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Thread: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

  1. #111
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    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    No, that is not what I am saying. What I am saying is that to be fiscally responsible, you have to match spending increases with similar cuts. Reagan did not do this. Therefore he was not fiscally responsible. The whole copout that fiscal conservatives don't count the military is just that, a copout. You want to cut spending, except where you don't want to cut spending. To be fiscally responsible, you have to, at the end of the day, control the deficit, and Reagan failed to do this.
    Wrong.

    The CONGRESS under Reagan did not do this. You may recall that the United States Congress is a co-equal body independent of the Execuitive Branch with it's own duties under the Constitution.

    The deal Congress made with Reagan was to cut domestic spending in parallel with the tax cuts to avoid any deficit.

    The Democrat dominated Congress broke that deal immediately.

    The fact of the matter is that the increased federal revenues from the tax cuts far outpaced the necessary military spending, but could not keep pace with the unnecessary domestic spending.

  2. #112
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    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Interesting. SO you want to give republicans the benefit of the doubt, but criticize Obama's motives when he proposes something to reduce to growth of the deficit...
    We already know that if Obama proposes it, it's not going to work.

  3. #113
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    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post

    So if you're unwilling to even allow a commission to TALK about ways to reduce the federal deficit,
    What's to "talk" about?

    The way to reduce the federal deficit is simple:

    Reduce taxes to grow the economy, cut federal spending to return to the limits set by the Constitution.

    Problem solved. No discussion needed.

  4. #114
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    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    Quote Originally Posted by liblady View Post
    damn you're articulate.

    tax hikes and spending cuts, what we need. the real issue is WHO gets the tax hikes and spending cuts, as usual.
    The poor should get both the spending cuts and the tax hikes.

    It's past time they started paying their fair share.

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    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    Quote Originally Posted by liblady View Post
    as were his deficits. and as a percentage of our economy, no, the revenues were not record breaking.
    Well, Obama shattered Bush's Deficit Record in his first few months in office.

    So much for that.

  6. #116
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    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    Quote Originally Posted by Dav View Post
    I'm going to stop arguing with you now because you're completely working around the point and bringing up the same arguments over and over even when I point out their flaws. Just because you keep pushing forward the notion that the deficit is the only possible indicator of fiscal responsibility doensn't make it so. If Reagan was not fiscally responsible, then neither was any president in history, because no president cut domestic spending as much as he did. I am willing to bet that if he had cut domestic spending more - especially if it was so much, it actually eliminated the deficit - you'd today be bashing Reagan for not caring about the poor (note: most liberals are already doing this) enough to want to keep welfare programs. Not that he could have done this anyways, in the face of a Democratic congress.

    Military spending - I have brought this up several times, but it apparently hasn't been enough - has nothing to do with fiscal responsibility. Nobody who is sane has ever argued that reducing the deficit is even remotely as important as national security; defense policy is therefore formed solely formed based on the maximalization of security, with no regard for fiscal concerns.
    I do recommend running away Dav, because your repeating the same flawed argument does not work. Saying that spending is bad, except for the spending you like does not make you fiscally responsible. Living within a budget does that. Paying your bills does that.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarecrow Akhbar View Post
    Wrong.

    The CONGRESS under Reagan did not do this. You may recall that the United States Congress is a co-equal body independent of the Execuitive Branch with it's own duties under the Constitution.

    The deal Congress made with Reagan was to cut domestic spending in parallel with the tax cuts to avoid any deficit.

    The Democrat dominated Congress broke that deal immediately.

    The fact of the matter is that the increased federal revenues from the tax cuts far outpaced the necessary military spending, but could not keep pace with the unnecessary domestic spending.
    The budget passed by congress was within 5 % of the budget proposed by Reagan over his 8 years in office. Please try again.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  8. #118
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    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    Quote Originally Posted by Dav View Post
    No, tax raises are an explicitly un-conservative policy. You can make up your own definitions of conservatism all you want, but that's just the way it is. Fiscal conservatism is about low spending and low taxes.

    This being beside the point that tax raises don't necessarily mean more tax revenues in the first place.


    Unless of course (as Reddress cited) you approve.

    Fiscal conservativism centers around a balanced budget.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

  9. #119
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    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    I do recommend running away Dav, because your repeating the same flawed argument does not work. Saying that spending is bad, except for the spending you like does not make you fiscally responsible. Living within a budget does that. Paying your bills does that.
    I'm repeating the same "flawed" arguments because instead of arguing against them, you keep bringing up your initial assertions and then pretending that I haven't addressed them.

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    Re: Senate says 'no' to federal debt commission Obama endorsed

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post


    Unless of course (as Reddress cited) you approve.
    Unless you think that it's necessary.

    Fiscal conservativism centers around a balanced budget.
    Yes, and Reagan's fiscal conservatism led to the balancing of the budget in the 90s.

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