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Obama to call for 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell' repeal, adviser says

Yes he is. I'm sorry you find it so inconvenient that your classless attempt to diminish the service of one of our board members was called to the carpet, but too bad. I find it highly offensive that you would leverage Navy's integrity as a serviceman against your desperation to win this argument. I understand that the issue is close to home for you (although I don't understand why since you never served to begin with) but that does not excuse your attempt to demean the service of others just to try to score points in a debate.

In fact, it diminishes any point you might have had in the first place.

Forgive me....but how has anything I have said demeaned his service?

BTW Jall....I can't believe that you are stooping to the "you didn't serve" level.

There are many things in life that people like you or I care about that do not directly affect us. I care about all of my fellow brothers and sisters. Until they are all free....I am not free.
I cared a lot about the civil rights movement...are you saying that I shouldn't care because I wasn't black?
I care a lot about woman's issues....are you saying that I shouldn't because I am not female?

C'mon Jall.....
 
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that really shows your true colors. what a ridiculous comment.

Are you naive enough to believe that no black person voted for Obama because he is black.......Hell I know black people who aren't even political and have no clue what Obama policies are and voted for him because he was black..........There are white people that didn't vote for him because he was black...........

Surely you are smart enough to know that??????????:confused:
 
Yes he is. I'm sorry you find it so inconvenient that your classless attempt to diminish the service of one of our board members was called to the carpet, but too bad. I find it highly offensive that you would leverage Navy's integrity as a serviceman against your desperation to win this argument. I understand that the issue is close to home for you (although I don't understand why since you never served to begin with) but that does not excuse your attempt to demean the service of others just to try to score points in a debate.

In fact, it diminishes any point you might have had in the first place.

Thanks Jallman but its OK I rarely read DDs post any more...I admit I am bias on a lot of issues but he is unbelievable......He is a lawyer and I don't claim to know more about the law then he does........He has never served his country in any branch of the service but claims to know more about the military then any person in this forum.......He has lost all creditability with me........
 
You don't have to undress with your men in close quarters......

Under DADT, they're serving on ships secretly and watching the sailor boys take their clothes off and no one knows.

Oooooooooo ..how thrilling :mrgreen:
 
Under DADT, they're serving on ships secretly and watching the sailor boys take their clothes off and no one knows.

Oooooooooo ..how thrilling :mrgreen:


That is right........I suspect if I was attracted to women on a ship I would love to see her nude..........That is just me though.Not someone like you.......
 
Thanks Jallman but its OK I rarely read DDs post any more...I admit I am bias on a lot of issues but he is unbelievable......He is a lawyer and I don't claim to know more about the law then he does........He has never served his country in any branch of the service but claims to know more about the military then any person in this forum.......He has lost all creditability with me........

Just for your information Navy....I've never claimed that I know more about the military that any person in this forum. If you believe I have....point me to a link.

And by the way...I may not have served in the military, but I have devoted my life to public service. I turned down high paying jobs out of law school to serve my community as a public interest lawyer, making about 1/4 of what I could have made.

And I do more community service in a month, then I bet you have done your entire life....

Just sayin'

Serving in the military is an honorable thing to do and I respect the service of those who have. But just because a person didn't serve in the military does not mean that they have not done service to this country. Think about that.
 
This behavior is par for the course in ANY service when dealing with a superior office. Even more so when dealing directly with the Commander-in-Chief.

To a degree. But Mullin spoke of his personal feelings. He actually believes this should be done. Also, people in Mullin's position are expected to speak honestly, even if it is contrary (just respectfully).
 
Forgive me....but how has anything I have said demeaned his service?

"Why aren't YOU being a good soldier?"

Yeah, you can deny it all you want after the fact, but ya still tried it. And I am not going to just give you a pass for such classlessness.

BTW Jall....I can't believe that you are stooping to the "you didn't serve" level.

Why? You didn't. Your insight into what it means to be a good serviceman is obviously already skewed by the fact that you tried to demean Navy's. It's not as if you've ever shown Navy a shred of respect for his service to this country and, in fact, any chance you get to diminish him, you hop all over it like a nickel whore on two dollar john.

Poor disney...got a fact pointed out to him. Boo ****in hoo.

There are many things in life that people like you or I care about that do not directly affect us. I care about all of my fellow brothers and sisters. Until they are all free....I am not free.
I cared a lot about the civil rights movement...are you saying that I shouldn't care because I wasn't black?
I care a lot about woman's issues....are you saying that I shouldn't because I am not female?

C'mon Jall.....

Well I done beeeeen to the top of the mountain, too and had a dream and all that. But that doesn't change what you tried to do to Navy just now.
 
To a degree. But Mullin spoke of his personal feelings. He actually believes this should be done. Also, people in Mullin's position are expected to speak honestly, even if it is contrary (just respectfully).


Bottom line he saluted and said yes sir and that is exactly what any chairman of the joint chiefs would do.....
 
Bottom line he saluted and said yes sir and that is exactly what any chairman of the joint chiefs would do.....

Isn't that also exactly what any grunt should do?
 
what does that have to do with anythng?

It has everything to do with it from their perspective. You made a valid point in that officers' motivations are directly influenced by their duty to follow orders.

Rather than reflect on that point and how it impacts their argument, they went rabid about making the thread focus on you so they could avoid how their own arguments might be somewhat diminished.
 
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Isn't that also exactly what any grunt should do?

Any grunt is not next in the chain of command to the presidentof the U.S. and can speak informally to their fellow grunts or shipmates in my case.........
 
Bottom line he saluted and said yes sir and that is exactly what any chairman of the joint chiefs would do.....

Is that what Powell did 17 years ago?
 
"Why aren't YOU being a good soldier?"

Yeah, you can deny it all you want after the fact, but ya still tried it. And I am not going to just give you a pass for such classlessness.



Why? You didn't. Your insight into what it means to be a good serviceman is obviously already skewed by the fact that you tried to demean Navy's. It's not as if you've ever shown Navy a shred of respect for his service to this country and, in fact, any chance you get to diminish him, you hop all over it like a nickel whore on two dollar john.

Poor disney...got a fact pointed out to him. Boo ****in hoo.



Well I done beeeeen to the top of the mountain, too and had a dream and all that. But that doesn't change what you tried to do to Navy just now.


Sorry Jall....but I am going to have to disagree with you.

If you read it all in context I think you will agree.

Navy was trying to argue that the only reason that the military leaders are coming out in favor of repealing the ban is because the are "being good soldiers"...not because they believe it is the right thing to do. Basically saying that "good soldiers" do what they are told to do and not question it.

My comment to him, taken in that context was not an effort to call him a "bad soldier" but rather to simply point out the ridiculous nature of the point that he made.

It may have been misinterpreted...and if it has, I apologize for that and I would apologize to Navy if he or anyone else thought that I was calling him a "bad soldier" for not supporting the repeal.
I have never said that Navy was a bad soldier or said anything to demean his military service. (I think Navy would even have to agree with that).
I come from a long line of military. My father served in ww2 and I had close uncles that were killed in Vietnam and in the Korean war.

I just always find it highly offensive when people try to argue that simply because you aren't this or that, you have no say on an issue. Its an easy way to avoid addressing the issues being presented.
 
OK here you go......You are not in the Navy...You don't have to go to sea for up to 90 days at a time

No, I certainly am not in the Navy. But I am in the Army and I deploy for a year or more at a time. We don't sleep in close quarters to each other on ships, but do sleep close to each other on cots, in vehicles and on the earth.

It sounds like you are and officer so you probably have your own stateroom and shower......You don't have to undress with your men in close quarters

I am an officer; But I don't even know what a stateroom is. I haven't always been. When I was a private, I slept in a 60-man bay on bunkbeds and showered in a large communal shower and even took a **** on stools with no privacy.

Since my commission, I sleep like the men do. In the field training, I sleep where they do; usually on the ground or catnaps in the humvee. In OIF, I slept on a cot two feet away from my Sergeant the entire deployment. In fact, my whole crew (seven) slept in a 10 x 10 room together at the patrol base or on the ground...depending on the mission. In subsequent combat tours, I've slept multiple places; in tents with the whole platoon, in bunkers with my unit with a piece of plywood or bedsheet for privacy. I've certainly shared many a community showers with my troops...that almost makes me laugh. Even as the commander now, I still shower everyday after PT in the unit's communal shower.


Don't be like Disney Dude..........Answer this honestly...Do you think you could be stationed on a ship with all young women and be the only man? Do you think you could spend months at sea with them, sleeping inches away,undressing and showering with them? On a Navy ship that is what happens......

Well, then maybe the Navy has a discipline problem, sir. I don't know. The last thing I'm concerned with is a gay soldier coming on to me or any other soldier in the unit. He would be in trouble if he did. I really don't think it's an issue. We've got bigger things to worry about. Like training for and fighting wars.

So answer the question, could you go long periods of time in that situation and not make any advances to the women.........I can honestly say I sure as hell couldn't..........

Well, then maybe YOU have a discipline problem, sir. You aren't one of my Soldiers so I'm not worried about it. We have mixed gender units now and yes, there are some issues with sexual advances, but it's not out of control. I'm sure if I had a gay Soldier in the unit, he would not come on to or rape any heterosexual Soldier. I think to expect that to be a widespread epidemic is pretty silly. To be honest, even if DADT is overturned, I doubt you'll see servicemembers "coming out" in droves. Especially not in all-male units like mine; but if they do, they will be afforded the same opportunities and protection from discrimination just like any other Soldier.

I don't expect a rebuttal, since I just destroyed you in front of everyone.
 
I don't expect a rebuttal, since I just destroyed you in front of everyone.

Jesus Christ on a bicycle, I've heard it all now. I hope one day I'm as tough and good at the internetz as you are. :roll:
 
Actually, I was referring to the fact that Powell opposed Clinton's efforts to let gays serve openly.

I don't recall there being great opposition. I recall him being in an advisory role. You're splitting hairs at this point to make history say what you want it to say.
 
It has everything to do with it from their perspective. You made a valid point in that their motivations are directly influenced by their duty to follow orders.

Rather than reflect on that point and how it impacts their argument, they went rabid about making the thread focus on you so they could avoid how their own arguments might be somewhat diminished.

Is that not what most of the liberals do in this forum.......attack the messenger.........?

I can honestly tell you I wish I was wrong...I don't want to see problems or chaos in the Navy.......There is enough problems already....I wish Gays could serve openly in the Navy but it is not going to happen without a lot of unnecessary problems I feel.......Some of these Liberals think I hate gay people because I am against gay marriage and gays serving openly in the military......I don't care what they think but that is the farthest thing from the truth.....

I guess what pisses me off the most is these liberals can say let gays serve openly...it makes them feel good when they go to bed at night.....its no skin off their ass.......most never served and never will......Most are clueless about military life........Well military life was my life and still is even though I retired........I lived it breathed it 24/7 for 21 years.....You served and you know what goes on........
 
what does that have to do with anythng?

It speaks to your continued assertion that you know exactly what is going on in the military today, but nobody else does.

So, how many years since you've had any actual, personal, first-hand experience of day-to-day life in today's military?
 
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