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Women say some rape victims should take blame - survey

liblady said:
the assumption that the way a woman dresses can cause a man to rape.
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No, the assumption is that the way a woman dresses can cause a man to want to have sex with her (or at least, be a factor). It's still the mans choice to rape her because he wanted sex.

Not, note, that I brought up 'the way she dresses' as an example. That was your doing.
 
Redress said:
What in the...

1n 2008, there was about a 1/3 of 1 % chance of being the victim of a violent crime. Now tell me again why I should have to carry a gun to feel safe.
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Ok...
Jerry said:
EDITORIAL: Guns decrease murder rates
In Washington, the best defense is self-defense
By THE WASHINGTON TIMES

More guns in law-abiding hands mean less crime. The District of Columbia proves the point.

<snip>

Few who lived in Washington during the 1970s can forget the upswing in crime that started right after the ban was originally passed. In the five years before the 1977 ban, the murder rate fell from 37 to 27 murders per 100,000. In the five years after the gun ban went into effect, the murder rate rose back up to 35. One fact is particularly hard to ignore: D.C.'s murder rate fluctuated after 1976 but only once fell below what it was in 1976 before the ban. That aberration happened years later, in 1985.

This correlation between the D.C. gun ban and diminished safety was not a coincidence. Look at the Windy City. Immediately after Chicago banned handguns in 1982, the murder rate, which had been falling almost continually for a decade, started to rise. Chicago's murder rate rose relative to other large cities as well. The phenomenon of higher murder rates after gun bans are passed is not just limited to the United States. Every single time a country has passed a gun ban, its murder rate soared.

<snip>
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Harvard Study: Gun Control Is Counterproductive
Would Banning Firearms Reduce Murder and Suicide?
A Review of International and Some Domestic Evidence.
Din B. Kates* and Gary Mauser**

The study, which just appeared in Volume 30, Number 2 of the Harvard Journal of Law & Public Policy (pp. 649-694), set out to answer the question in its title: "Would Banning Firearms Reduce Murder and Suicide? A Review of International and Some Domestic Evidence." Contrary to conventional wisdom, and the sniffs of our more sophisticated and generally anti-gun counterparts across the pond, the answer is "no." And not just no, as in there is no correlation between gun ownership and violent crime, but an emphatic no, showing a negative correlation: as gun ownership increases, murder and suicide decreases.

The findings of two criminologists - Prof. Don Kates and Prof. Gary Mauser - in their exhaustive study of American and European gun laws and violence rates, are telling:

Nations with stringent anti-gun laws generally have substantially higher murder rates than those that do not. The study found that the nine European nations with the lowest rates of gun ownership (5,000 or fewer guns per 100,000 population) have a combined murder rate three times higher than that of the nine nations with the highest rates of gun ownership (at least 15,000 guns per 100,000 population).
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Concealed carry in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Criminals generally want easy targets. Having a gun makes you a harder target. When you're in a population which carries, you are safer even if you don't carry a gun yourself, because a criminal has no way of knowing if you're carrying concealed or not and doesn't want to risk finding out the hard way.
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Redress said:
I should be able to dress however I want without some asshole taking it as permission to rape.
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Yeah, but you can't, so deal with it.

Redress said:
That is 100 % blaming the victim.
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For her part, yup. A victim is only innocent if they did everything they could to guard against the attack. Short of that, the victim shares some level of responsibility.

Redress said:
Using your logic, if I don't want to worry about rape, I just should never leave the house. I would be undeniably safer.
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What would a woman be doing outside a kitchen anyway ;) :lol:
 
Jerry said:
Ok...
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None of which is at all relevant to what I said.

Yeah, but you can't, so deal with it.
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Actually not true.

For her part, yup. A victim is only innocent if they did everything they could to guard against the attack. Short of that, the victim shares some level of responsibility.
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Bull****.


What would a woman be doing outside a kitchen anyway ;) :lol:
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Don't be an ass.
 
Jerry said:
A victim is only innocent if they did everything they could to guard against the attack.
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Explain how this works in a home invasion/rape scenario. Thanks.
 
Catz Part Deux said:
IS it your claim that rapists select victims based upon their clothing? If so, you're mistaken and you understand very little about rape.

Interview: Ron Sanchez, Ph.D.
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Is that Ron "Dirty" Sanchez?......:lol:
I refuse to believe that skimpy clothing has no bearing on sexual assault, especially among the parting college crowd.....:roll:
 
Jerry said:
This is not a gun thread, but guns stop crime, so if you don't want to get raped you can pack heat.

This isn't a fashion thread either, but if you want to lower the risk of being raped, don't dress like a slut.

This isn't a sexuality thread either, but if you want to lower the risk of being raped, don't tease every dick at the bar.

This isn't the Tavern forum, but if you want to lower your chances of being raped, either lay off the hard booze and/or go with trusted friends.
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rape has nothing to do sex. zero, zilch, nada.
 
Partisan said:
Is that Ron "Dirty" Sanchez?......:lol:
I refuse to believe that skimpy clothing has no bearing on sexual assault, especially among the parting college crowd.....:roll:
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Given your level of expertise on the subject, your refusal is meaningless to the discussion.
 
iangb said:
No, the assumption is that the way a woman dresses can cause a man to want to have sex with her (or at least, be a factor). It's still the mans choice to rape her because he wanted sex.

Not, note, that I brought up 'the way she dresses' as an example. That was your doing.
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oh boy. rape isn't about sex.
 
liblady said:
oh boy. rape isn't about sex.
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Typologies of rapists:

Power Reassurance: offender behaviors that suggest an underlying lack of confidence and inadequacy, or belief that the offense is consensual, expressed through minimal force and low confidence;

Power Assertive: offender behaviors that suggest an underlying lack of confidence and inadequacy, expressed through a need for control, mastery, and humiliation of the victim, while demonstrating authority;

Anger Retaliatory: offender behaviors that suggest a great deal of rage, either towards a specific person, group, institution or a symbol of either;

Sadistic: offender behaviors that suggest that the offender gets sexual gratification from victim pain and suffering;

Opportunistic: offender behaviors that suggest an offender who is out to satisfy immediate sexual impulses.

For about 4 of the 5 types of rapists, it is indeed about sex.

http://www.corpus-delicti.com/typologies.html
 
Catz Part Deux said:
Given your level of expertise on the subject, your refusal is meaningless to the discussion.
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Yeah, Catz, you're correct, I'm not a rapist....
I'm not saying you are wrong about the clothing, but you are not 100% correct either & I'll leave it at that....;)
 
Partisan said:
Yeah, Catz, you're correct, I'm not a rapist....
I'm not saying you are wrong about the clothing, but you are not 100% correct either & I'll leave it at that....;)
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Please feel free to provide evidence that clothing serves as a motivational factor in selecting a victim.
 
Catz Part Deux said:
Well, if we're going to, we should be basing it on facts, not stupid assumptions.
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I've asked them, "How do you go about gaining access to houses?" And many of them said that they would look for an open window or unlocked door and just go in the house. And I was amazed to find out how many houses that they encountered had doors unlocked. So I think a simple thing of locking your doors and windows is a deterrent. Anything that makes it more difficult that makes your house or you not a target can be a deterrent.
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:prof Slutty clothing usually has easy access...which is of course it's purpose....so, like locking the door or closing the window, wearing clothing which has harder access is a deterrent.

Slutty cloths = leaving the front door open: ease of access.
 
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Jerry said:
:prof Slutty clothing usually has easy access...which is of course it's purpose....so, like locking the door or closing the window, wearing clothing which has harder access is a deterrent.

Slutty cloths = leaving the front door open: ease of access.
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i really thought you were more intelligent that you appear to be in this thread.
 
liblady said:
i really thought you were more intelligent that you appear to be in this thread.
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Oh man, what ever will I do now that some random stranger in an online forum doesn't have the best opinion of me :(



....I mean, you're not even going to give me credit for reading her source? How many people just keep on chirping while ignoring any data thrown at them? I might be wrong about the clothing, but what distinguishes my typical opinion form some liberal religious-right nut-bal is that my opinions are usually falsifiable; ie, conform to the rules of logic.
 
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apdst said:
It's not bull****. Of course there are risks that come with simply walking out your front door, however a person with an average amount of common sense does things to avoid the risk of being victimized and reduces the risk of being the victim of a freak accident. Therefore, if one crosses the street against the light, or jay-walks, then they take personal responsibility for increasing the risk of being hit by a car.



You use of, "all", doesn't accurately respond to what I'm saying, because I never once made any absolute statements. But, you seem to believe that all women who get raped are in no way responsible for putting themselves in that position and we both know that that's not true.
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Of course there are things that increase and decrease risk. But the victim of a violent assault is NOT to blame for the violent assault. Are they to blame for being in a specific place at a specific time? Sure. But for the assault? Abso****inglutely NOT.


Jerry said:
This is not a gun thread, but guns stop crime, so if you don't want to get raped you can pack heat.
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Wouldn't have helped me.

This isn't a fashion thread either, but if you want to lower the risk of being raped, don't dress like a slut.
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Wouldn't have helped me.

This isn't a sexuality thread either, but if you want to lower the risk of being raped, don't tease every dick at the bar.
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I didn't.

This isn't the Tavern forum, but if you want to lower your chances of being raped, either lay off the hard booze and/or go with trusted friends.
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I was with a trusted friend. Two, actually. One of them raped me.

So why don't you **** off trying to give advice to *women* like all rapes are identical? Like rape victims are somehow to blame for some ****ing bastard of a man deciding he's going to take what he wants no matter what.

apdst said:
No, but at some point we have to accept responsibility for our own actions.
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Sure, we can accept responsibility for deciding to leave the house. But our responsibility stops as soon as the word 'no' is uttered.
 
Jerry said:
:prof Slutty clothing usually has easy access...which is of course it's purpose....so, like locking the door or closing the window, wearing clothing which has harder access is a deterrent.

Slutty cloths = leaving the front door open: ease of access.
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Drinking while posting again, are we?
 
rivrrat said:
I was with a trusted friend. Two, actually. One of them raped me.
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images


So why don't you **** off trying to give advice to *women* like all rapes are identical? Like rape victims are somehow to blame for some ****ing bastard of a man deciding he's going to take what he wants no matter what.
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All I hear is :2bigcry:

Life's a bitch, bend it over the table!!

rivrrat said:
Sure, we can accept responsibility for deciding to leave the house. But our responsibility stops as soon as the word 'no' is uttered.
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Your "no" means exactly squat if you can't enforce it.

You know this is true because "no" didn't stop them, did it?

It only matters in court, when they're surrounded by fit officers with guns putting shekels on them; ie using force!
 
liblady said:
i really thought you were more intelligent than you appear to be in this thread.
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Why on earth would you believe that? :confused:
 
Jerry said:
images




All I hear is :2bigcry:

Life's a bitch, bend it over the table!!



Your "no" means exactly squat if you can't enforce it.

You know this is true because "no" didn't stop them, did it?

It only matters in court, when they're surrounded by fit officers with guns putting shekels on them; ie using force!
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WTF is that even supposed to mean?

There are many things that I can tolerate Jerry. I don't give a ****ing crap about people giving me **** for being a call girl. Or even for working for the feds now. Or being promiscuous. Or for sleeping with married men. 99.9% of the things said to me roll off my back and I really, I mean *really* don't give a **** when people try to insult me.

But my rape? By a good and trusted friend of mine and HIS friend? My being drugged and raped repeatedly by the both of them while my female best friend watched? That is something I will not, I mean will NOT tolerate being told is somehow MY fault. If you persist with this ****ing bull****, then consider our friendship here finit.
 
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