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Thread: Pope Benedict attacks government over Equality Bill

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    Re: Pope launches attack on UK equality law

    Quote Originally Posted by liblady View Post
    once we allow ANY religious doctrine to dictate what a gov't does, that's establishment of a gov't religion.

    the church should be able to hire whomever they please.
    Well, my understanding is that if the government officially adopts a church then it is establishment. However, if they started a Catholic Party in Mass. and they got some folks elected into office on the platform that they will pass laws in accordance with Catholic Law, I think that is perfectly fine. If the electorate elects them.

    We agree it is up to the church to decide who to hire.

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    Re: Pope launches attack on UK equality law

    I see no wrong in opposing a socialistic icon such as the British equality bill.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

    Dante Alighieri

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    Re: Pope launches attack on UK equality law

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    However, if they started a Catholic Party in Mass. and they got some folks elected into office on the platform that they will pass laws in accordance with Catholic Law, I think that is perfectly fine.
    So long as the laws do not violate the rights and liberties of the individual, even in the individual is part of the minority.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Pope launches attack on UK equality law

    Quote Originally Posted by Laila View Post
    No, I am clarifying the law does not affect the core jobs in any religious institution in the UK therefore it is not an attack on any form of 'religious liberty'

    And the law is the UK Equality bill.
    Exactly and it has been around in some form for donkey ages in many countries.

    What the pope is afraid of here, is that the church can be forced to accept women priests and gay priests because of this law and similar. Not gonna happen, but what society must uphold is the law when it comes to non religious jobs with in the church.

    We dont allow employers to discriminate over colour of the skin or sexual orientation, or religion for that matter, and the Church expects us to "bend" or "break" this principle just because it is a religious organisation? Not bloody likely.
    PeteEU

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    Re: Pope launches attack on UK equality law

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    I see no wrong in opposing a socialistic icon such as the British equality bill.
    Doesn't Israel have very similar laws in the books?
    "Yes, but are you a Protestant atheist or a Catholic atheist?".- Northern Irish joke

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    Re: Pope launches attack on UK equality law

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Your beef is with the government, not the free institution. As I said, the rights of the individual are absolute, not the money. In fact, acknowledging the rights and liberties of the individual and holding them above all else despite consequence and responsibility is a corner stone of libertarian political philosophy.
    My gripe is with both, since both parties are guilty.

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    Re: Pope launches attack on UK equality law

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    We agree it is up to the church to decide who to hire.
    The Church can hire who ever they want. No one is stopping them from not hiring the gay guy or the woman or the muslim or Jew.

    What is not acceptable in Europe is to openly state, we will only accept applications from White, Christian, non gay people for the job of washing the Church toilet and that is what the Church has done.

    In Europe you are not even allowed in principle to advertise for a specific sex of the applicants, let alone religion, sexual orientation or ethnicity.

    But in the end it is still up to the company (in this case the Church) that decides who to hire and if a person can prove that he was not hired for a job because he is gay, muslim or whatever, then the Church can be very much liable.

    But then again if the Church or whoever admits that said person was not hired because of his religion or sexual orientation, then they are only asking for it and in this case.. well.. no brainer.
    PeteEU

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    Re: Pope launches attack on UK equality law

    Quote Originally Posted by CrusaderRabbit08 View Post
    My gripe is with both, since both parties are guilty.
    But it's the government who is restricted, not the individual. So it doesn't matter how much you think the individual is "guilty", the government shouldn't be offering up the money in the first place. If the government hands you a bunch of cash and you take it; I may not think you should and may criticize the subsidy, but I don't think you have to follow my rules than. It's the government which has to follow my rules, not other individuals. The rights and liberties of the individual must reign above all else.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Pope launches attack on UK equality law

    Quote Originally Posted by Arcana XV View Post
    Doesn't Israel have very similar laws in the books?
    The Israeli equality laws are slightly less socialistic than the British equality laws, and tend more towards the values of liberalism.

    Yet you are generally correct, and that certainly doesn't mean that two wrongs make a right.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

    Dante Alighieri

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    Re: Pope launches attack on UK equality law

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    The rights and liberties of the individual must reign above all else.
    Agreed ..and my rights are being violated when my tax dollars are being used to subsidize organizations that discriminate.

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