - definitely NavyDude.
 
Redress said:
Which is different practically from being surrounded by water how? I can think of a couple things, but none of them has any relevance to the discussion(ease of unreps for example).
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If you had ever spent anytime submerged on a sub you might change your mind......I use to begrudge sub sailor the extra money they got until I got underway on the USS DIABLO one day....I never begrudged them the extra money they got again........
 
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