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Thread: Women say some rape victims should take blame - survey

  1. #171
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    Re: Women say some rape victims should take blame - survey

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Yeah, I would...being that age, out that late, smoking pot on some secret location...yeah, you were asking for trouble of some kind.
    We weren't asking for it but certainly made it easy for someone to take advantage of us.
    That's the reason it was secret/secluded, to defer any threat of legal/parent trouble.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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    Re: Women say some rape victims should take blame - survey

    The biggest problem we have in the UK is to get women to report rape.

    Any hurdle that is put in the way of reporting rape is wrong.

    Thankfully prostitutes can say no and their rapists are prosecuted , even though they are asking for it.

  3. #173
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    Re: Women say some rape victims should take blame - survey

    Quote Originally Posted by iangb View Post
    I was just talking about this with a friend.

    My guess, as poorly-thought-out as it is, would be that some women put blame partially on the victim because it's preferable for them to think that all a woman has to do to avoid being raped is to avoid making the mistakes/choices that the victim has made. To accept that the victim is just unlucky is to accept that they could be equally as unlucky, which is a scary prospect for anyone.

    It's easier to think "She acted stupid, I wouldn't make that mistake" than "She was in the wrong place at the wrong time, I could be unlucky too". The illusion that a woman chooses to get herself into a situation where she will be raped unfortunately gives the comfort that others could avoid it simply by making different choices in the same situation.

    The person to blame in a rape is the rapist. In the end, they made the choice.

    EDIT: Yes, the occasional exception to the contrary.
    You have just made an outstanding and accurate psychological assessment of why the survey turned out the way it did. Good job.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


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    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
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    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
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    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  4. #174
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    Re: Women say some rape victims should take blame - survey

    Quote Originally Posted by liblady View Post
    i think men should be outraged by this assumption. it implies that men are unable to control themselves.
    No, it doesn't. It doesn't address the process behind men's actions at all.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

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    Re: Women say some rape victims should take blame - survey

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Uhh you haven't given any information there bud, just a little grandstanding is all
    No, Jerry, I've read the thread. You have presented a whole mess of non-logic. The animal analogy, for example. Completely illogical. Animals are instinctual and do not have the ability to reason in the way that a human would. If you poke an animal it will bite... instinctively. If you poke a human it will assess the situation and decide, based on MANY factors whether or not it will respond, and how it will respond. This is just an example of the lack of logic in your argument. Like I said, either you have presented a complete lack of knowledge on this topic, or this is one of your failed "thought experiments". Either way, your argument is illogical, either by design or by lack of information.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  6. #176
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    Re: Women say some rape victims should take blame - survey

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    I think there is some responsibility, like knowing the people and knowing your surroundings.

    It's not fool proof and it does not excuse the actions of a rapist.
    This is NOT responsibility for the rape. Your choices are independent of this action.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

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    Re: Women say some rape victims should take blame - survey

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    That certainly wasn't what I was saying, if you inferred that from what I wrote.

    I specifically said that rape is not excusable in any situation but pretending that you can't prevent it in some reasonable ways is stupid.
    Know where your going and know the person your with, even then that isn't fool proof but it's important.
    One can make smart choices in any situation to minimize bad things from happening. That does not change, however, that if a bad thing happens TO someone, as an independent variable, the person has no responsibility in that bad thing occurring. Prevention is wise. Doesn't change that the responsibility falls totally on the perp.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  8. #178
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    Re: Women say some rape victims should take blame - survey

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    This is NOT responsibility for the rape. Your choices are independent of this action.
    I agree but there are things that you can do to make yourself less of a target.
    That's really my point.

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    One can make smart choices in any situation to minimize bad things from happening. That does not change, however, that if a bad thing happens TO someone, as an independent variable, the person has no responsibility in that bad thing occurring. Prevention is wise. Doesn't change that the responsibility falls totally on the perp.
    Like I said already, there is no justification for rape but there are bad people in this world and they don't care whose fault it is.
    They want to rape for sex or power, nothing will change this.

    The only thing you can do is try to make yourself less of a target.

    I mean we wouldn't go walking around in a ghetto flashing a fistful of $100 bills.
    That would be stupid even though you aren't responsible for being robbed, the robber is.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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  9. #179
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    Re: Women say some rape victims should take blame - survey

    What could possibly put part of the blame for a violation of a law on the person that the law that protects him was violated?

    Where's the logic in blaming rape victims for the rape?
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

    Dante Alighieri

  10. #180
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    Re: Women say some rape victims should take blame - survey

    To at least some degree, I blame society as a whole because of the way we hang on to these sexual anachronisms whereby we frame the sex act in terms of a woman GRANTING the sex. She is GIVING UP her virginity upon the first instance, she is TAKEN in countless romance novels, and she ACQUIESCES to the manly demands for sex. Certainly, not every person frames sexual relations in these ways, but if the overall assumption is that an act involves one person protecting something and another person seeking it, the ultimate expression of this relationship involves violation almost by very definition. Rape is an exaggeration of the basic framing dynamics of the society at large.

    Because of the ways we frame the sex act, we have created a double standard whereby women are castigated for the very nature that men are rewarded -- the very desire for sex to begin with -- and so women are considered sluts for that which men receive high fives, and as a result if these double standards, an entire interplay between the two sexes can involve the women being put in the position of being shamed lest they put up too little "defense" against guarding their virtue. Although this can lead to situations that I believe do blur the line between consent and rape -- women saying no when they mean yes, and doing so as a way to simultaneously protect their honor while pursuing something that should be perfectly natural -- I think one of the psychological sources of date rapes (as distinguishable from ambush/predatory rapes) has to do with the need to shame. Especially for the younger people for which this more often applies, if a women is shamed for giving up something and a man is shamed if he doesn't get it, the whole relationship is fubared from the get go.

    Until recently, and because of other factors, the rape statistics for Scandinavian countries have long been extremely low compared to ours. For my money, the reason for this has to do with the frank, and matter of fact way Scandinavians have treated the subject compared to us. Instead of this coy, little dance where the male aggressor pursues his object of lust and has to wear down the barriers she puts up, the sex act is treated with less inherent sexism. It is something acknowledged more equally in terms of need, and with fewer double standards. The entire premise being based upon mutual consent instead of conquest produces fewer examples of the ultimate example of conquest -- namely, rape.
    "you're better off on Stormfront discussing how evil brown men are taking innocent white flowers." Infinite Chaos

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