Page 3 of 15 FirstFirst 1234513 ... LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 144

Thread: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

  1. #21
    Enemy Combatant
    Kandahar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Last Seen
    10-15-13 @ 08:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    20,688

    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarecrow Akhbar View Post
    Means only one thing:

    That the Democrats see ways to aggrandize their power via this commission.

    It's what Democrats DO.

    So if you're unwilling to even allow a commission to TALK about ways to reduce the federal deficit, how in the hell do you expect it to actually get done? I'm not talking about in Scarecrow's Fantasyland where all of the senators who have been voting for social programs for years suddenly vote to cut their budget to $0. I'm talking about in the real world.

    Do you actually care about reducing the deficit, or do you just care about braying about how things would be in your ideal world?
    Are you coming to bed?
    I can't. This is important.
    What?
    Someone is WRONG on the internet! -XKCD

  2. #22
    Enemy Combatant
    Kandahar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Last Seen
    10-15-13 @ 08:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    20,688

    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC
    Again, the fact that they didn't support this proposal is not evidence that they don't support fiscal responsibility. If Obama proposed to cut the deficit by seizing the assets of Bill Gates and Warren Buffet, would opposing that mean that someone was against fiscal responsibility, or would it simply mean that they think that's a bad way to cut the deficit?
    The latter. The difference is that that would be a specific deficit-cutting measure, whereas these senators opposed a commission to investigate specific deficit-cutting measures. Last I checked, there were only two ways (which the government can control) to reduce the deficit: Raise taxes or cut spending. If they are unwilling to allow a commission to even TALK about that, it logically follows that they consider a deficit to be a lesser evil than either of those other two things. That's certainly a defensible position during a recession, but in the longer term (which is what this commission is focusing on, if I understood it correctly) it's grossly irresponsible.

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC
    When this panel would have a majority of Democrats and would be in charge of crafting a proposal that would have to face an up or down vote, if I were a Republican in the Senate, I'd be a bit wary as well.
    Why? You could vote it down if you don't like it.

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC
    It's not like there's anything stopping them from making the same cuts even without this commission.
    So what would be the problem with the commission? Sometimes an outside perspective is helpful.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 01-26-10 at 11:19 PM.
    Are you coming to bed?
    I can't. This is important.
    What?
    Someone is WRONG on the internet! -XKCD

  3. #23
    Sage

    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Last Seen
    05-16-15 @ 02:32 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    12,537

    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    an outside perspective?

    from 12 senators picked by the leaders and 6 by the white house?

    LOL!

    maybe we could ask the 23 dems who KILLED OBAMA's LATEST MEASURE

    you might find an outsider among em

    but i don't think so

  4. #24
    Fool & Troll Handler
    MC.no.spin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Last Seen
    08-26-17 @ 02:53 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    3,392

    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    Snippets from Politico:

    Despite grim new deficit estimates, the Senate rejected efforts Tuesday to create a bipartisan commission empowered to force up-and-down votes in Congress on long-term steps to relieve the mounting debt facing the nation.
    This sounds like a good idea. It appears those who voted against it were unwilling to vote on the tough spending cuts or tax raises that would be in the proposal, and also preferred to let the problem fester:

    Not only Obama but also Scott Brown, the newly elected Massachusetts senator and Republican hero, had supported the commission idea, sponsored by Senate Budget Committee Chairman Kent Conrad (D-N.D.) and his ranking Republican, New Hampshire Sen. Judd Gregg. But old-guard elements in both parties resisted, and it was ultimately doomed because top Republicans feared it would help Democrats extricate themselves from a difficult debt-ceiling bill.

    ...

    “For it to win, the president will have to more,” Tennessee Sen. Lamar Alexander, chairman of the Senate Republican Conference, said. “I think he’ll have to produce a Democratic majority in favor of it, and if he does, I think there will be a significant number of Republican votes to go with it.”

    “The president’s the agenda setter. The debt’s the issue. And if this is his proposal he needs to produce the votes to pass it.”

    In fact, a majority of Democrats did back the measure including most of the party’s top leaders. But there was a fatal undercurrent of opposition from top chairmen of tax writing and appropriations committees, and Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) made little effort to temper this campaign led by Senate Finance Committee Chairman Max Baucus (D-Mont.).

    Read more: Senate rejects deficit commission - David Rogers - POLITICO.com

    The common denominator is not a political party, it is length of term in office, the "old guard", who instead of being a deficit hawk would prefer to not touch third rails and risk the backlash.

    It's time for some new blood who are deficit hawks and not panderers for votes.

    Incidentally, it's a great sign Scott Brown voted in favor of the commission.

    This describes the commission in a little more detail:

    Under the Conrad-Gregg proposal, an 18-member commission would be formed with eight Republicans and eight Democrats appointed from Congress by leaders of the two parties. The Obama administration would appoint two members.

    The commission would draw up prescriptions for reducing the nation’s long-term debt. They could recommend raising taxes or cutting spending on entitlement programs like Social Security or Medicare, or a combination of both. The group’s recommendations would be released after the 2010 mid-term elections and Congress would have to vote them up or down by Dec. 23, 2010. The package could not be amended or filibustered, and in both the House and Senate a three-fifths vote would be needed for passage.
    Senator Evan Bayh — Senator for Indiana: News - In The News
    "Everyone has his axe to grind - his favorite fiction to pimp. We live in a world of hustlers and clowns."
    ~ Bob Somerby

  5. #25
    Sage

    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Last Seen
    05-16-15 @ 02:32 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    12,537

    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    the stupid president got his skinny ass slapped all over washington today, on every front, and usually by members of his own party

    1. the bipartisan graham/talent commission, offshoot of the 9-11 commision, gave him an F on "stopping the spread of wmd's"

    the eminent panelists reported that the administration's woeful handling of the h1n1 vaccine bodes very poorly for the govt's ability to deal with a germ or bio attack

    2. obama's debt commission, flip side of his Financial Crisis Responsibility Fee, centerpiece of his post massachusetts agenda, was KILLED ON THE FLOOR

    3. prominent party members wrote to holder demanding to know exactly who moved mutallab before civil authorities, why security wasn't even consulted, and insisting that the wannabe bomber be returned to military milieu

    4. the president's spending freeze which, after the instant death of his bank tax became the newest focus of his brand new domestic policy, was subject to immediate resistance from senators harkin, sanders, inouye, leahy, sherrod brown, cardin, kerry, murray and stabenow

    a peach as low hanging as a spending freeze rendered beyond reach BY HIS OWN PARTY

    ON THE EVE OF SOTU!

    unbelievable

    i've never seen anything like it

    obama's post massachusetts reaction has been a catastrophe

    it was best encapsuled by gibbs on fns, who said of MA---"more people voted to express their support of barack obama than to oppose him"

    the stupidest press secty went on to "hope scott brown doesn't misread the electorate" the way those do who actually thought the pickup driving populist WON

    Obama Gets 'F' on Stopping Spread of Weapons of Mass Destruction

    Two Senate Democrats want KSM trial out of NYC - Kasie Hunt - POLITICO.com

    Obama Spending Freeze Lands on Hill with Thud - The Note
    Last edited by The Prof; 01-27-10 at 12:59 AM.

  6. #26
    Slayer of the DP Newsbot
    danarhea's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Houston, TX
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:27 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    39,720

    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarecrow Akhbar View Post
    Structural changes in the formulation of laws are required, not band-aids.

    A line-item veto amendment would give the President the power to slash pork, for example.

    Restricting federal law to Constitutionally allowed issues is another. This doesn't require special amendments or commissions, this requires the opposition party to point out when a law violates the Constitution and it requires the people to pay attention. Imagine that, expecting Americans to start paying attention to their government once again. Clearly that idea is far too complicated and won't work, right?
    Clinton already tried the line item veto. The Supreme Court found it unconstitutional. And as far as legalizing it by making it an amendment, it will never happen. Too many Congresscritters, on both sides of the aisle, are at the trough.
    Last edited by danarhea; 01-27-10 at 01:16 AM.
    The ghost of Jack Kevorkian for President's Physician: 2016

  7. #27
    Liberal Fascist For Life!


    Redress's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Georgia
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:50 AM
    Lean
    Very Liberal
    Posts
    93,268
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    Clinton already tried the line item veto. The Supreme Court found it unconstitutional. And as far as legalizing it by making it an amendment, it will never happen. Too many Congresscritters, on both sides of the aisle, are at the trough.
    It's not just that, it's both sides realize the danger of having the other side with the tool. I was amazed it passed in '96, and I doubt you could even get a simple bill in favor of it, much less a constitutional amendment.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  8. #28
    Slayer of the DP Newsbot
    danarhea's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Houston, TX
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:27 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    39,720

    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    It's not just that, it's both sides realize the danger of having the other side with the tool. I was amazed it passed in '96, and I doubt you could even get a simple bill in favor of it, much less a constitutional amendment.
    Want to know what the irony is? The line item veto was found unconstitutional after a lawsuit was filed by the City of New York. I will give you 3 guesses who the mayor was at that time - Hint: He's a Republican. LOL.
    The ghost of Jack Kevorkian for President's Physician: 2016

  9. #29
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Last Seen
    12-26-10 @ 06:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    8,083

    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    The senate has been bought.

  10. #30
    Girthless
    RightinNYC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    New York, NY
    Last Seen
    01-23-11 @ 11:56 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    25,894

    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    The latter. The difference is that that would be a specific deficit-cutting measure, whereas these senators opposed a commission to investigate specific deficit-cutting measures. Last I checked, there were only two ways (which the government can control) to reduce the deficit: Raise taxes or cut spending. If they are unwilling to allow a commission to even TALK about that, it logically follows that they consider a deficit to be a lesser evil than either of those other two things. That's certainly a defensible position during a recession, but in the longer term (which is what this commission is focusing on, if I understood it correctly) it's grossly irresponsible.

    Why? You could vote it down if you don't like it.

    So what would be the problem with the commission? Sometimes an outside perspective is helpful.
    Again, I'm not saying it doesn't sound like a pretty good idea, I'm saying that I can see why people from both sides might hesitate on this. For the Republicans in particular, I don't know that I would trust the Democrats not to put together a package in such a way that would force me to make some particularly damaging votes.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

Page 3 of 15 FirstFirst 1234513 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •