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GOP's Brown wins Mass. Senate seat in epic upset

He probably won't even get to vote on the bill, but assuming he does, how much will he sell his vote for?
 
To the people of Massachusetts - THANK YOU
 
Ethereal said:
The super-majority is lost. The public option and cap & trade are dead. I don't suspect we'll be seeing either of those terrible ideas resurface for a long, long while. That is very good for this country.
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The bill ain't dead yet.

There's a version the Senate passed.

Barney Backdoor Frank is right now trying to figure out a way to get the House to pass the Senate bill or to change the rules to backdoor a reconciliation out through the Senate with a simple majority vote. (What did you think I meant by Backdoor Frank?)


Ethereal said:
I'm just glad Obama lost his super-majority.
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Yes, that is a good thing, so long as the Repubicans in the Senate can be held in line. But, quick as you can say "amnesty for illegals", and McCain and others will be out there sharpening their knives against America again.
 
First of all, its not Obamacare, its either Pelosicare or Reidcare. Obama sold out on the American people when it came to health care reform. You are actually complimenting him if you call it Obamacare. Don't even give him that much credit.

Second, Brown is too conservative for his own good. I say good luck with that.
 
Well I think it could signal some change, I also think that maybe we shouldn't jump the gun and see what pans out. I don't put much faith in the words of politicians, we need to see how he'll turn out. As I said, I hope this is a signal to the GOP that someone had best stand up and start listening to the People. But we should all know now how much we can really trust the government.
 
Ikari said:
Well I think it could signal some change, I also think that maybe we shouldn't jump the gun and see what pans out. I don't put much faith in the words of politicians, we need to see how he'll turn out. As I said, I hope this is a signal to the GOP that someone had best stand up and start listening to the People. But we should all know now how much we can really trust the government.
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Yeah let's vote in more people who say "Hey vote me into a public government office so we can stop the government."
 
Cilogy said:
Yeah let's vote in more people who say "Hey vote me into a public government office so we can stop the government."
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Yes. Let's do.
 
Cilogy said:
Yeah let's vote in more people who say "Hey vote me into a public government office so we can stop the government."
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It's good so long as what they say is true.
 
Jerry said:
He probably won't even get to vote on the bill, but assuming he does, how much will he sell his vote for?
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One can only hope he doesn't. I'm listening to his acceptance speach. He seems like he might be a good guy. At least he's promising to do some things I want to see. I'm thinking the whole country will be watching.
 
the question about what the party's gonna do next is not that difficult to anticipate

that is, leadership is going to continue either to cram its crap thru its choking caucus

or leadership is gonna actually get the message for once and back off

the point---what leadership decides to do is not all that relevant anymore

it's now entirely up to membership as to whether or not they're gonna follow

the initiative in party affairs now belongs to membership

as for obama, we've never really seen him yet at such a fork in his road

is he gonna continue his health-care-or-bust approach, his cap-and-trade-at-all-costs crusade

or will he instead go the survivalist route outlined before by such ass-kicked leaders as bill clinton and gov schwarzenegger

personally, the obama i've come to know appears psychically incapable of acting other than he has, he's almost hardwired to close his ears to his constituents, to know better, to rule according to that radical text they taught him at harvard law, unable to adjust to changing realities as he goes...

these methodologies may work quite well in chicago, where obama was once successful

but big shoulders bullying doesn't govern america, coast to coast, well, not well, at all

obama doesn't know this, he does not understand american politics at its largest

he doesn't appear to appreciate that to succeed in the US at a national level you have to build consensus, you have to have a vision and follow it consistently, you have to be perpetually positive

if obama doesn't know how to talk to kansas, how's he gonna suddenly learn TONIGHT?

we'll see
 
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Winnb said:
I never said I was in favor of Obama care or cap and trade. I haven't even mentioned them. I simply expect spending and increased government from the Dems. Hell it's what they do. At least they're not hypocrites about it.
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The public option and cap & trade are dead. They aren't coming back for a long, long time.

What about that is not awesome to you?

No it would not. Spare me the hyperbole. It would have simply taken our money and spent it on something the Dems wanted. It's exactly what the GOP would do if they could get their greedy little hands on our cash. Of course they'd spend it on something different, but just as wasteful.
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What do you think the public option and cap and trade would have done to American capitalism!? We're not talking about stupid pork projects here. We're talking about fundamental alterations to our economic system.

Sure. Great. We have temporarily slowed down government spending.
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No, we killed Obamacare and cap & trade. Killed them.

And the only reason the GOP supporters on this site are happy about that is because it's spending they didn't like.
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True enough, but I'm happy for different reasons.
 
Ikari said:
It's good so long as what they say is true.
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Which is highly unlikely.

Look I am sometimes libertarian as you are, a lot of times I think politicians are hacks. If that's the case then why should be believe a person from big government to help control big government. The cleverest politicians have discovered that tapping into this libertarian side of America is pure gold for them.

A great example of this is Sarah Palin.
 
Cilogy said:
Yeah let's vote in more people who say "Hey vote me into a public government office so we can stop the government."
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Yes!!! Couldn't agree more!
 
Scarecrow Akhbar said:
It's explained by a moment's consideration of what I quoted with that post.

When you choose to use that moment is up to you, of course.
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I have no idea what you are talking about.

All I said was Brown is very conservative, nothing about Haiti. Why are you even connecting the two?
 
Cilogy said:
Which is highly unlikely.

Look I am sometimes libertarian as you are, a lot of times I think politicians are hacks. If that's the case then why should be believe a person from big government to help control big government. The cleverest politicians have discovered that tapping into this libertarian side of America is pure gold for them.

A great example of this is Sarah Palin.
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There are two ways to make the government smaller.

Civil War.

Electing candidates who will cut the tumor from the inside, like "Fantastic Voyage".

If you don't like the first option, the only choice is to trust candidates will keep their word.
 
Missouri Mule said:
Hopefully the Obama Kool-aid drinkers have come out of their stupor and realized that Obama was leading us down the road to Communism. Matthews on MSNBC openly admitted his Marxist leanings. We had partisan Democrats come out and say they would cheat to win this election it was so important for them to change this nation from a democratic nation to a communist nation. We were on the precipice and stepped back from the abyss.

Having said this, the word is that Obama still intends to ram this misbegotten health bill through regardless of how many seats are lost in November. This is a modern version of the Charge of the Light Brigade.

Obama is the worst president in U.S. history. And the worst is yet to come.
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Right on my friend...Long time no see......
 
Watching the local Mass news affiliate and they are saying almost 2.3 million total voters got out and voted and thats half of Mass registered voters. Half stayed home.
 
Scarecrow Akhbar said:
The bill ain't dead yet.

There's a version the Senate passed.

Barney Backdoor Frank is right now trying to figure out a way to get the House to pass the Senate bill or to change the rules to backdoor a reconciliation out through the Senate with a simple majority vote. (What did you think I meant by Backdoor Frank?)
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Okay, it's possible, but the margin is razor thin now. The House Democrats are crapping their pants at the thought of 2010, so I don't see the Senate version making it through.

As to reconciliation, Americans wouldn't sit down for that one. They clearly do not want the Democrat's version of health care reform. The Dems would defy the people at their own peril.

Yes, that is a good thing, so long as the Repubicans in the Senate can be held in line. But, quick as you can say "amnesty for illegals", and McCain and others will be out there sharpening their knives against America again.
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That's a given.
 
Alex said:
The point is that people voted for him based on the above platforms. The electorate is changing. People no longer care as much about the social issues.
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Speak for yourself........There are social and fiscal issues....Social issues may not be important to you but they are important to a hell of a lot of us..........
 
U.S. Army Retired said:
Watching the local Mass news affiliate and they are saying almost 2.3 million total voters got out and voted and thats half of Mass registered voters. Half stayed home.
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100% of Massachusett[e]s voted.

Getting half to come out for a special election is significant, the others voted with their asses, and kept them home.
 
Scarecrow Akhbar said:
There are two ways to make the government smaller.

Civil War.

Electing candidates who will cut the tumor from the inside, like "Fantastic Voyage".

If you don't like the first option, the only choice is to trust candidates will keep their word.
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Okay then let's vote those people into office, let's see what happens. Seriously, I don't know if it will be bad or good, but i have yet to see a good example of that.

Humans are inherently flawed, therefore it is very rarely you find someone in a seat of power actually denying their own power.
 
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