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Thread: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

  1. #321
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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Toothpicvic View Post
    Why's this guy so interested in what goes on in gay bedrooms. Kinda creepy
    Did you read what I wrote or are you just plain stupid my left wing friend.......Sorry CC I had to.......
    Last edited by Navy Pride; 01-08-10 at 02:40 AM.
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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by ptif219 View Post
    Seems the states are doing a good job so far
    Just like interracial marriage, this will likely be determined in the Supreme Court. And just like interracial marriage, it will become a non issue in a few decades.

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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Just like interracial marriage, this will likely be determined in the Supreme Court. And just like interracial marriage, it will become a non issue in a few decades.
    Automated Response : NUH UH! - The fact that we're only getting slim majorities on issues that were unspeakable 30 years ago & the fact that gays now have more rights and benefits than they could have dreamed of 20 years ago and the fact that interracial marriage set a precedent to who dictated the guidelines for marriage does not mean that this issue is close to the end. We're winning! We're winning! Can't you see? State by state we're giving gays every privilege and right we afford straight couples but we're winning! WINNING I TELL YOU WINNING!
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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    [B]

    There are reports that claim just the opposite and there are sworn testimonials from gay people who have changed.............I am not going to call them a liar.............
    The reports that claim the opposite that I have seen have major methodological flaws and are not credible. Folks who claim they have changed are a different matter and a different discussion. We would first have to discuss the difference between sexual orientation and sexual behavior.
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    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

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    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Automated Response : NUH UH! - The fact that we're only getting slim majorities on issues that were unspeakable 30 years ago & the fact that gays now have more rights and benefits than they could have dreamed of 20 years ago and the fact that interracial marriage set a precedent to who dictated the guidelines for marriage does not mean that this issue is close to the end. We're winning! We're winning! Can't you see? State by state we're giving gays every privilege and right we afford straight couples but we're winning! WINNING I TELL YOU WINNING!
    You are winning in the long term. However there are some notable losses.

    -California
    -Maine
    -New York
    -New Jersey

    The score is 31-0 when it comes to state voter initiatives for same sex marriage. Four of the most liberal states in the union just voted either by voter initiative or by legislature against same sex marriage.

    The reality is that the trend for same sex marriage has halted in the United States. There is not a state save Massachusetts where same sex marriage could win as a voter initiative simply because half the country still sees homosexuality as immoral.

    That is why the Supreme Court will probably end up deciding this. Going state by state is no longer a winning strategy for gay rights advocates.

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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    You are winning in the long term. However there are some notable losses.

    -California
    -Maine
    -New York
    -New Jersey

    The score is 31-0 when it comes to state voter initiatives for same sex marriage. Four of the most liberal states in the union just voted either by voter initiative or by legislature against same sex marriage.

    The reality is that the trend for same sex marriage has halted in the United States. There is not a state save Massachusetts where same sex marriage could win as a voter initiative simply because half the country still sees homosexuality as immoral.

    That is why the Supreme Court will probably end up deciding this. Going state by state is no longer a winning strategy for gay rights advocates.
    What you do not note is that the number who find homosexuality is declining steadily, and the number who find is morally acceptable are rising even faster. Source: Americans Evenly Divided on Morality of Homosexuality

    2001: 40 % acceptable, 53 % morally wrong
    2008: 48 % for both.

    I suspect that this trend will continue and possibly accelerate. SCOTUS might decide it before the numbers change enough to make it so it passes voter initiatives, but it is not needed. It will within the next few years start passing based on voter initiatives.
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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    What you do not note is that the number who find homosexuality is declining steadily, and the number who find is morally acceptable are rising even faster. Source: Americans Evenly Divided on Morality of Homosexuality

    2001: 40 % acceptable, 53 % morally wrong
    2008: 48 % for both.

    I suspect that this trend will continue and possibly accelerate. SCOTUS might decide it before the numbers change enough to make it so it passes voter initiatives, but it is not needed. It will within the next few years start passing based on voter initiatives.
    I guess we can only wait and see.

    If California reverses Prop 8 in 2012, then you might have a case.

  8. #328
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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Truthfully, to me this is irrelevant. NJ already has civil unions which affords gay couples rights for adoptions, benefits, and other things that married couples have. Though my overall position is that the term "marriage" should be used only for religious purposes and all governmental unions should be "civil unions"... gay or straight, the way that NJ handles it currently, is fine by me. I'm not sure why this is a big deal.
    I didn't read the entire thread so if this has been answered please forgive me.

    The difference between civil unions and marriages is that the federal government does not recognize civil unions of gays.
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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by ptif219 View Post
    What does the definition say? Is it so hard to admit that is what it means?
    IMO the definition doesn't matter so much as realizing that what is considered "normal" (or abnormal) is a bit of a value judgement. Very often, to say something is "normal" is to say it's ok/acceptable - which is what I think you were getting at with your original point?

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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    I guess we can only wait and see.

    If California reverses Prop 8 in 2012, then you might have a case.
    Where does 2012 come from? Why not 2015?
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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