Page 37 of 64 FirstFirst ... 27353637383947 ... LastLast
Results 361 to 370 of 636

Thread: GOP's Brown wins Mass. Senate seat in epic upset

  1. #361
    Sage
    Gibberish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    San Diego, CA
    Last Seen
    12-23-12 @ 09:29 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    6,339

    Re: GOP's Brown wins Mass. Senate seat in epic upset

    Quote Originally Posted by Strucky View Post
    Last time I checked the poor are not in danger of becoming the majority....Well,it won't happen unless the Health Deform bill and Crap and Tax are passed.
    They will when they are given another burden keeping them from increasing their income to spend ratio.

    Of course you could take the morbid stance and say not providing health care to those that cannot afford it will actually lessen the population of the poor. Since they can't afford health care to survive any sickness.
    "Gold gets dug out of the ground in Africa, or someplace. Then we melt it down, dig another hole, bury it again and pay people to stand around guarding it. It has no utility. Anyone watching from Mars would be scratching their head."
    - Warren Buffett

  2. #362
    Sage
    Gibberish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    San Diego, CA
    Last Seen
    12-23-12 @ 09:29 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    6,339

    Re: GOP's Brown wins Mass. Senate seat in epic upset

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Some people make that choice.
    Some people do. Which is a whole other topic of allowing dependency of out welfare system. Another government program I am against.

    Those that can benefit from the help should be able to get it. The program should be designed so that it is in their benefit to get health care without government aid though.
    "Gold gets dug out of the ground in Africa, or someplace. Then we melt it down, dig another hole, bury it again and pay people to stand around guarding it. It has no utility. Anyone watching from Mars would be scratching their head."
    - Warren Buffett

  3. #363
    Sage
    Gibberish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    San Diego, CA
    Last Seen
    12-23-12 @ 09:29 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    6,339

    Re: GOP's Brown wins Mass. Senate seat in epic upset

    Quote Originally Posted by Dix View Post
    But you could afford it. Many (most?) of us struggled in our early 20's to afford health care. That's life. Some of my co-workers chose not to purchase health insurance. That was their choice and their gamble. I didn't think it was the brightest choice but so what? I'm not sure I can get behind this plan to force them to buy something they don't want to buy.
    So you are for a government sponsored program if it is opt-in?


    Quote Originally Posted by Dix View Post
    I responded the way I did, btw, because it was obvious that the original poster, like you, was ignoring Medicaid's existance. How convenient. For people who make more money than Medicaid allows it often is a choice. I want to talk about THEM for a change.
    Medicaid does not cover everyone. There are only specific categories of people that are covered and less and less doctors accepting Medicaid insurance every year.
    "Gold gets dug out of the ground in Africa, or someplace. Then we melt it down, dig another hole, bury it again and pay people to stand around guarding it. It has no utility. Anyone watching from Mars would be scratching their head."
    - Warren Buffett

  4. #364
    Girthless
    RightinNYC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    New York, NY
    Last Seen
    01-23-11 @ 11:56 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    25,894

    Re: GOP's Brown wins Mass. Senate seat in epic upset

    Quote Originally Posted by Gibberish View Post
    Owning a house and renting a house is different then having health care and not having health care. One is a necessity to live, the other is not.
    Having a place to live is a necessity, just like basic medical care. If you are impoverished, there are government programs that can help you with each (Section 8, Medicaid). If you are financially stable, you can do whatever you want (Buy a house, buy great health insurance). If you're neither financially stable nor strictly impoverished, government largely leaves you to fend for yourself. When we tried a program to help those people get houses, it blew up miserably and caused a near-economic meltdown. I'm not eager to repeat that with healthcare unless we are very sure that the program will be designed so as to avoid that risk.

    I don't know I'm not an economics expert. I also know that a loaf of bread and water shouldn't be 20-22% of my income. I don't know what percentage it should be though. It should be left of to the consumer market (another reason I don't approve of government run health care).
    I don't know what the percentages are either, but what I do know is that they should be higher than the average person thinks they should have to pay. In the Senate's most recent bill, which is quite generous in the caps it provides, liberal advocacy groups are up in arms over the fact that it would require people to pay up to (horror of horrors) 17% of their total household income on health insurance. When I look at where the average household spends its money:



    I'm really not that concerned (Note that the abnormally low cost of insurance reflects the fact that most people have employer-provided insurance).
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

  5. #365
    Girthless
    RightinNYC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    New York, NY
    Last Seen
    01-23-11 @ 11:56 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    25,894

    Re: GOP's Brown wins Mass. Senate seat in epic upset

    Quote Originally Posted by Gibberish View Post
    There are only specific categories of people that are covered and less and less doctors accepting Medicaid insurance every year.
    Fewer doctors are accepting Medicaid because the government doesn't pay them enough to cover their expenses. I can think of several solutions to this problem, but "increase the number of people on Medicaid" is not one of them.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

  6. #366
    Hard As A Rock
    Strucky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Minnesota
    Last Seen
    10-19-17 @ 08:58 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    2,074

    Re: GOP's Brown wins Mass. Senate seat in epic upset

    Quote Originally Posted by Gibberish View Post
    They will when they are given another burden keeping them from increasing their income to spend ratio.
    Ummm.....Yeah,can you say Health Care "Reform".

    Of course you could take the morbid stance and say not providing health care to those that cannot afford it will actually lessen the population of the poor. Since they can't afford health care to survive any sickness.
    When did this ever happen in the U.S.?Medical treatment is required by law to those that do not have insurance.
    "The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without."

    ~Dwight D. Eisenhower

  7. #367
    Hippie Hater
    texmaster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Dallas TEXAS
    Last Seen
    08-20-15 @ 01:17 AM
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    3,969

    Re: GOP's Brown wins Mass. Senate seat in epic upset

    I must say I wasn't thrilled with what he said about his daughters at his acceptance speech.
    Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.

    John Adams

  8. #368
    Hard As A Rock
    Strucky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Minnesota
    Last Seen
    10-19-17 @ 08:58 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    2,074

    Re: GOP's Brown wins Mass. Senate seat in epic upset

    Quote Originally Posted by texmaster View Post
    I must say I wasn't thrilled with what he said about his daughters at his acceptance speech.
    I didn't watch his speech....What did he say about them?
    "The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without."

    ~Dwight D. Eisenhower

  9. #369
    Sage
    Dav's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    04-16-16 @ 02:36 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    5,539

    Re: GOP's Brown wins Mass. Senate seat in epic upset

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    While it's not something people like to discuss, lives are always assigned monetary values.
    No.

    We do it with every aspect of our bodies - workers comp agreements have charts showing the value of each limb or finger, etc.
    A human is more than the sum of its body parts.

    Look at it this way:

    Say there's a disease called Deathabetes that primarily affects elderly people. Sheisa Pharmaceuticals develops a drug called Death-B-Gon that, on average, extends the life of a Deathabetes sufferer for 1 year. Now, if that drug cost $10, I would assume that every one of us would agree that Medicare should pay for it. If the cost were $5,000, I think most people would still be on board. But what it it cost $50,000? $500,000? $50,000,000?
    Good thing this is all theoretical, since nothing costs that much. And why would we agree that Medicare would pay for it in the first place? It should pay for it if it fits some category that it has agreed to pay for in the first place. Whether it pays for it, or how much of it it pays for, does not then vary with how much it costs.

    At some point, everyone would have to agree that the drug becomes too expensive to be worth its benefit. We face this exact same dilemma with thousands and thousands of drugs and procedures today, ranging from hip replacements to cancer treatments. How the balancing point is calculated is incredibly important.
    Except that whether or not something is covered by insurance is not, and should not be, entirely decided on a case-by-case basis, but agreed on early on, usually in the form of a contract.

    One of the reasons why insurance costs continue to increase is because of special interest groups that lobby insurers on this exact issue. First, a breast cancer group raises a stink about an insurance company refusing to pay for a particular expensive drug. Not wanting the bad publicity, the company agrees to pay for that drug. Then a Parkinson's group does the same. Then a MS group, then a Sickle Cell group, etc. The end result is that most everything ends up getting covered and the rest of the costs get passed on to everyone else.
    Why wouldn't insurance companies cover breast cancer or Parkinson's? More importantly, why hadn't they until they were lobbied to do so? There's something fishy about that.

    Here is the stark reality that neither Republicans or Democrats are willing to admit: So long as we as a nation continue to place such an incredibly high value on the availability of expensive life-saving treatments, we will never bring health care spending under control. I don't see such a significant cultural shift happening any time soon.
    If that's true, which I doubt it is, then I guess I don't want health care spending "under control". High as our health care spending might be, we have, among other things, the highest cancer survival rates in the world (breast cancer included). Why you want to change that, I don't know.

    I find how little value you place in human life depressing.

  10. #370
    Banned
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Last Seen
    09-22-10 @ 04:36 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    11,430

    Re: GOP's Brown wins Mass. Senate seat in epic upset

    Quote Originally Posted by Gibberish View Post
    The program should be designed so that it is in their benefit to get health care without government aid though.
    It's easy to ensure people benefit from getting health care without government aid.

    Don't provide government aid (ie, my tax dollars) for their health care in the first place.

Page 37 of 64 FirstFirst ... 27353637383947 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •