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Obama to call for 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell' repeal, adviser says

Hatuey said:
And the majority of people aren't homophobic. In fact a small percentage are. You among them. What exactly is your point?
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I personally did not know any that were homophobic but then gays are not allowed to serve openly and for morale readiness and cohesion it should stay that way...........Its easy for someone like you who has no clue what it is like to run his mouth and the issue......Your not in..........you don't go to sea for up to 90 days at a time............Its no skin off your ass.........

If you were in the military you might not be so tolerant...........
 
I'm not a friend of political correctness. I can easily work with gays in the workplace and have without any issues as long as they are all professional in conduct. And will be friendly and considerate with them socially within the workplace or in public, but outside those areas I choose to avoid homosexuals because I do not trust them. Its a underlying subtle homophobia much the same as as I would not trust certain types of men around my wife or girl friends. I've never had a single gay thought in my life because such has always been a taboo much like incest. And I am not afraid to say that I do not approve of the homosexual lifestyle. Not that I think such ought not be allowed as what is behind closed doors out of sight, out of mind, within their own clubs and gatherings, is their private business. But within our heterosexual dominant society and culture, I do not want to hear it, see it, or think about it because it is disgusting to this person. And like the many others like me acting gay or flaunting such can provoke violent tendencies. Accordingly I do not want to ever see homosexuals making out in public or on tv nor allow children to. So allowed yes, equal rights in public no.

Now given my honest conservative viewpoint above, I would agree to allow gays in the military however not without restrictions. I've been in the military and there were always some young men that were hot headed, emotional, with a tendency to be violent. Putting gays in with such groups is certain to cause problems. So gays might be allowed in certain technical career fields and stateside desk jobs where they are not having to live in close quarters with lower level enlisted men some of which are certain to have similar attitude as this person.
 
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texmaster said:
If you are going to claim he is homophobic you better be able to prove it.

Lets see your evidence. Show us where he has said he is afraid of homosexuals.

Direct quotes.
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Don't worry about it...........Its Hatuey......we spar like this all the time until we get gigged by the mods...........
 
Navy Pride said:
Don't worry about it...........Its Hatuey......we spar like this all the time until we get gigged by the mods...........
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If you say so. But throwing out false accusations especially that one without evidence is really low.
 
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70s_guy said:
I'm not a friend of political correctness. I can easily work with gays in the workplace and have without any issues as long as they are all professional in conduct. And will be friendly and considerate with them socially within the workplace or in public, but outside those areas I choose to avoid homosexuals because I do not trust them. Its a underlying subtle homophobia much the same as as I would not trust certain types of men around my wife or girl friends. I've never had a single gay thought in my life because such as always been a taboo much like incest. And I am not afraid to say that I do not approve of the homosexual lifestyle. Not that I think such ought not be allowed as what is behind closed doors out of sight, out of mind, within their own clubs and gatherings, is their private business. But within our heterosexual dominant society and culture, I do not want to hear it, see it, or think about it because it is disgusting to this person. And like the many others like me acting gay or flaunting such can provoke violent tendencies. Accordingly I do not want to ever see homosexuals making out in public or on tv nor allow children to. So allowed yes, equal rights in public no.

Now given my honest conservative viewpoint above, I would agree to allow gays in the military however not without restrictions. They ought to be allowed in certain technical career fields and stateside desk jobs where they are not having to live in close quarters with lower level enlisted men some of which are certain to have similar attitude as this person.
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I to have have worked with gays at work.....In fact there was computer type where I worked whom I was good friends with..He is a hell of a guy and sadly he lost his partner to AIDS awhile back....I attended the funeral....I have no problem working with him but after work we go our separate ways...We don't shower or sleep together.........Huge difference if you in the Navy.....that is 24/7 that you will spend with other sailors......
 
Hatuey said:
What happens when a white soldier doesn't want to serve with black soldiers? Well there is your answer.
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Okay, so we court-martial them for discrimination (which may result in a discharge). Only problem is, there might be a lot of court-martials. How do you suppose that would effect their unit cohesiveness?
 
Ethereal said:
Okay, so we court-martial them for discrimination (which may result in a discharge). Only problem is, there might be a lot of court-martials. How do you suppose that would effect their unit cohesiveness?
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In my 21 years in the service I have never seen a case where a sailor got courtmartialed because he did not want to serve with and african american.........
 
Straight men and women in the US military are apparently not professional enough to serve alongside gay men and women without there being detriment to unit cohesion. Of course, the militarys of 24 other nations are professional enough to allow straight men and women to serve alongside gay men and women without there being a detriment to unit cohesion, but the United State military is just so inferior to those other nation's militarys, that our servicemen and servicewomen can be thwarted from fulfilling their mission just because gay men and women are serving alongside them.

Wow, don't I feel safe knowing these people are the ones protecting our country. :shock:
 
CriticalThought said:
Straight men and women in the US military are apparently not professional enough to serve alongside gay men and women without there being detriment to unit cohesion. Of course, the militarys of 24 other nations are professional enough to allow straight men and women to serve alongside gay men and women without there being a detriment to unit cohesion, but the United State military is just so inferior to those other nation's militarys, that our servicemen and servicewomen can be thwarted from fulfilling their mission just because gay men and women are serving alongside them.

Wow, don't I feel safe knowing these people are the ones protecting our country. :shock:
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There is no military in the world like the U.S. Military......Most of them go to work in the morning and come home at night.......They do not have to be the number one police force of the world....

I still can't get over how people like you who have never served have the gall to tell the military how to run their business........
 
Navy Pride said:
There is no military in the world like the U.S. Military......Most of them go to work in the morning and come home at night.......They do not have to be the number one police force of the world....

I still can't get over how people like you who have never served have the gall to tell the military how to run their business........
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I concur, the British Navy cant match this[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InBXu-iY7cw"]YouTube- In the Navy[/ame]
 
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Navy Pride said:
I think the point he is making is attempted rapes do happen males on male aboard ship.........I testified at a court marital where and E4 tried to take advantage of and E2... He was so brazen that he took the E2 to th club, got him drunk and brought him back to the ship........The E2 passed out in his rack above the one the E4 was sleeping in.......Five minutes after taps sounded and the light were turned off in the berthing compartment the E4 reached up above him and under the blanket of the E2......He with his other hand began to masturbate....Myself and another E5 sleeping across from him jumped up and turned on the lights and went in the Head where we discussed the situation.....We decided to put the E4 on report.....He wrote him up and I witnessed it...We went back into the berthing compartment and informed the E4 he was on report....We then hit our racks.......The next morning the E4 got up and acted like nothing had happened.......

To make a long story short he was tried and convicted at a court martial and discharged with and undesireable discharge........He admitted during the court martial he was gay and had joined the Navy to be around men......

This guy was a good worker and I never expected that he was gay....I was totally shocked.......At his courtmartial he said he was so attracted to the E2 that he could not help himself.......

I saw incidents like this through out my Navy career.....
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NP, the guy had a problem. This is NOT common behavior for gays, or men in general. When you are in a supermarket and you see a pretty woman, do you rape her? No, you don't. The issue is not homosexuality, or even hormones. The issue is that incidents like the one you described are about power and violence, not about sex.
 
70s_guy said:
I'm not a friend of political correctness. I can easily work with gays in the workplace and have without any issues as long as they are all professional in conduct. And will be friendly and considerate with them socially within the workplace or in public, but outside those areas I choose to avoid homosexuals because I do not trust them. Its a underlying subtle homophobia much the same as as I would not trust certain types of men around my wife or girl friends. I've never had a single gay thought in my life because such has always been a taboo much like incest. And I am not afraid to say that I do not approve of the homosexual lifestyle. Not that I think such ought not be allowed as what is behind closed doors out of sight, out of mind, within their own clubs and gatherings, is their private business. But within our heterosexual dominant society and culture, I do not want to hear it, see it, or think about it because it is disgusting to this person. And like the many others like me acting gay or flaunting such can provoke violent tendencies. Accordingly I do not want to ever see homosexuals making out in public or on tv nor allow children to. So allowed yes, equal rights in public no.

Now given my honest conservative viewpoint above, I would agree to allow gays in the military however not without restrictions. I've been in the military and there were always some young men that were hot headed, emotional, with a tendency to be violent. Putting gays in with such groups is certain to cause problems. So gays might be allowed in certain technical career fields and stateside desk jobs where they are not having to live in close quarters with lower level enlisted men some of which are certain to have similar attitude as this person.
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Although, as usual, I find your views and positions on this issue ridiculous and abhorrent. I do appreciate your honesty and civility in expressing them. Most on your side of the issue do neither.
 
Navy Pride said:
Don't worry about it...........Its Hatuey......we spar like this all the time until we get gigged by the mods...........
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:rofl

Since I'm the one usually doing the gigging, I had to say I found this witty and funny, NP.
 
Navy Pride said:
There is no military in the world like the U.S. Military......Most of them go to work in the morning and come home at night.......They do not have to be the number one police force of the world....

I still can't get over how people like you who have never served have the gall to tell the military how to run their business........
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I didn't say the military had to get rid of its "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy. I was just making an observation that our military is so unprofessional that it can't do what 24 other countries have done. Isn't that the argument that people are making? That out military is so unprofessional that allowing gays to openly serve would decay unit cohesion?

And FYI, I would like to serve, but there is a little problem. If I joined, I would be kicked out for being gay. That is kind of interesting, isn't? According to you, I'm not allowed to comment on military policy because I haven't served, but I can't serve because of military policy. :rofl
 
70s_guy said:
So gays might be allowed in certain technical career fields and stateside desk jobs where they are not having to live in close quarters with lower level enlisted men some of which are certain to have similar attitude as this person.
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Captain Courtesy is giving thanks to separate but equal?:eek:
 
70s_guy said:
I'm not a friend of political correctness. I can easily work with gays in the workplace and have without any issues as long as they are all professional in conduct. And will be friendly and considerate with them socially within the workplace or in public, but outside those areas I choose to avoid homosexuals because I do not trust them. Its a underlying subtle homophobia much the same as as I would not trust certain types of men around my wife or girl friends. I've never had a single gay thought in my life because such has always been a taboo much like incest. And I am not afraid to say that I do not approve of the homosexual lifestyle. Not that I think such ought not be allowed as what is behind closed doors out of sight, out of mind, within their own clubs and gatherings, is their private business. But within our heterosexual dominant society and culture, I do not want to hear it, see it, or think about it because it is disgusting to this person. And like the many others like me acting gay or flaunting such can provoke violent tendencies. Accordingly I do not want to ever see homosexuals making out in public or on tv nor allow children to. So allowed yes, equal rights in public no.

Now given my honest conservative viewpoint above, I would agree to allow gays in the military however not without restrictions. I've been in the military and there were always some young men that were hot headed, emotional, with a tendency to be violent. Putting gays in with such groups is certain to cause problems. So gays might be allowed in certain technical career fields and stateside desk jobs where they are not having to live in close quarters with lower level enlisted men some of which are certain to have similar attitude as this person.
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I couldn't have said it better, well put......:)
 
Navy Pride said:
I personally did not know any that were homophobic but then gays are not allowed to serve openly and for morale readiness and cohesion it should stay that way...........Its easy for someone like you who has no clue what it is like to run his mouth and the issue......Your not in..........you don't go to sea for up to 90 days at a time............Its no skin off your ass.........
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Navy the problem is that gays already serve with other troops for 90 days at sea. They already shower, eat, sleep with other sailors and they already are disciplined when their behaviour is unprofessional so stating that there would be a difference between serving openly and serving in the closet is quite ridiculous. What you fail to understand is that people aren't trying to appeal the fact that they should be allowed to serve openly on its own. They are appealing the discriminatory practices that involve somebody being kicked out simply for being gay.
 
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Hatuey said:
Navy the problem is that gays already serve with other troops for 90 days at sea. They already shower, eat, sleep with other sailors and they already are disciplined when their behaviour is unprofessional so stating that there would be a difference between serving openly and serving in the closet is quite ridiculous. What you fail to understand is that people aren't trying to appeal the fact that they should be allowed to serve openly on its own. They are appealing the discriminatory practices that involve somebody being kicked out simply for being gay.
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They do not serve as open gays and if they already do serve and are thrown out for behavior, then I can see no reason for changing the law.
 
Charles Martel said:
They do not serve as open gays and if they already do serve and are thrown out for behavior, then I can see no reason for changing the law.
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Who cares what you think? Specially when you don't read posts?
 
Navy Pride said:
Most people that serve in the Navy are not racist....In fact a small percentage are..........They reflect society in general.........I served on 6 ships and never saw any problems with racism or any disciplinary problems..........No captains masts or court martial..........You really have a bad example here.....Why don't you quit while your only losing by a little bit..........
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Really? I was witness to one incident, where a young black guy had the absolute temerity to say yes when a white girl asked him to dance. When he returned to where we where sitting, one of the guys(who probably had been hoping to try and put the moves on this girl) said "we don't like niggers dancing with white girls". He not surprisingly went to Captain's mast for it, and did 60/60 with R in R and half months pay X2.

The funny thing is that the white people, including myself who where there where the most pissed. It was the black guys who kept a couple of the white guys from stomping on the racist bastard. I am pretty sure that a decade or so from now, if you changes this to be about straits and gays, the story would be almost identical. The military always resists change, but the military does change, and change alot.
 
Hatuey said:
Navy the problem is that gays already serve with other troops for 90 days at sea. They already shower, eat, sleep with other sailors and they already are disciplined when their behaviour is unprofessional so stating that there would be a difference between serving openly and serving in the closet is quite ridiculous. What you fail to understand is that people aren't trying to appeal the fact that they should be allowed to serve openly on its own. They are appealing the discriminatory practices that involve somebody being kicked out simply for being gay.
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This is exactly it. Gays already serve, and have proven that they can fit in and be a part of the team, without disruption or any loss of unit cohesion or morale. Those who have done so are the reason we are at the point we are now, where we can remove DADT without real worry of negative consequences. We owe a debt of gratitude to these men and women, not just for their service to country, but for the fact they did it with an added burden, and did it well enough that they have changed the attitudes of a large portion of their fellow military personnel.
 
Hatuey said:
Who cares what you think? Specially when you don't read posts?
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Gays don't serve openly, I read your posts. And while you're not caring what I think, I'll tend to care for what you think and expose why it's wrong-headed.
 
Navy Pride said:
I have no problem working with him but after work we go our separate ways...We don't shower or sleep together.........Huge difference if you in the Navy.....that is 24/7 that you will spend with other sailors......
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Wow....you would think that if most men were unable to control themselves like you have said that you wouldn't be able to control yourself that these gay men in the Navy would be all over each other and sexually assaulting straight men at every turn.

I guess this just proves that most men aren't like you Navy. Most are able to control their sexual urges.
 
Charles Martel said:
Captain Courtesy is giving thanks to separate but equal?:eek:
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No, read my comment. I wasn't thanking his post because I agree with it. I've dealt with '70's guy before, and I find his positions on things uninformed and abhorrent. I thanked his post because I appreciate his honesty. At least he's not claiming a belief in equality, while hypocritically stating the exact opposite... like lots of folks on the anti-GM side do. At least he admits his homophobia, rather than hiding it. His positions on this may be unfounded but he is consistent and honest about them. I can respect that.
 
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