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Thread: Deal Reached on Taxing 'Cadillac' Plans

  1. #11
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    Re: Deal Reached on Taxing 'Cadillac' Plans

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarecrow Akhbar View Post
    Seems to me that such a clearly discrminatory law would violate the 14th Amendment.

    But the Democrats love discrimination, we know.
    As long as it's in the name of a greater good... namely... good for unions, good therefore for Democrats...
    “I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on what’s being proposed here, he’d agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute.” - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


  2. #12
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    Re: Deal Reached on Taxing 'Cadillac' Plans

    Quote Originally Posted by liblady View Post
    well, i don't really know anyone that has insurance worth over 24k for a family, that's provided by their employer. of course, i don't know any ceo types.
    You think they're raising $150b from "CEO types?"

    Why don't you try listening to your own unions?

    The Senate Finance Committee’s 40 percent excise tax on so-called “Cadillac” health care plans would hit 37 percent of family health insurance plans and 41 percent of single plans by 2019, according to an analysis of the committee’s original health care reform bill conducted by the congressional Joint Committee on Taxation (JCT).

    By 2015, according to this analysis, the excise tax would slam 24 million households, growing to 39 million households by 2019. Nearly one-third of middle-class households making between $50,000 and $100,000 would be affected by 2019.
    AFL-CIO NOW BLOG | Proposed Health Care ‘Excise Tax’ a Tax on the Middle Class

    I think its more likely that you just don't know how much other people's insurance actually costs (not what they're paying).
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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    Re: Deal Reached on Taxing 'Cadillac' Plans

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    Was listening to some radio show host last night saying 2 neighbors may have the same health care plan, but the non-union person gets to pay 40% tax and maybe cannot afford that additional tax so then must look for a different plan or go to a government funded plan. This is quite disturbing but no unexpected at all... the Democrats get their bread buttered by the unions so, it was expected.

    So now we have unions and Nebraska getting free healthcare. Wonder what a union member IN Nebraska gets?
    highly doubtful.

    For the Record: Just what is the average cost of health care insurance? - General News

    Originally Posted by johnny_rebson:

    These are the same liberals who forgot how Iraq attacked us on 9/11.


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    Re: Deal Reached on Taxing 'Cadillac' Plans

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    You think they're raising $150b from "CEO types?"

    Why don't you try listening to your own unions?



    AFL-CIO NOW BLOG | Proposed Health Care ‘Excise Tax’ a Tax on the Middle Class

    I think its more likely that you just don't know how much other people's insurance actually costs (not what they're paying).
    which is why the 200k limit.

    and yes, i do know what insurance costs.

    For the Record: Just what is the average cost of health care insurance? - General News

    Originally Posted by johnny_rebson:

    These are the same liberals who forgot how Iraq attacked us on 9/11.


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    Re: Deal Reached on Taxing 'Cadillac' Plans

    Quote Originally Posted by liblady View Post
    which is why the 200k limit.
    Which brings us back to the point I made 10 posts ago. If you exclude all of those people from paying, then this tax won't raise the $150b it is supposed to raise for health care.

    No, you know the average cost of insurance. That is not the same as knowing how many people this will affect. As was shown above, the proposed tax would have hit 40% of insurance plans by 2019. That's not all "CEO types."
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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    Re: Deal Reached on Taxing 'Cadillac' Plans

    Sorry I missed it.... what's highly doubtful? A 40% tax on non-union members healthcare?
    “I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on what’s being proposed here, he’d agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute.” - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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    Re: Deal Reached on Taxing 'Cadillac' Plans

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    Sorry I missed it.... what's highly doubtful? A 40% tax on non-union members healthcare?
    Hullo - Liblady? Can you do a follow up because I didn't understand how the link you provided was germane to my comment about a 40% tax on the Caddilac Health Care plans of the Unions (or lack thereof as it stands now).
    “I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on what’s being proposed here, he’d agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute.” - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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    Re: Deal Reached on Taxing 'Cadillac' Plans

    Quote Originally Posted by liblady View Post
    um.....this is not the plan. the plan is to tax the insurance benefit provided by an employer if the value is over 24k for a family. YOU won't be taxed for what YOU buy.

    or do i have it wrong?
    If the employer is taxed it will be passed on to the employees...... so yes,YOU will end up paying.

  9. #19
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    Re: Deal Reached on Taxing 'Cadillac' Plans

    The main idea of the excise tax is to prevent over spending by employers offering health insurance to their employees. Especially since employers will be recieving tax breaks and subsidies for offering health insurance.

    It is also meant to slow the growth of premiums since people will be more likely to buy the plan without the 40% tax on it. This will actually help lower the effect of rising health care costs on wages.

    The fact that some people ought to be exempt for longer actually makes sense to me. For example, a firefighter may actually need a cadillac plan, and not be over spending. Labor Unions and government employees also have large amounts of benefits, meaning they will be more directly affected than people who do not. Thats why these people should have more time, so they can have time to renegotiate with their employers, which is the whole point of the excise tax to begin with.

    Personally I think they should change the limit though, or at least how they find the limit. Just as RightinNYC showed, the limit would be hitting 40% of people by 2019. Instead I think they should base it on region, insead of this one size fits all limit. Surely health care costs will rise faster in some areas than others.

    The projected $150 billion could only really affect 15 million plans ($10000 a plan, conservitivly 40% of 24000), so yes they could negotiate negotiate the limits and still bring in enough revenue.

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    Re: Deal Reached on Taxing 'Cadillac' Plans

    Quote Originally Posted by drz-400 View Post
    The fact that some people ought to be exempt for longer actually makes sense to me. For example, a firefighter may actually need a cadillac plan, and not be over spending. Labor Unions and government employees also have large amounts of benefits, meaning they will be more directly affected than people who do not. Thats why these people should have more time, so they can have time to renegotiate with their employers, which is the whole point of the excise tax to begin with.
    Why would a firefighter have any greater need for a highly expensive health care plan than a private sector employee doing a similarly dangerous job? While there are some union employees who are at risk like firefighters, the vast majority are not in fields that require overly expensive health care plans.

    Furthermore, even if we accept that collective bargaining will slow down the process by which employers adjust health care plans for their workers, there is absolutely no reason to hold off on taxing unions for a decade, other than to give them a handout.


    The projected $150 billion could only really affect 15 million plans ($10000 a plan, conservitivly 40% of 24000), so yes they could negotiate negotiate the limits and still bring in enough revenue.
    The excise tax only hits the portion of the plan above the limit, so a plan that costs $24,000 would result in no tax, while a plan that costs $25,000 would result in a $400 tax. In order to raise $150 billion (which is a pipe dream), it would have to hit a lot more than 15 million plans.
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